[handy man88]

Plan on replacing two zones. Sales guy recommended one system from each brand.

Carrier Infinity 58CVA090 (80% Furnace)

or

Trane XL 16

The Trane has the aluminum tubing and costs about $1000 less for two zones after factoring in rebates. In lieu of rebates, Trane will offer 3 years with 0% interest financing.

What would you do?

 

[roughneck]

https://www.angieslist.com/articles/difference-between-best-hvac-brands.htm

http://efficientcomfort.net/documents/Understanding_HVAC_System_Design_Issues.pdf

http://efficientcomfort.net/documents/Sizing_&_Selecting_for_Proper_Humidity_Control.pdf

http://efficientcomfort.net/documents/Bigger_is_Not_Better-Sizing_Air_Conditioners_Properly.pdf

 

[user_12345a]

Decide whether you want a heatpump, furnace or both.

Furnace is a totally different product. With the heatpump you need a second source of heat but it can save a lot compared to oil, propane and straight electric alone.

Heatpump isn't competitive with natural gas now unless you have very low electricity rate.

 

[handy man88]

Decide whether you want a heatpump, furnace or both.

Furnace is a totally different product. With the heatpump you need a second source of heat but it can save a lot compared to oil, propane and straight electric alone.

Heatpump isn't competitive with natural gas now unless you have very low electricity rate.

I currently have two furnaces and will keep this approach.

 

[user_12345a]

Ask for a quote on a trane furnace in that case.

What kind of climate are you in? Where are the furnaces located?

There's no excuse for getting 80% furnace unless...

1. The spaces where the furnaces are drops below freezing

2. Furnace in drywall ceiling finished basement

3. Mild heating season, doesn't drop below freezing much.

You were quoted a high end furnace 80% furnace. The money is better spent on 95% afue than a variable speed blower or multi-stage heat.

 

[supers05]

I'm surprised that the Trane comes in cheaper.

Anyways, it's about the install, not the brand. They are all similar. Go with the manufacturer that has local parts readily available and whichever your favorite tech likes more.

There's a lot more about sizing and proper installation. I'm sure user will go on about it.

Cheers!

 

[handy man88]

I'm surprised that the Trane comes in cheaper.

Anyways, it's about the install, not the brand. They are all similar. Go with the manufacturer that has local parts readily available and whichever your favorite tech likes more.

There's a lot more about sizing and proper installation. I'm sure user will go on about it.

Thread: Trane vs. Carrier Reply to Thread
Cheers!

Apparently the techs like Carrier better due to ease of service. I live in the midatlantic area and not really interested in a 90% efficient unit due to the cost to install the pvc pipe, etc.

My main zone covers first floor and basement and is located in the basement. My 2nd zone is in the attic and covers the 2nd floor.

 

[user_12345a]

Decide if u want single stage, two stage, modulating, ecm or psc motor.

For anything other than single stage you need a two stage thermostat.

I suggest getting a price for a 90% 're vs 80 and checking the roi and payback based on gas savings. total lifestyle cost of the 90%+ may be lower than the 80.

could be higher in your case.

 

[roughneck]

Did the salesman do a load calculation to see what size furnace you need? Most homes suffer from oversized equipment and undersized duct.
Read and understand the links I posted above. It's not all about the name on the box. Not all installs are equal. Bigger isn't better.

 

[supers05]

I'm assuming that they are going to reuse the existing venting? Did they inspect it? Replacing the existing (b-vent or chimney liner whichever you have) could be costly. System636 venting would last a significant time. It doesn't rust.

There are a few people on here with very old units still running because they live in fairly warm climates. Everything is relative to where you live.

I too looks carriers over Trane. It's mostly because i like carrier's parts desk more then Trane's. I personally would quote a York, but that's only because we work on their commercial stuff all the time, so we get good deals. I would install all 3 in my house.

Personally I have a 2 stage, ecm furnace. Modulating is expensive and your roi wouldn't exist for a warm climate. It gives more comfort though. I'll look up the model numbers tonight and see if their are any major differences. M/n of the new heat Pump outdoor units would help too

Cheers!

 

[yuri]

Trane makes very good furnaces but in my area the parts are a lot more expensive than Carrier and everyone else. However they seem to need less of them.

I dislike their ACs ( so do other techs) as they have a spine fin outdoor coil which looks like Xmas tree garland and plugs with lint and fluff from Cottonwood trees etc VERY easy and is HARD to keep clean.

I would go with Carrier as they are easy to get circuit boards and parts for 20 yrs later and they stay with the same series of board and not require a lot of retrofits like other brands.

 

[Piedmont]

I like to watch service techs doing HVAC stuff on youtube. As of late, there seems to be techs/sales who've decided it's no longer worth selling them or if they get a call and it's a Trane they're like... "Oh boy here we go... we have to work on a Trane.".

Watch this HVAC tech talking about Trane, I like this guy

 

[yuri]

Yeah it definitly is a Corporate dog eat dog money grubbing world out there.

Trane used to be the Maytag quality along with older Lennox and Bryant ( owned by Carrier now) units but that has all changed.

Ing Rand is a huge company that makes huge air compresors etc and probably wanted Trane for the lucrative huge centrifugal chiller market. Trane makes some of the best chillers. But it looks like they got stuck with the resi part.

Rheem makes a good meat and potatoes line of units and if it was for myself I would buy a Rheem and match it to a ADP coil. Never ever had a problem with a ADP coil.

As far as leak pinpointing the only way to know would be to use leak detector soap and like he said it is impossible to soap a coil around back.

Maybe if train gets enough bad publicity they may change but I doubt it. The CEO`s are so far removed from reality they don`t even know what planet they are on IMO.:biggrin2::devil3:

 

[user_12345a]

They probably don't walk through their own factories.

 

[handy man88]

So Trane is upselling the fact that they use aluminum heat exchangers that are crimped, vice welded, so no cracked weld issues.

Also, their outdoor coils are aluminum and their electronics are refrigerant cooled.

What do people think?

 

[user_12345a]

Most heat exchangers are made like that, nothing special, cheap. the crimp rings can pop if the exchanger is overheated or the design/manufacturing process is bad.

Stainless steel is the best material for heat exchangers.

Tubular doesn't have the crimp rings to pop, in fact stainless tube is probably probably the best heat exchanger u can get. (aluminized steel tube is a different story, may not hold up well)

Amana makes them, rheem used to.

No one welds their heat exchangers any more.

ignore the marketing.

 

[supers05]

York heat exchangers are all Stainless Steel for the higher end stuff. (they are pushing their low end stuff into their econo brands.) Even the RTUs have SS heat tube heat exchangers as a cheap addon option. (I haven't bought a carrier recently, but I think they are very similar)

Everyone is going to aluminum micro channel for the outdoor coils. Especially on the small stuff.

Only the big VFDs really require any type of active cooling. Anything else is either inefficient or marketing. Trane refrigerant cools there big VFDs. Everyone else uses a separate glycol loop with a a rad, so that even if the cooling isn't working right, they don't take anything else out. (I'm talking hundred+ ton air cooled chillers now though. The biggest VRF packages that I've seen don't use it either)

Cheers!

 

[user_12345a]

Ultimately it's all the same stuff with some differences. brand don't matter much.

I know is used to be that you could get any equipment from a name brand and it would last a good 25 to 30+ years, few breakdowns, refrigerant leaks rare.

Now you get the diminishing returns of "progress" - nicer controls but otherwise it's disposable junk, the new innovative designs (like micro-channel coil) just creating problems.

 

[beenthere]

If thats a coil for an air handler. Carrier, ICP, 2 ton air handler coild are well over 800 bucks.

 

[handy man88]

So I went with Carrier Infinity for two zones.

Question about my attic unit that cools/heats 2nd floor of my house.

I have the away setting during the day when no one is really on the 2nd floor. The set temperature is at 83F until 7pm when it's set to drop to 78F.

The problem is that during the day when the temperature is set at 83F, the AC still runs and keeps the temperature around 79F.

I spoke to my installer and talked about Infinity Smart/Intelligent Recovery, where the AC runs such that at 7pm, there's no huge power draw to immediately cool to 79F.

Any idea what's going on?