Either run a new cable or use junction boxes. They make splices/tap kits for repairs on new romex that will work with no slack but I'm not sure what your "black" wire is without seeing it. Some older romex is black. If its 12 gauge and you're splicing it to 12 gauge you will have no problems unless it is aluminum. Then you would need special connectors to go from aluminum to copper (purple wire nuts, or alumicons).

The NM splice/tap kits look hokey to me and I have never used them but they are listed and approved for any non new construction. But you would have to know what that old cable is.

I would prefer a new cable or junction boxes. Junction boxes need to be accessible and not covered up with drywall etc. This is a reason I do not like the NM splice kits as they are buried in the wall. I still don't see how they got approved in the first place.

NM cable splice/tap kit that adds a tap to NM cable(romex is a brand).

splice kit only
https://smile.amazon.com/TE-Connect.../dp/B0035LKG6Y/ref=sr_1_4?dchild=1&keywords=nm+splice+kit&qid=1595488532&sr=8-4

splice/tap kit.
https://www.gordonelectricsupply.co...RD5ARIsADwJQ1-b_WrSjmEEUosTeW8s3KGlh5wDL0EqzQRpBBB88DFSiv-E6h7x_DYaAuqlEALw_wcB

https://www.amazon.com/TE-Connectivity-CPGI-1116415-2-Non-Metallic-Splice/dp/B000VHF1B0

 

NM cable splice/tap kit that adds a tap to NM cable(romex is a brand).

splice kit only
https://smile.amazon.com/TE-Connect.../dp/B0035LKG6Y/ref=sr_1_4?dchild=1&keywords=nm+splice+kit&qid=1595488532&sr=8-4

splice/tap kit.
https://www.gordonelectricsupply.co...RD5ARIsADwJQ1-b_WrSjmEEUosTeW8s3KGlh5wDL0EqzQRpBBB88DFSiv-E6h7x_DYaAuqlEALw_wcB

https://www.amazon.com/TE-Connectivity-CPGI-1116415-2-Non-Metallic-Splice/dp/B000VHF1B0

I never knew such things existed, thanks!!

So, if I'm to believe Amazon, these are approved per NEC to be hidden inside a wall, no exposed junction box needed.

I have one project coming up where these will be lifesavers... if true.

Am I missing something?

 

A new run is preferred. Any junction boxes you use will need to remain accessible, so we're looking at "ugly". Why not just install another receptacle below where the cable comes down and then run a new cable to the new location?

 

Why not just install another receptacle below where the cable comes down and then run a new cable to the new location?

That's an idea also that would work, but I don't need another receptacle on the ceiling of my basement.

I would prefer a new cable or junction boxes. Junction boxes need to be accessible and not covered up with drywall etc.

It's really hard to get new cable into the existing old metal boxes for the receptacles that are upstairs, so I think I'm going to lean into junction boxes and try to make the boxes outside of the new finished space for aesthetics (I think I'll have enough cable if I cut in the right location). They will be accessible as I'm not finishing the ceiling, just planning on painting it black.

This is a reason I do not like the NM splice kits as they are buried in the wall. I still don't see how they got approved in the first place.

I'd be ok using these kits since it's accessible, but I remember looking into detail of these kits, and at least one of them listed as only approved for using "new" NM wire (something like >1990). I know for sure that my wire is older than that, so I don't want to do anything not to spec.

 

Your black wire probably doesn't have a ground. I suggest replacing it entirely rather that fooling around with junction boxes. Maybe cut the existing wire, attach the new wire to each end, and pull the existing wire through the existing boxes until the new wire enters?

 

You're correct - it does not have ground. Yeah, I could try that... that's a good idea if I can loosen the nut holding the wire from the inside of the metal box. However, if I go through this effort and attach it to the receptacle upstairs, I'll still be connecting to a non-grounded circuit so not sure if the payoff is worth it since I'd now have new NM 12/2 coming from a hole upstairs that at first glance would look like it's grounded but actually not.

 

True. That might be considered bad practice.


On the other hand, if you ever have to ground the circuit, you've already done some of the work. Additionally, you could run a separate ground wire from where the new wire starts back to the panel -- I believe as long as it more or less follows the same path as the old wire back to the panel that it is acceptable practice to have a separate ground wire. (To the professional electricians on here: please correct me if I'm wrong!) Then you would have two properly grounded outlets as well.


I'm not trying to make more work for you, but in my opinion anytime you are messing with electrical stuff and have a chance to upgrade it to modern standards, you should do it if possible.

 

OP your original plan is fine.

If you're going to mount the boxes in the ceiling, use a 4x4 steel box.

If they ever decide to drywall the ceiling, they can reposition the steel box and add an "octagon box style" mud ring to the box, so the mud ring winds up even with the drywall once it's finished. Then they can simply put a blank cover plate over it. Or if lights were desired, the lighting wires could be added to those boxes; plenty of room in a 4x4 box with a mud ring!

As far as protecting the ungrounded old run, use GFCI to provide human safety to the ungrounded outlets, and use AFCI to protect the old wire runs.

 

I think I may have been looking at the pictures incorrectly. Were you describing a ceiling or a wall? Seems like most of the talk is about ceiling junction boxes, and I was mentioning additional receptacles as if it were a wall. Sorry for the confusion.

 

I'm having some work done soon in my basement to build a new wall, and there is some wiring that is getting in the way that doesn't have any slack. I want to re-position the wires to run parallel to my joists.

I imagine the best way is to re-run a new line from outlet to outlet, but this would be very difficult to access.

Questions:

1. Is the next best way to cut the line in the middle and add two junction boxes with new wire in the middle? NOTE: The ceiling joists will always be exposed - not going to cover it up with drywall or anything, so the junction boxes will be accessible.

2. One of the wires is old 12ga in black sheathing that doesn't have any labelling on it. Is there any issue with splicing this with new 12/2 romex?

Please see my attachment for a visual of what I'm talking about.

Thanks in advance!

Extend the wires within the box with Ideal Splice line push- in wire connectors #30-1342S the wire as usual.

 

....then wire as usual.

 

This post is almost 2 years old. I would hope the OP solved this issue already.