[TxJack]

Any thoughts on the Zip System sheathing? I viewed some of their videos and read through some of their comparisons, but would like some non-company views.

I've heard that it is about 30% more in cost in materials and labor over using standard sheathing and house wrap. Plus they said that your labor costs are even more because you have to tape all the joints and this can cost even more as you really have to make sure the taping is done precisely which involves taking more time.

 

[joecaption]

Ok so there's all the reasons not to use it. Did they come up with any reasons to use it?

 

[woodworkbykirk]

this topic has come up on another board. the guys who are using it swear by it now after using it on several houses. myself i like the idea of it but havent seen it in use as its still not available here

 

[Gary in WA]

What type of siding?

What type of wall insulation?

Gary

 

[abracaboom]

I'll take plywood and tyvek over glorified particle board any day.

 

[Arky217]

I used the Zip roofing panels (1/2") and the Zip wall panels on my house.
They worked out ok. My roof went 6 months with just the Zip panels before I put the felt and metal on and didn't leak a drop.

The tape is really good; the longer it is on, the tighter it sticks. It makes good window flashing also.

But don't waste your money on the tape dispenser. It's easier and more accurate to just stick the end and roll out about 6' at a time and hold it centered on the seam while you pull off the backing. But you do need a roller to press it down good.

The Zip system is especially suited to a one man show where it may be a long time before it's covered.

For the roofing panels, it's best to go with the 5/8", especially if you're going to shingle the roof as the 1/2" doesn't have as much nail holding ability. Even using screws, as I did on my standing seam metal roof, you'll hit a soft spot once in a while where the screw will strip out.

Even though the membrane is waterproof, I would recommend coating the edges of the panels with some kind of sealer.

I probably wouldn't have bought the panels except I got a pretty good price since I bought some old stock; $11.30 for the 8' roofing panels and $12.70 for the 9' wall panels.

Another advantage is that felt is not needed for neither the roof nor the walls, or so they say, but I did put put synthetic down on the roof. I guess that I just wanted an extra layer for backup. On the walls, however, I just put vinyl siding directly on the Zip sheathing.

Arky

 

[sixeightten]

We are using it on a house now. I have been wanting to try it for a couple of years. Not sure the cost difference to the GC, but for us the labor is less. Taping takes no time compared to messing with Tyvek, which also has to be taped.

 

[TxJack]

Ok so there's all the reasons not to use it. Did they come up with any reasons to use it?

No sir as the builder has never used it before.

 

[TxJack]

What type of siding?

What type of wall insulation?

Gary

Going back with a wood clapboard. Unfortunately Hardie doesn't make our siding style yet.

R13 blown-in insulation

 

[Gary in WA]

Thanks, a few points as I understand them:
1. Tape is not the best product for flashing/water sealing compared to drainage plane layers directing the water down and out for long-term holdout (no test results; on duration of their tape holding through the expanding/contracting of the OSB over the years; may be a mute point- time will tell);

2. The asphalt-paper facing on the panels is rated at 12-16 perms; call it 14 perms for average. If the OSB ever gets wet from a water leak or the indoor humidity is very high on a heating day (and drywall is not air-sealed properly) the diffusion of moisture through the wall would condense on the OSB (as normal), depending on the cavity insulation (cellulose is better at re-distributing moisture). Mute point- in a new house with a “blower-door” test to air-seal all unnoticed openings (even the sheathing/studs, plates joints). OSB with Tyvek (58 perms) housewrap takes about 13 days to dry compared to a housewrap of 14 perms takes about 45-50 days to dry. (Fig.15- pp.15) that’s a lot more time for mold growth-- Table 4, also notice above "Conclusions" the optimum perms for a wrap is 18-24 perms (prohibiting drying/allowing drying). http://www.energy.ca.gov/2007public...achment_14_Impact_of_Title_24_Residential.pdf Typar is 11.7 perms--- http://www.typar.com/pdfs/Typar_vs_Tyvek.pdf Of course, no OSB/plywood should be exposed to liquid water very long- it’s just that plywood handles it better, post #182, pp. #13: http://www.diychatroom.com/f9/wavy-roof-need-opinions-advice-130881/index13/
Just be very critical on installation of the flashing at doors/windows and the drainage plane- whichever system you go with.

3. A glued-on water resistive barrier (and tape) doesn't promote drying (of OSB or siding) as well as a “drain-able” housewrap or two layers of builders paper/felt does. Either would give you the (important) air space/moving air next to the wet OSB to promote drying. I recommend two layers of water resistive barrier, or create the air space with "stucco wrap" or a drainage housewrap. http://www.buildingscience.com/documents/insights/bsi-038-mind-the-gap-eh/?searchterm=foam%20board%20in%20walls Some housewraps (if you decide such) are not compatible with cedar siding as it leaks tannins = seal the sidings 4 sides (a good practice), and choose a WRB carefully, or add a "rain screen" wall system. No SPF next to OSB, but that’s another story. In a brick veneer or stucco system the AdvanTech replaces only the first layer of WRB; you still need another layer of H.W./paper/felt, per minimum Code. OSB also absorbs water/moisture through its edges (swelling/growing), as well as drying from those edges (unless covered with an impermeable tape). Per outdoor storage directions: “4. When high moisture conditions exist, cut banding on panel stacks to prevent edge damage.” From: https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&...VShQA1&sig=AHIEtbRQl8EH9Zfnj0ftZoxkKEMlmyCNhg

Gary

 

[Nailbags]

I'll take plywood and tyvek over glorified particle board any day.

Amen to that. What happens if the stuff gets wet or you have to cut a sheet? do you need to seal the edge? Sorry I love plywood!

 

[kwikfishron]

Tape is not the best product for flashing/water sealing compared to drainage plane layers directing the water down and out for long-term holdout

Which is why if it’s my dime on the line I won’t use it. It’s just to new for me to trust.

Why deviate from methods that I know work and cost less.

I can’t remember any time where tape was the solution to keep the water out.