[Ozarka88]

Doing some maintenance work and noticed all the outlets are up side down. Why is this? I've always just seen them with the ground prong pointing down.

 

[Phases]

I'm really curious about this I've seen it myself. I read once it was for ones controlled by light switches. Then I read it was because when the installer picked up the first one of the building he put it in that way.

I'm seeing them sideways these days too.

Am curious if there's anything meant to be meant by it..

 

[jbfan]

They're not upside down. There is not a code on which way the receptacles are to be mounted, but I agree, they are upside down!!:smile:

Some times they are mounted that way to denote switched outlets, or job specs require them to be mounted that way.

 

[Arrow3030]

There isn't a real reason for it. Some put a switched outlet upside down and all constant hots right side up. Some feel it's safer because they believe the ground is more likely to be the "first make, last break."

 

[dmxtothemax]

It's so the electric don't leak out all over the floor !

:vs_laugh:

 

[joecaption]

I install all mine that way.
So much easier to plug something in even in the dark.
Most plugs have a hump on the plug, why have to twist the cord to plug it in?

 

[dmxtothemax]

I have heard one possible explanation
thou I find it a bit far fetched !
If something was to fall onto the plug
and get in between the plug and recepticule
then it could cause a dangerous short,
so they put them the other way around to prevent this.

 

[ChiTownPro]

I install all mine that way.
So much easier to plug something in even in the dark.
Most plugs have a hump on the plug, why have to twist the cord to plug it in?

How often are you plugging stuff in while it's dark? It must be often enough to install all of your outlets this way.

It would drive my OCD nuts. Plus the screws have to go in the same direction as the device. Vertical device, vertical screw...

 

[Arrow3030]

I don't like 'em ground up because it looks like upside down faces. It's also why I don't like T-slots, I don't like my walls winking at me.

 

[joed]

I have at least one fridge that the cord would not hang proper with the plug that way. It would go up and then bend down.

 

[TheEplumber]

They're not upside down. There is not a code on which way the receptacles are to be mounted, but I agree, they are upside down!!:smile:

Some times they are mounted that way to denote switched outlets, or job specs require them to be mounted that way.

I remember an electrical contractor getting excited when he found one of his apprentices installing ground up. Turns out the apprentice just came from some medical job- there, the specs said ground up.
So the supt. runs off and reads his specs-- yep, ground up on his job too. Seems the apprentice was right- doesn't happen often...

 

[ddawg16]

Who wants to look at a sad face.....I like the happy face

 

[Tom738]

How often are you plugging stuff in while it's dark? It must be often enough to install all of your outlets this way.

It doesn't have to be often at all. If one choice offers a marginal safety increase once in the lifetime of a plug and the other doesn't, and there's no significant difference in terms of the install, the responsible choice is the one that's marginally safer.

 

[ChiTownPro]

I install all mine that way.
So much easier to plug something in even in the dark.
Most plugs have a hump on the plug, why have to twist the cord to plug it in?

It doesn't have to be often at all. If one choice offers a marginal safety increase once in the lifetime of a plug and the other doesn't, and there's no significant difference in terms of the install, the responsible choice is the one that's marginally safer.

Where did he mention safety? It sounded more of a convenience to me.

But I will bite, what marginal safety increase does it offer and where did you find your data to come to that conclusion?

And I will counter. If you found out that wearing a tin foil cap would protect you from a 1 in a million chance of getting brain cancer from your cell phone can I expect that you would be wearing the foil hat? It's a silly assertion when there is no measurable difference as well as no quantifiable standard. What would be considered marginal.

Plus there is something to be said about the safety in a consistent standard. I would wager that consistent orientation (up is the current norm) would be marginally safer than upside down (not the current norm). It would be the same reasoning as making steps a consistent height with in a set of stairs and having a universal max height 7 3/4".

 

[Olcrazy1]

Army house only the switched outlets are upside down. Actually been like that in my last 3 homes all 3 different builders so I assumed it was standard practice to easily identify the switched ones. Top one is switched bottom is always hot..... At least that's how's it is here.

 

[Tom738]

...
But I will bite, what marginal safety increase does it offer and where did you find your data to come to that conclusion?

And I will counter. If you found out that wearing a tin foil cap would protect you from a 1 in a million chance of getting brain cancer from your cell phone can I expect that you would be wearing the foil hat? It's a silly assertion when there is no measurable difference as well as no quantifiable standard. What would be considered marginal.

Plus there is something to be said about the safety in a consistent standard. I would wager that consistent orientation (up is the current norm) would be marginally safer than upside down (not the current norm). It would be the same reasoning as making steps a consistent height with in a set of stairs and having a universal max height 7 3/4".

Marginal safety increase comes from two places--easier for someone to plug in in the dark (and therefore less likely for them to be feeling around metal prongs they are sticking into hots, since they will orient off the top ground prong), and less likely to have anything fall into the top and shot from hot to neutral. Both unlikely events, both possible.

A Tin foil cap has a significant social cost and is a straw man. The point is you have two choices, both are as easy, one seems to have a slight safety advantage, at least based on reasoning--although if you have a study on it either way, I'm happy to listen. As to the magnitude the benefit has to have to be worth it, obviously that's a function of how hard it is to install the outlet upside-down instead of right-side up. We have lots of things that confer only a tiny safety advantage that we do when dealing with electric, but we still do them.

You're right, consistent orientation might have a safety advantage--again, we should do a study. But today we don't have consistent orientation, and LOTS of places have them both ways. But if we pick a new consistent orientation, safety might be best served by having it "upside-down."

 

[FrodoOne]

I have heard one possible explanation
thou I find it a bit far fetched !
If something was to fall onto the plug
and get in between the plug and recepticule
then it could cause a dangerous short,
so they put them the other way around to prevent this.

UK (British) and Chinese socket outlets are made/installed with the Earth pin uppermost, ostensibly for the reason given by dmxtothemax.

Since 1984, it has also been a requirement of (British Standard) BS 1363 that both the Line and Neutral pins be "insulated" at their base so that, if partly withdrawn, only the insulated section may be "contacted" while the conductive part is still in contact with the terminals of the socket outlet.
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_power_plugs_and_sockets:_British_and_related_types)

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AS/NZS_3112 where it is stated "The Chinese socket is normally mounted with the earth pin at the top. This is considered to offer some protection should a conductive object fall between the plug and the socket."

From 3 April 2005, "insulated" Line and Neutral pins, similar to that required by BS 1363, have been required for all plugs sold in Australia/New Zealand - where the Earth pin is now (virtually) always "downwards", in the same way in which it is "usually" so positioned in North America.

 

[jreagan]

My old house had "ground pins up" in the bedrooms but nowhere else. I have no idea on that logic (the house was 15 years old when I bought it). I wanted to plug in a watt meter / surge protector which assumed the ground pin was down. If I didn't rotate it, the display would point at the floor.

Then funny story... I decided to flip the receptacle without killing the power. I carefully unscrewed the yoke, slowly pulled out the receptacle grabbing the ears, and then stupidly grabbed both sides with my thumb and index finger to twist 180deg. Yikes! After the feeling came back in my hand in a few minutes, I walked down two flights of stairs and flipped the breaker.

 

[ChiTownPro]

Marginal safety increase comes from two places--easier for someone to plug in in the dark (and therefore less likely for them to be feeling around metal prongs they are sticking into hots, since they will orient off the top ground prong), and less likely to have anything fall into the top and shot from hot to neutral. Both unlikely events, both possible.

First you shouldn't be plugging something in while it's dark out. Second I fail to see how putting it up makes it safer than putting it down in this scenario. If I know the orientation, I know how to orient the ground and thus either direction provides the same risk.

What would fall on the top? I have never heard of a single instance of this occurring. Also not all cords have grounds. In fact most lamps do not, so you are only eliminating this possibility on a finite, minuscule, truly measurable unquantifiable circumstance.


A Tin foil cap has a significant social cost and is a straw man. The point is you have two choices, both are as easy, one seems to have a slight safety advantage, at least based on reasoning--although if you have a study on it either way, I'm happy to listen. As to the magnitude the benefit has to have to be worth it, obviously that's a function of how hard it is to install the outlet upside-down instead of right-side up. We have lots of things that confer only a tiny safety advantage that we do when dealing with electric, but we still do them.

You keep using words like marginal and tiny. Those are not terms that indicate true data. Of course it was a strawman. It was used to illustrate the fact that you wouldn't do something when the odds are astronomical. The odds are astronomical therefore nullifying any advantage. It would only be to satisfy an over exaggerated none issue. The odds are just not there to warrant any action that could be excused as a safety reason. It is purely a personal preference and offers no safety advantage, only a perceived one.

You're right, consistent orientation might have a safety advantage--again, we should do a study. But today we don't have consistent orientation, and LOTS of places have them both ways. But if we pick a new consistent orientation, safety might be best served by having it "upside-down."

Consistent is down, that's why someone asked the question. If it were 50/50 or close to it, there would be no discussion. I have never seen an upside down outlet, never. And when installed horizontal the ground is always oriented in the same direction through out the house. Consistency offers more safety advantage than any direction, which I would imagine has no measurable advantage, only perceived.

 

[ChiTownPro]

Simply put, the plugging things in the dark example is only preference and offers no advantage when the individual knows the orientation. It's also a none issue as you shouldn't be plugging anything into an outlet in the dark, no more than operating a table saw in the dark.

The second "scenario" of foreign objects falling and landing on the H and N as you are making contact is a non-factor due to the odds of this occurrence ever happening. Factors must have credible odds and impact. I don't buy flood insurance in the desert. Does it ever flood in the desert, sure, but not often enough to warrant any precautions. Are their earthquakes in IL? Sure! But I am not going to advocate using earthquake brackets in framing a house. The odds of it happening are not enough to impact behavior.