DIY Home Improvement Forum banner
1 - 20 of 26 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello. Im a newbie on this site and have really appreciated this site in providing me valuable information on my first home. Here is the scenario I am dealing with now.
I currently have a balcony above the garage. :eek: THis balcony is supported by one major beam (around 20 ft in length) with a single jackpole in the middle of the beam (in the garage). I guess over the years with heavy snow accumulating on the balcony as well as foundation settling (noticeable by a few cracks on concrete garage floor), the main beam has sagged slightly.
This beam also has some lateral cracks which I believe are normal over time. The beam is also extremely dry that it can easily be chipped as it is very rough (if that helps at all)
My method to solve this problem was simply to turn the existing jackpole so that it raises the main beam a day at a time (1/16 of an inch per day) I have only done it once so far and before continuing wanted to make sure this was the proper method. I have seen other threads where two sistering jackpoles were needed, but in my case wasn't sure why this would be necessary on an existing jackpole.
 

·
Mold!! Let's kill it!
Joined
·
2,849 Posts
Could be that there is not enough footing under the post to bear the load. If that is the case then turning the screw may solve your problem temporarily, but it will continue to settle and sag. You really need to decide what caused the sag in the first place. Then attack the problem where it truly exists.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,194 Posts
It would really help if you posted a picture or two.
Ron
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks for the feedback. Will come back with a picture later today. For now all I can say is that the garage itself is above-grade and I have a basement beside the foundation of the garage (ie the garage foundation is a basement wall) which probably means there is quite a bit of footing (6ft +) or not? depending how the center of the garage is done. THis sagging also has also caused slight exterior damage to the brick which seems to have been patched up not too long ago. I will come back with pictures for better visibility to this topic.

Thanks
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,621 Posts
It is very likely you will need a more robust footing. You would then need two sistering (maybe not that close) jack poles to hold up the beam and balcony during the time you remove the original jack pole temporarily and build a new footing. Or put in new footings for the two alternate jack poles perhaps at the 1/3 to 2/5 point and 3/5 to 2/3 point along the beam, install them, and remove the original jack pole for good.
 
  • Like
Reactions: malicio

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I have included the pictures. The length of the beam is close to 17 ft + and the jackpole is more or less in the middle. Let me know if the pictures help. In regards to the footing, I don't see any dipping in the area below the pole. Note the pole is also extended to double it's regular length (has a pin below and above) due to the height of the beam. I guess the question is, is the sag serious? Is it easy to adjust by just turning the pole little by little on the sagging point or is it safer to put the two sistering poles as mentioned earlier in this thread.

Thanks
 

Attachments

·
Master General ReEngineer
Joined
·
9,980 Posts
Ayuh,... In my experince, that screw is about at the end of it's travel....

I'd sister it, 'n take the load up,...
I'd also go find a more robust pole to put back in it's place....
You can get heavy wall steel pipe, that'll allow you to reuse the screw-jack in it....
Heavy pipe, cut to length,...
1/4" steel plates, above, 'n below wouldn't hurt athing either....
 

·
Wolf
Joined
·
47 Posts
I'm am not a structural engineer and rely a lot on intuition to stay safe in these kinds of projects. It seems from your pictures and narrative that (1) the beam was adequate to begin with but has sagged for some reason which if solved could correct the situation, (2) I'm guessing from the picture of the footing that it is probably the reason for the sag. No telling how deep the footing is but in my experience, the footing should be 24" square by 12" deep (steel reinforced, minimum) for each support member. If it were my home with this problem, I would strongly consider AllanJ's comment to add a second support member, thus two footings.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 · (Edited)
I thank you all for your comments, especially AllanJ and Bondo. I have decided to do the two things recommended:
1. Place 2 jackpoles on either side at the recommended distances to distribute the load better. It is way too much pressure and force on one pole which could be the reason for the sag due to bad footing in the first place. And I just realized something, there is a drain towards where there garage doors are almost at the 1/4 point or , so I would have to place the poles a little after that annoyance.
2. Get the proper height of pole as this one was constructed using two poles which is not ideal and also had no steel plates below to relieve the pressure. The current pole is over 100" in height!! Extended too much.

Now I guess the next question is, do I just place the sistering poles directly on the garage floor (with steel plates of course)?
And I am guessing that just screwing them upward slowly day by day will allow me to remove the existing pole at some point in time?

Off to another challenge, installing hardwood flooring on a badly levelled floor. Found a sagging joist beneath a wall, and yes, for some reason it is only one joist beneath that wall. Will open another thread for this one :whistling2:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,194 Posts
.

Now I guess the next question is, do I just place the sistering poles directly on the garage floor (with steel plates of course)?
And I am guessing that just screwing them upward slowly day by day will allow me to remove the existing pole at some point in time?
You need the proper footings under the new pole locations. I would think you would also need to let them cure before exerting pressure on them.
Ron
 

·
Concrete & Masonry
Joined
·
3,890 Posts
Thanks will do that. create footings with some good steel plates.
You're new plan to create two new footings & posts is great, but you won't need any steel plates at the base. The concrete will have no trouble with the footprint of the column once it reaches adequate strength. I would also suggest placing the screw jack at the base of the posts on the new ones, as it's far more robust than the hollow tubing and will survive better in a wet location such as a garage floor.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Prepping the concrete footing

You're new plan to create two new footings & posts is great, but you won't need any steel plates at the base. The concrete will have no trouble with the footprint of the column once it reaches adequate strength. I would also suggest placing the screw jack at the base of the posts on the new ones, as it's far more robust than the hollow tubing and will survive better in a wet location such as a garage floor.

It's been a while since I posted this and just got around to prepping this. I realized that the existing post (see in previous pictures) is embedded in the concrete footing when originally I thought it was sitting on top. I also just noticed your comment about flipping the posts upside down with the screw at the bottom. I saw this technique outlined elsewhere and it mentioned something about bearing more on the concrete vs. the beam. Even though the manufacturer pictures show it the other way around???
I have bought 2 new posts which are of proper height for this application and I created two footings on either side of the old one (applying proper grade concrete). The footings are 7" by 11" each and about 2-2.5 inch deep (like the old one). THey are currently curing (Day 1). I made sure to prime the surface before with some concrete glue and even mixed this with the concrete mix. Is this ok?
Was I also supposed to dig a little before placing the footing on top?

The other question is, do I redo them with the posts embedded upside down? I would need to know soon as I am not sure I will be able to remove them easily once fully cured.

Thanks
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,194 Posts
"The footings are 7" by 11" each and about 2-2.5 inch deep (like the old one). THey are currently curing (Day 1). I made sure to prime the surface before with some concrete glue and even mixed this with the concrete mix. Is this ok?
Was I also supposed to dig a little before placing the footing on top?"
This does not constitute a footing. Footings are 2 feet x 2 feet by 2 feet for a two story house, give or take.
Unless this is a doll house.
Ron
 

·
Concrete & Masonry
Joined
·
3,890 Posts
I agree with Ron, except that the min. footing depth is only typically 12" here, sometimes down to 8", and oftentimes even thicker than 12". What you did sounds more like a "band-aid" to me, unless of course I'm not understanding you correctly.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
"The footings are 7" by 11" each and about 2-2.5 inch deep (like the old one). THey are currently curing (Day 1). I made sure to prime the surface before with some concrete glue and even mixed this with the concrete mix. Is this ok?
Was I also supposed to dig a little before placing the footing on top?"
This does not constitute a footing. Footings are 2 feet x 2 feet by 2 feet for a two story house, give or take.
Unless this is a doll house.
Ron

I guess maybe I am confused myself. I believe the previous pole is embedded in a concrete block (8x8") not as a footing but probably more as a protection from garage floor?? The garage floor itself is ground level and is 4 feet deep in concrete (minimum due to a basement and frost line).
So im guessing in theory a footing is not even needed? So I guess maybe i should get rid of the block I built because if the pole sits on top of this (less than 2x2 feet) not even embedded and touching the garage floor, then it will for sure crack.
Am I correct with this statement?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,194 Posts
I guess maybe I am confused myself. I believe the previous pole is embedded in a concrete block (8x8") not as a footing but probably more as a protection from garage floor?? The garage floor itself is ground level and is 4 feet deep in concrete (minimum due to a basement and frost line).
So im guessing in theory a footing is not even needed? So I guess maybe i should get rid of the block I built because if the pole sits on top of this (less than 2x2 feet) not even embedded and touching the garage floor, then it will for sure crack.
Am I correct with this statement?
I really have no idea what you just said here.
"The garage floor itself is ground level and is 4 feet deep in concrete"
Is the garage floor 4 feet thick? If it is, then you don't need a footing.
Ron
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Yes my garage floor is min 4 feet deep. So I guess no footing.

I will just embed the base of the pole with concrete like the existing pole that is there to avoid water damage to it from the surrounding garage floor. Someone recommended the following:
---I would also suggest placing the screw jack at the base of the posts on the new ones, as it's far more robust than the hollow tubing and will survive better in a wet location such as a garage floor. ---

My plan would just to put a steel plate on either side at the bottom as recommended by the manufacturer and have the screw on top. And then embed the bottom with concrete.

Is there a better way to do it?
 

·
Civil Engineer
Joined
·
5,832 Posts
Are you sure you don't mean inches instead of feet? I have never seen a garage floor for a residential property that is 4 feet thick, that would be a massive floor, suitable for an industrial building. What basis do you have to believe that the concrete is four feet thick?
 
1 - 20 of 26 Posts
Top