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4" Pancake Electrical Box FiIll Question

4.3K views 11 replies 7 participants last post by  average_male  
#1 · (Edited)
Hello,

I have an external light that doesn't have a photocell so for my project I would like to add one to it. This photocell will work in conjunction with a magnetic switch sensor connected to my overhead garage door. The idea is that when the photocell determines it is dark enough and the garage door sensor is tripped when the garage door is opened, the lights will go on. So the illustration (just shows part of the components involved so it would make the idea of my question a little more clearer, I hope) notes one light but there will be two lights in my scheme. The reason I am want to wire it this way is to avoid having a separate external eye-sore box just for the photocell. I have read electrical code 314.16 regarding box fill, but one needs to be a lawyer to understand any of that.... and was hoping for some good news regarding wire thicknesses of the light and PC along with allowances for the lantern's canopy--which is pretty generous, roughly 9"(h) x 6" (w) x 1.5" deep. So my question is in regards to the 4" pancake noted below. A more detail discussion about my project can be found here

651591


Thanks,
Moe
 
#2 ·
The intended practical application for the pancake box is for a dead-end run i.e. one supply cable, a single device, with a basic splice.

Its been too many years since I did a proper box fill calc. (Don't work resi so don't need to). I would replace it with a standard-depth box or add an extension ring.
 
#4 ·
Pancake can handle 3 #14's plus the fixture wiring. It will be tight. Feeding out of that box to another one is out of the question.

I believe your wiring diagram is wrong. Black feeds the photo cell, red feeds the light.
Neutral is correct. (nice job on the drawing)
 
#5 · (Edited)
Red from the PC will feed the black wire of magnetic sensor for garage door, and that magnetic sensor's red wire will eventually feed the black of the lights. See link to noted project in the original post for more details on that (found here: Wiring Configuration and Wire Color Question - Diagram...), my question is isolated to the pancake which seems it is a no go.
 
#8 ·
The guy from that link was clearly following the Hillbilly Electrical Code.

No, you can't do that. Loosy goosy individual wires like that, not inside a conduit, are Right Out. The guy is barking up the wrong tree anyway for how to mount that type of photocell. It has a 1/2" trade size pipe thread on it, to go into a 1/2" knockout on a junction box, or screw into one of those stalk lids specifically made for stalk lights with motion sensors.

Image


(You plug the extra holes with provided plugs).

Remember, the light sensor doesn't need to be anywhere near the lights themselves. It just needs to be in the same time zone :)
 
#9 ·
Thank you Seharper. i really like your sense of humor. I just wanted to reuse that raceway/box for the sensor and hide the PC. But seems you have again provided me with the ideal solution with that cover. I haven't seen one of those before and that seems like a great solution-simple and low profile.

One last question before I go that route....

Question: If I was to install an electrical box inside of the garage wall and mount one of these swivel mount photocells onto that box and just poke the stem through the wall, this too would be bad form, not to code and may even be a egress for water (although this will be installed high up under a hip roof over-hand.), right?

651620


Thanks agian,
Moe
 
#12 · (Edited)
OP you mentioned your light canopy was generous at 9" high by 1.5" deep, sounds like plenty of room for this style photocell, it is only 13/16' deep, why not just mount it in the canopy?


View attachment 651644
Hello Sparkmatic,

Thanks but the issue is with wiring within the pancake electrical box and room within the canopy to accommodate the PC is a not an issue using This photocell (which is similar to what you noted). Given what I read and was told, the pancake fill capacity will be exceeded if I wired that into the box, I was hoping there was some allowance to increase the pancake 6.0 cubic inches by also including the canopy of the light fixture (which has a lot of room). In order to do that, my light fixture needs to have the fill capacity noted (not sure if noted by manufacture stamp or by an electrical via some labeling as this is not stated clearly by the NEC code).