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I have an outside security light that uses an ED37 bulb. It currently has 400Watt ED37 that is quoted at 37,000Lumens. I want to replace with LED bulb and im finding them around 7,200Lumens. Do lumens when it comes to HIDvsLED make a huge difference. Will 7,2000 be comparable to the HID bulb? Thanks for any info and also should there be an issue replacing the bulb with LED?
 

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Lumens are a measure of how much light is being produced by a bulb. So 800 lumens from a 60W incandescent bulb is the same amount of light as 800 lumens from an LED.



So your 7200 lumen LED bulb will be no where near as bright as the 37,000 lumen bulb. You'd need about 5 of the LEDs to equal the brightness.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Lumens are a measure of how much light is being produced by a bulb. So 800 lumens from a 60W incandescent bulb is the same amount of light as 800 lumens from an LED.



So your 7200 lumen LED bulb will be no where near as bright as the 37,000 lumen bulb. You'd need about 5 of the LEDs to equal the brightness.
Thats what I was thinking. Thank you for the quick response. If thats the case just gonna replace the entire fixture with led fixture. Thank you again.
 

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That sounds like a commercial rating. Does your application need that much light?
How high is this mounted and what area are you covering?

I did some searching and there are replacements for the ED37 lamp but need more searching to get up to that rating. The other factor might be the color temperature as a day light 5000K might be brighter than the ED37.

Outside my scope so lets see if others have hands on experience.

Bud

I was still typing while you posted.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
That sounds like a commercial rating. Does your application need that much light?
How high is this mounted and what area are you covering?

I did some searching and there are replacements for the ED37 lamp but need more searching to get up to that rating. The other factor might be the color temperature as a day light 5000K might be brighter than the ED37.

Outside my scope so lets see if others have hands on experience.

Bud
Its an outdoor security light for my entire backyard. The bulb is 25+ years old just looking to upgrade to led cause the old bulb is 400 watts. Its mounted on the eave of the house so not high. The rating of the led is 5K. Im thinking before new fixture might try the $50 led bulb at Home Depot and just see then can always return and install new fixture.
 

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I saw some, home depot I think, that were a bit brighter than 7,200 so look around.

A few years back I replaced an old halogen bulb/fixture and couldn't get one with a replaceable lamp, kind of a built in assembly. But that bugger was bright although I wouldn't like looking at it for too long.
 

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You're quite right. An awful lot of "upselling to LED" is actually making you accept less light. However that is not necessary.

Lumens are lumens are lumens, but you don't want those lumens.

A standard lumen test rig is a sphere. They put the bulb at the center of the sphere and the bulb gets credit for all lumens cast in all directions. That gives obsolete lights a huge advantage, since they naturally emit in a sphere, even though at least 50% and usually more like 90% of their light is in the wrong direction.

Why would we ever want a sphere of light? 50% of it would be wasted as skyglow. Look at how you actually use lights; the only light you actually want is a wedge - typically 30-60 degrees, maybe 120 degrees for a post light.

A barn light? Classic faceplant fail is this intense spot of light on the barn below the light. It's completely useless: we don't need to know there's a barn there. We know there's a barn there. What we need is the grass/grounds *beyond the barn* lit up. About a 45 degree wedge, starting 25 degrees away from the barn to 70 degrees away, is just about right.

With obsolete lights, we try to recover the wayward light with reflectors, but forget that. They don't work. Doubt me, touch the reflector on a metal halide light, goodbye fingerprints. The reflector is absorbing more energy than it's reflecting.

On the other hand, my GE lights have plastic bezels below them, with fresnel lenses molded into them. They run barely warm; lenses are very efficient. A light that only throws 160 degrees is ideal for lenses.

LEDs only throw light in about a 140 degree wedge. And that is all the lumen machine will give them credit for. In other words, LEDs are penalized for aiming

For instance I tore out an array of 400 watt metal halides up on poles, lighting up a yard area (and half the neighborhood). I replaced with 30 degree and 8 degree LED spotlights, that are aimed exactly where we want the light. As a result I replaced 3200W of light with like 250W. I'm getting far fewer lumens, but those are the lumens I want!

So you can do it, but if you get a cheaply designed fixture that just tosses lumens bric-a-brac so the seller can claim 7000 lumens, it'll perform poorly. That would be typical of the Alibaba swill sold on the Amazon Marketplace. But if you go with a well designed light, or what I like are automotive off-road lights with a DC power supply, then yeah, you get to throw light exactly where you want.

I have also hacked old metal halide barn lights by mounting a cheapie floodlight *inside* the bezel. At first glance it looks like a metal halide light, But it's really an LED throwing the light downward through the hole in the bottom of the bezel, positioned and aimed to light the part of the yard I want lit. This isn't as effective as a well-aimed light, but it looks OK. And it's cheap!
 

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you would need at least 200 LED WATTS
to replace your metal halide lamp
thats commercial grade industrial type lights
Yeah, if it's not aimed. Most of the MH replacement LEDs are "Corn Cob" type, which are stupid because they are intentionally not aimed.

If you don't aim, then it's a raw lumen/watt battle. MH is already almost as efficient, so it wins on cost.

The "60W LED retrofit corn light, 7800 lumens" I'm looking at on Amazon is about 1/5 the brightness of a proper 400W MH. Sad. Very sad.
 

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Lumens are a measure of how much light is being produced by a bulb. So 800 lumens from a 60W incandescent bulb is the same amount of light as 800 lumens from an LED.

While that should be the case, it hasn't held true in my experience.
Perceived brightness of LED's with same lumens is brighter from
what I've seen, but, not the massive difference referenced by the
op.
 

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While that should be the case, it hasn't held true in my experience.
Perceived brightness of LED's with same lumens is brighter from
what I've seen, but, not the massive difference referenced by the
op.
It's hard to compare. Not only is the light dispersed differently, but LEDs are not as broad a spectrum of light. So while it may look brighter, you find yourself not really being able to see things as well.

Overall, I find the equivalent Wattages referenced on LEDs to be understated in practical use.
 

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I have converted 4 tube, 4' florescents to LED. Ended up removing 2 tubes because the light was too bright.

Sent from my RCT6A03W13E using Tapatalk
 

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Its an outdoor security light for my entire backyard. The bulb is 25+ years old.
It won't be as bad as you think. After 25 years that bulb has most likely lost half of it's original lumen output....along with the aged ballast.
Judging by the lumen output you mentioned I would think that is metal halide. Those bulbs have (usually) a 16,000 to 20,000 hour lifespan.
But at 1/2 of the life span they have also lost 1/2 of their lumen output.
But LED is the way to go.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
It won't be as bad as you think. After 25 years that bulb has most likely lost half of it's original lumen output....along with the aged ballast.
Judging by the lumen output you mentioned I would think that is metal halide. Those bulbs have (usually) a 16,000 to 20,000 hour lifespan.
But at 1/2 of the life span they have also lost 1/2 of their lumen output.
But LED is the way to go.
Youre right is the metal halide. Should the LED just plug in no issue with the ballast being in there. Im starting to think new housing and everything.
 

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Youre right is the metal halide. Should the LED just plug in no issue with the ballast being in there. Im starting to think new housing and everything.
You will have to replace everything. The ballasts are specific for the bulb.
A 25 year old fixture will most likely have brittle wiring with the heat that those fixtures generate. Replacing it all is the best option.
Or get another metal halide bulb and wait another 25 years.
What you have is a parking light type luminaire. they cover a lot of area when placed high enough. Those fixtures were meant to last for a long time because of the difficult of replacing lamps 40 - 60 feet up in the air. Your situation doesn't seem so difficult.
I don't know what your budget is, but Stasun makes an outdoor LED fixture with two luminaries that supposedly offer 18,000 lumens for about $150.
That is probably close to what you have now since your original fixture has deteriorated in light output over time.
Just something for you to consider.
 
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