[hornetd]

The workspace requirement in 110.26 doesn't allow any equipment foreign to the electrical installation to be in the workspace, (30" in width, 36" in depth, up to a point of 6' above the panel, or a permanent ceiling if less than 6')

Although you have quoted that rule accurately it can be a little misleading. The space that is reserved to the electrical system is only the space that is directly above and below the panel cabinet. All of that reserved space is inside the wall in this case. If you took this rule to an idiotic extreme you could not install a flush panel because the wall sheathing is foreign to the electrical installation. We would all have to have the carpenters build in a floor to ceiling door that is at least the width of the panel and then mount the panel cabinet back behind the inner plain of the wall finish. Although that might make later changes or additions easier even the inspectors know that is not the intent of the code.

As to the working space it is not required to be centered on the panel. It can be offset to either side as long as it covers the whole front of the panel cabinet.

Tom Horne

 

[zanydroid]

NEC 800.24 Communications Circuits "Mechanical Execution of Work" directs users to follow 300.11
300.11 Securing and Supporting.
(A) Secured in Place. Raceways, cable assemblies, boxes, cabinets,and fittings shall be securely fastened in place

Do they have identical support rules to romex though? Or just the workman like discretion?

 

[betelgeuse]

Do they have identical support rules to romex though? Or just the workman like discretion?

No, It it applies only to Communication Circuits. Cat5e is communications wire.

 

[betelgeuse]

But you said>>

I don’t think there are any support rules per NEC. NEC just cares that you use the right cable rating for your in wall installation. Usually CL2 is enough for residential.

 

[betelgeuse]

Or just the workman like discretion

There's nothing discretionary about it. It's mandatory, references specific NEC rules (that use shall) and doesn't have the wiggle room that 110.12 has.
110.12 has informational note below directing to another document, but informational notes are not enforceable

 

[zanydroid]

But you said>>

I appreciate the correction.

There's nothing discretionary about it. It's mandatory, references specific NEC rules (that use shall) and doesn't have the wiggle room that 110.12 has.
110.12 has informational note below directing to another document, but informational notes are not enforceable

What I meant was the definition of workmanlike has wiggle room in it.

Regarding my note about Romex. I'm looking at the pictures here and I don't think the supporting methods for cable bundles here would be allowed for Romex. I asked that because I wasn't sure if it had the same, EG, running boards requirement as Romex when installed on framing.

Securing and Supporting Cables and Raceways Part One | JADE Learning

The 2014 NEC is clear about how cables and raceways must be supported. The general rule in 300.11(A) is that raceways, cable assemblies, boxes, cabinets and fittings shall be securely fastened in place. Cables cannot be used as a means of support for other cables, raceways, or nonelectrical...

www.jadelearning.com

I'm looking at the 800.24 text now and it looks more permissive than for Romex, and the text is not that similar overall.

 

[Tom153]

The pipe outside is the service into the meter. It is not the circuit wires from the panel. They will be in the wall above the panel, maybe some down from the panel.
Best if you can get out of the stud space the panel is in.

I would decide where I want it then cut out the inside sheetrock, being careful to only let the knife cut shallow enough to cut only the sheet rock. Then you can see all the circuit wires and probably move them out of the way of any hole you drill thru your exterior sheathing. If you change your mind about location, you can easily repair the sheet rock. If it's in a closet, utility room or garage, I'd probably just put a cheap access panel instead of repairing the sheet rock. Then I'd have access to that area for anything else; like maybe a cable splitter.

 

[DallasCowboys]

When they install the fiber optic cable to your router, will it run through the router on more fiber optic wiring or will it go through cat5 etc. wiring?

What will be your download speed once it is installed?
Will it be much more $ than a standard installation?

 

[RickRick]

When they install the fiber optic cable to your router, will it run through the router on more fiber optic wiring or will it go through cat5 etc. wiring?

What will be your download speed once it is installed?
Will it be much more $ than a standard installation?

I think it’s fiber to the house, where something called an ONT translates the signal so it can go over copper. Then it goes via cat5 to the router, which in this case is a Netgear Orbi.

Wired to the Orbi, it’s supposed to be 1Gb per second up and down. The Orbi’s wireless speed is . . . Not sure but supposedly it can handle the fiber speed.

Im not certain how much the company will do and how much I’ll have to do.

 

[zanydroid]

I think it’s fiber to the house, where something called an ONT translates the signal so it can go over copper. Then it goes via cat5 to the router, which in this case is a Netgear Orbi.

Wired to the Orbi, it’s supposed to be 1Gb per second up and down. The Orbi’s wireless speed is . . . Not sure but supposedly it can handle the fiber speed.

Im not certain how much the company will do and how much I’ll have to do.

You want at least Cat5e for assured gigabit performance. Stupidly big box stores still stock cat5 terminations and wire.

For my AT&T fiber they were responsibly for getting fiber just into the house, to land at an ONT that they provided (it’s their equipment). When I activated the fiber (previous owner used Comcast instead of fiber for some crazy reason).

If the Orbi has two 5Ghz radios in it then it can saturate the fiber in one direction, which is good enough for most people. In my testing with Wifi5 500mbps is about what to expect with reasonable distance to the AP (EG 1 or 2 interior wall/rooms in the way). You would need hardwired APs to saturate in both directions reliably.

Also something not talked about much is that the processors in routers aren’t necessarily up to saturating a fiber link. So if you are planning on paying for some of the higher speeds like 600/600 or 1000/1000 it is worth looking into whether your router can do it, and upgrading as needed before paying for the higher subscription cost.

I use the MikroTik hap AC2 as a router to hit 600/600. It also has an AP in it but I only use it as an emergency backup.

 

[zanydroid]

My guess is the installer tech will look for a place with receptacle close by that is easy for them to install into, and then push to do it there. And it behooves you to have some ideas beforehand that you can use to push back (IE what you are getting from this thread).

 

[RAL238]

There is no technical reason the ONT needs to be immediately inside the house, opposite the company's junction box on the outside. The company may want to minimize the distance they run fiber on the inside, but that's something you can discuss with the installer. Some installers will leave you a coil of fiber so you can run it to where you want it yourself.

Frontier brought their fiber overhead from the street up to the junction box on the outside of our house, There, they made a junction to a lighter duty fiber which they brought into the house and ran 30' to a utility closet where we located the ONT. It was fairly easy to do that, since the fiber was able to run through the crawl space under the house.

Have you checked into what your company provides in the way of battery backup power for the ONT? Many provide no backup at all and offer it as an extra cost option. Some of the battery backup units today run on non-rechargeble D-cells and provide only a couple of hours of backup at best. And unless you keep an eye on the battery health, they'll be dead when you need them.

 

[zanydroid]

For my setup, the ONT plugs into the same UPS as some other sensitive electronics I have in the same location. EG home automation, router, etc. This UPS is anyway needed for any critical devices that need the same uptime as the ONT…

 

[RickRick]

Well, this ended up being a totally non-issue. The fiber installer did actually bring the wire under the crawlspace and up into a wall where the pre-existing internet cable runs. The installer did way more than I thought he would.

Oh, and the fiber wire they use inside the house is also rated to be outside, so even though the fiber comes up to the house exterior right behind where the electrical panel is located, the installer was easily able to route the wire along the profile of the siding till it could enter a hole in the foundation that'd been created when the house was built to allow the phone and internet (old cable) into the crawlspace.

 

[Matt1963]

Well, this ended up being a totally non-issue. The fiber installer did actually bring the wire under the crawlspace and up into a wall where the pre-existing internet cable runs. The installer did way more than I thought he would.

Oh, and the fiber wire they use inside the house is also rated to be outside, so even though the fiber comes up to the house exterior right behind where the electrical panel is located, the installer was easily able to route the wire along the profile of the siding till it could enter a hole in the foundation that'd been created when the house was built to allow the phone and internet (old cable) into the crawlspace.

Funny, I'm waiting for the CenturyLink guy this morning and hope he will be accommodating. Cable is easier with my setup so we will see.

What area of the country are you in...

I'm is Seattle.

 

[seharper]

Take an old work electrical box, mark and cut it out below the panel, taking care to only push the keyhole saw in enough to penetrate the sheetrock, giving you a visual indication on what is in the wall.

Well, a lot of panels have an Electrician's Outlet right next to the panel. That's so the electrician can turn off every circuit except that one, and power lights and tools off that one outlet. So you could use that opening you just made (to get visibility into the wall) to also mount a junction box for an electrician's outlet.

The router needs a low voltage power supply, and a receptacle to power it. The cord isn't allowed to penetrate the wall.

And you could plug it into the electrician's outlet.

The workspace requirement in 110.26 doesn't allow any equipment foreign to the electrical installation to be in the workspace, (30" in width, 36" in depth, up to a point of 6' above the panel, or a permanent ceiling if less than 6')

That's true. The working space must be 30" wide (including the full width of the panel but not necessarily centered on it). It must also be 6'6" (78") tall not 6'0" tall. Nothing can be in that zone permanently or temporarily,