[Bird Doo Head]

Hi All!
I hope this note finds everyone well & enjoying today!


In one of our bungalow bedrooms, please picture a room with a sloped ceiling, leading to knee walls. The center is flat for about a foot.


The ceiling has drywall that is attached to the rafters. The joint between the flat part (attached to rafter ties) and the part that slopes to the knee walls has a large radius.


We (we?) would like to change it to crisp corners. However, my ability to free-hand make 2 perfectly straight joints with edges perfectly parallel has dim prospects. Also, my ability to conceptualize how I'll do this job eludes my linear thinking brain.


We (me this time) don't want to tear out the existing wall board & start over if possible. So, I'm thinking overlay.



The best idea that I had so far was to install a sheet of 1/4" drywall on top of the existing flat area. I'd crease paper tape and mud it in. This, hopefully, will give me a straight guide for applying compound.



Drawing Is Attached



Does my plan sound good, or am I out of my mind?
Do any of you have some suggestions for a better way to accomplish the task?


Thanks for sharing your ideas!
Paul

 

[Nealtw]

 

[MTN REMODEL LLC]

I don't really understand why you have that broad radious

.....but in regard to get straight tape application on strange non-square angles, I often use a metal imbeded angle tape....available at any big-box.

I'm no drywall or tapeing pro, so I will use that tape if maybe doing 45's or most likely doing a cathedral hip ceiling. Costs more, but sure helps me.

 

[Nealtw]

................

 

[Bird Doo Head]

I don't really understand why you have that broad radious
I guess it was the fashion back in the day.

.....but in regard to get straight tape application on strange non-square angles, I often use a metal imbeded angle tape....available at any big-box.
Thanks MTN.
That sounds like a good idea. The metal should give me a guide for the trowel. (Important since I cold not draw a straight line if my life depended on it!)

Thanks Neal Tw for the video.
It's a really helpful explanation. I liked, near the beginning, where the presenter said ".. does its own thing". He's not kidding, especially with me- 'Mister Shaky Hands'- guiding the trowel.

 

[MTN REMODEL LLC]

Bird Doo....by the way...great name....I'm going to steal it.

Best

Dog Piddle

 

[huesmann]

I don't really understand why you have that broad radious
I guess it was the fashion back in the day.

Yup, my parents' 1958 split level living room has the radiused ceilings.

 

[Bird Doo Head]

Bird Doo....by the way...great name....I'm going to steal it.
When we first got the Inner-Tube-Web-Net at our house, back in the olden days, I was sitting on the patio trying to think of an e-mail address name when a pigeon flew above me. The rest is history!

Yup, my parents' 1958 split level living room has the radiused ceilings.
And 10 years from now, it will be back in fashion. (I think the 1970's Brady Bunch look it the current rage.)

 

[MittensCat]

Could you build it out with furring strips or framing to get past the curved segment? Maybe bevel the edge of your new drywall to mate with the angle of your ceiling. Maybe this would eliminate some of the difficult taping and mud application. I don't know much about drywall finishing, just a thought.

 

[Bird Doo Head]

Thank You MittensCat for your good furring strip idea.

This might be a very simple solution for me to hold a straight and sharp line when mudding the joint.

If the furring is thin and placed on top of the existing drywall, the flat section will only become slightly wider than it is now.

Hopefully today I can go up there and stare for a while, with everyone's suggestions in my mind.

Thanks Again & Please Enjoy This Day!
Paul

 

[123pugsy]

You need to figure out how far down you need to go for the new drywall to clear the radius. It may be a few inches or more. I recall these houses had quite a large radius. (the few that I've been in)


Fashion yourself up a jig to find the drop required:

 

[Bird Doo Head]

Thanks Pugsy!
I appreciate your help & picture.
Paul

 

[mjhaston]

Back in the 80's and 90's we used black rubber knives to give a rounded angle. It hid the imperfections. This angle seems a little broader. As someone else pointed out, you could use some tape with metal or plastic angles embedded, but any solution would have been during the taping phase. I've take a metal corner bead and tacked it up backwards along an angle to give a straight edge to work on. We've also chalked a line before and done it free hand. Good luck.

 

[mjhaston]

You need to figure out how far down you need to go for the new drywall to clear the radius. It may be a few inches or more. I recall these houses had quite a large radius. (the few that I've been in)


Fashion yourself up a jig to find the drop required:

Not a bad idea. Are there a lot of lights in that ceiling? Maybe you can lay a fresh 1/4 in up there to start your angle over?

 

[Bird Doo Head]

Back in the 80's and 90's we used black rubber knives to give a rounded angle.
You've got me thinking, MJHaston! I have some think elephant bark rubber that is about as stiff & flexible as a spring steel mud knife. I could cut it to the angle needed for the ceiling and use it for the rough tape bedding coat.

Are there a lot of lights in that ceiling?
No lights at all. (I'd better not let SWMBO see this, or there will be lights!)

Maybe you can lay a fresh 1/4 in up there to start your angle over?
This, plus the jig 123Pugsy mentioned might be the first step. Step two will possibly be the metal embedded corner tape.

I hope I can get back to the project very soon. Thanks everyone's ideas, above it seems like the project went from a chore to a fun challenge!

 

[ClarenceBauer]

Back in the 80's and 90's we used black rubber knives to give a rounded angle.
You've got me thinking, MJHaston! I have some think elephant bark rubber that is about as stiff & flexible as a spring steel mud knife. I could cut it to the angle needed for the ceiling and use it for the rough tape bedding coat.

Are there a lot of lights in that ceiling?
No lights at all. (I'd better not let SWMBO see this, or there will be lights!)

Maybe you can lay a fresh 1/4 in up there to start your angle over?
This, plus the jig 123Pugsy mentioned might be the first step. Step two will possibly be the metal embedded corner tape.

I hope I can get back to the project very soon. Thanks everyone's ideas, above it seems like the project went from a chore to a fun challenge!

You can use a template like is used to run plaster / stucco cornice in place.
Caulk a line were you want the corner to be, than measure from that line say 6 inches each side of the corner line. Now place straight boards 1 X 1 along the two lines lets call these boards tracks. Now cut a piece of plywood so you have a negative profile of the flat ceiling & the angle ceiling with the corner where you want it on the existing ceiling. Make skids to keep the template running straight on the tracks. Test run the template to make sure is true to the center line & will clear any high spots.
When all is tested apply the mud to the area than pull the template along the tracks it will leave the profile that was cut in the plywood. You can repeat this process as needed to get the perfect finish. Remove the tracks & feather into the finished corner staying away from the corner with any new mud.
A setting mud will make it go faster if used do not let it set before the corner is complete.

 

[mjhaston]

Damn Nealtw posted this as the first response!

If it's not too late, check this out. This is way better than the paper with metal stuff we used to use. I just bought 2 boxes. I have 200 ft of angles to run. Not that you'll use it, but you can coat it with flat boxes!

 

[Bird Doo Head]

Hello ClarenceBauer & MJHaston!


Thank You both for taking time to reply.

ClarenceBauer, I want to apologize for not replying to your helpful tips before today. For some reason, I did not get e-mail notifications of your post.

Your explanation of using a custom template was very well explained. This may be the simplest solution for the particular situation.


Thanks MJHanson for your comments about the product in the video. I hope your 200 feet job goes smoothly!


I have been away from that project since my last post. Perhaps very soon I can go back to the task and start experimenting.

 

[Bird Doo Head]

Hello All!
I hope this note finds every one well & enjoying today!
I apologize for abandoning this thread for a while. I could not get back to the project until recently.

I would like to thank everyone for your great ideas. I ended up using ideas from all of your helpful suggestions:

First SWMBO & I decided where the transition from flat-to-angle should be located. We chalked lines. To keep me from wandering with the trowel, I made some "guide strips" and attached them to the ceiling exactly on the chalk lines & parallel to each other. Using wide, wood spacer blocks of the exact width between strips helped a lot. The strips run from side wall to side wall. They have a beveled edge so the trowel doesn't collide when mudding the flat. I put glossy paper tape on the edges so the excess mud would wipe off cleanly. (Drawing attached)

Next, I made a trowel that was exactly the distance between the guide strips.
Using it, I slowly (over many coats) built up the flat part of the ceiling with setting joint compound. This got rid of any remaining curve that was inboard of the strips. It, in conjunction with the guide strips, also allowed me to make the flat part dead-level.

For the tape, I used a product similar to what NealTW & others mentioned.
The local stores carry a different brand that is tape with plastic strips embedded called 'Perfect 90". It certainly made holding the tape in a straight line much easier. The product is a genius invention. What was very helpful is that the paper over the inserts is made of drywall paper so that when mudding on top, one gets to remove all the compound, thus maintaining a flat surface.

The only tricky part of the tape is that a narrow flange of paper remains outboard. It has to be embedded in mud separately.

Next. the inboard side of the tape was mudded-in.

When that part cured, I flipped the guide strips 180 degrees and reinstalled them. This gave me a guide to use while embedding the second half of the tape (the part going down the wall). I expect that with the special tape, this may not have been necessary.

For the "downhill" sides, I mudded & sanded until they were paint ready.
Next (hopefully soon) I will remove the guide strips and finish mudding the flat part freehand.

For the joint compound, I prefer to use Pro Form Quick-Set Lite or Fast Track. These both can be sanded to a very fine finish, eliminating the need for a topping coat. (Now National has Quick-Set Ultra Lite. Perhaps I'll experiment with it on this project for the final coat.)

Thank You Again everyone for all the helpful suggestions. Your thoughts took this project from "How am I not going to mess this up?" to "Wow! How About That!".

Be Sure to Enjoy Today!
Paul

 

[123pugsy]

Any pics to share?