[miamicuse]

Are there different types of push in wire connectors? I mean this kind:

The reason I am asking is I have tried these connectors before, and while they are useful for solid conductors I can never get stranded conductors to go in. This is despite the connectors specifications saying it's designed for both solid and stranded. Imagine how frustrated it is when you are trying to connect two solids and two stranded and the stranded won't go in and you have to cut the solids even shorter after an unsuccessful.



But last week I installed a remodel recessed light and inside the junction box are these push in connectors already connected to the fixtures #16 stranded conductors. I tried to use a #14 stranded and to my suprise it went in smooth and held tight.


Which goes back to my question, are there different versions of these push in connectors where some works for stranded and some don't? Or is it a trick I am not aware of that makes it work with stranded some way to stiffen up the stranded end?

 

[jmon]

That looks like the ideal in-sure push in wire connector available at any big box store. As you mentioned, they are suppose to be for stranded wire as well as for solid gauge.

I know what you mean,, it's frustrating sometimes. As you mentioned, I try to stiffen the stranded wire up a bit by twisting it really good with pair of needle nose pliers. I can usually get them to work with a little time and patience.

I'm sure there are different brands. I'll be watching this post for some ideas.

 

[rjniles]

I use Wago lever nuts on stranded for this very reason.

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[Chris130]

I use Wago lever nuts on stranded for this very reason.

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Yep, I've gone to using push-lever Wagos for everything these days. They're more expensive than plain nuts, but they make down-the-road work so much easier. Plus, easy-peasy for stranded and size/type mixes.

 

[seharper]

You know how your multi-tool has some bolt shears for #6, #8 and #10 bolts? Here's how I tight-twist stranded.

I stick the stranded wire into a bolt hole it'll just fit in, typically #8. Just 1/16 of an inch, just enough to grab it. Then I squeeze the tool just right (an acquired skill) - too loose and this won't work, too tight and you'll cut the wire.

Then I rotate the tool. Instant tight spiral.

With practice, you can get good enough at it to get a shepherd's J-hook that won't come undone when you tighten the receptacle screw.

 

[de-nagorg]

What you do is get ROSIN CORE solder, and a soldering gun/ iron.

heat the stranded wire end, touch the solder to the hot wire, remove it quickly, not too much solder.

They are all fused into one solid end.

Might need a little "FINESSE" with a piece of emery cloth to get it to go into the connector, but you still have a solid wire now.

Do not use a flame for this, it melts the insulation.


ED

 

[rjniles]

What you do is get ROSIN CORE solder, and a soldering gun/ iron.

heat the stranded wire end, touch the solder to the hot wire, remove it quickly, not too much solder.

They are all fused into one solid end.

Might need a little "FINESSE" with a piece of emery cloth to get it to go into the connector, but you still have a solid wire now.

Do not use a flame for this, it melts the insulation.


ED

Too much work:smile:

 

[J. V.]

I use Wago lever nuts on stranded for this very reason.

I never used them before until a couple weeks ago. My friend had some so I gave them a try. I will never use wire nuts again. Well unless I have too!

You know how your multi-tool has some bolt shears for #6, #8 and #10 bolts? Here's how I tight-twist stranded.
I stick the stranded wire into a bolt hole it'll just fit in, typically #8. Just 1/16 of an inch, just enough to grab it. Then I squeeze the tool just right (an acquired skill) - too loose and this won't work, too tight and you'll cut the wire.
Then I rotate the tool. Instant tight spiral.
With practice, you can get good enough at it to get a shepherd's J-hook that won't come undone when you tighten the receptacle screw.

A hook with stranded wire?
I take my strippers and stop stripping the insulation before it comes all the way off. Then I wrap it around the screw, hold it tight and torque down the screw.
Holds tight and looks fantastic! No loose ends to see or deal with. Try it.

 

[miamicuse]

I think even with a soldered end there is likelihood it will not be stiff enough to push it all the way in.


I bought some IDEAL ones today and even solid conductors are a challenge as you need to push it all the way in or risk it coming loose when turning the connector. It's a lot easier on new solid conductor that you just stripped that's nice and straight, but if you have existing conductors that's been untangled, even if you spend time straightening it it takes some finessing to get them in, and if you are using a 4 or 5 port one, to get them all next to each other and still grip a short end to push it in is not always going to work. I think soldering an end will just be a waste of time and still not going to work unless the solder end goes all the way to your thumb and finger where you hold the conductor.


I am going to try the lever connectors and see how that works. Thanks!

 

[Jim Port]

If the wires were previously twisted you should cut off the twist and strip a new end to the proper length.

 

[afjes2015]

I would not use those push in connectors for stranded wires. I use them for solid because it is easier for me since I have arthritis in my fingers.



Even though they may be rated for stranded the safety issue with using them on stranded is that a stranded wire is rated by how many individual strands there are in the bundle itself and the thickness of those individual stands. If while you are attempting to push the twisted stranded wire into the connector that not all of the individual strands actually make contact inside then the wire is now not rated as it was (less now). It would be the same theory if you tried to use stranded wire under a screw and only had a portion of all the strands under the screw head.



If you are in a bind then make a 6" jumper of a solid wire, connect it to the stranded wire with a nut and then place the other end of the solid wire in the push in connector. I would not make a habit of that though; just for a "needed at the moment" thing.

 

[Chris130]

For additional clarity, here's a pic of the push-lever Wago...

They aren't cheap, but an assortment pack (from Amazon or wherever) will last an average DIYer a pretty long time.

Note that the most commonly available series version (221-4xx) is good for #12 - #24, but they also have a series (221-6xx) that work for #10 - #20.

 

[miamicuse]

The IDEAL "In-Sure" push in connectors is indeed rated for both solid and stranded conductors. These are the specs:

• Push-In wire connector to join and insulate 2 wires
• Minimum capacity of 2 #20 wires
• Maximum capacity of 2 #12 wires
• Stranded wire range: #16 - #12 AWG (≤ 19 strand) and #18 AWG (≤ 7 strand)
• Tin bonded stranded wire range: #18 - #14 AWG (≤ 19 strand)
• Rated to 600-Volt maximum

I don't think it is possible to push in a stranded conductor easily, completely, and bottom it to the end of the see through plastic end of the conductor. Even if you solder the ends together there needs to be significant stiffness needed from the tip of the conductor to where you hold it with your finger to do the pushing. Soldering the last half an inch does nothing.

On the other hand, the Gardner Bender connectors stated it is for solid only.

Gardner Bender 19-PC3 PushGard 3-Port Push-In Wire Connectors, 22-12 AWG Solid, 10 pk

 

[miamicuse]

As for lever connectors, is Wago the "go to" brand?


I searched on Amazon and there is quite a selection out there on various brands. I saw another brand named XHF, seems to be made in China.

I kind of like the inline lever splice could come in handy to make cleaner connections inside the panel.

 

[RAL238]

As for lever connectors, is Wago the "go to" brand?

I searched on Amazon and there is quite a selection out there on various brands. I saw another brand named XHF, seems to be made in China.

I kind of like the inline lever splice could come in handy to make cleaner connections inside the panel.

The Wagos are the best, in my opinion. Stay away from those Chinese knock-offs on Amazon. They are not UL Listed.

 

[rjniles]

As for lever connectors, is Wago the "go to" brand?


I searched on Amazon and there is quite a selection out there on various brands. I saw another brand named XHF, seems to be made in China.

I kind of like the inline lever splice could come in handy to make cleaner connections inside the panel.

I though I was buying real Wago from an Amazon seller. Turned out to be China junk. You can get real Wago on Amazon but read the fine print.

The China knock offs did hold the wire secuely.

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[de-nagorg]

[*]Tin bonded stranded wire range: #18 - #14 AWG (≤ 19 strand)

I don't think it is possible to push in a stranded conductor easily, completely, and bottom it to the end of the see through plastic end of the conductor. Even if you solder the ends together there needs to be significant stiffness needed from the tip of the conductor to where you hold it with your finger to do the pushing. Soldering the last half an inch doe[B

The process that I described earlier, is called Tinning.

Your list says Tin bonded. ( same thing.).

And if you properly TIN the stranded the required 3/8 - 1/2 inch, it will be stiff enough to push in, especially, if you "FINESSE" the tip properly with the emery cloth.

As for it being too much work, for RJ, that shows that you don't care enough to do what it takes to do the job :devil3:.


ED

 

[rjniles]

I though I was buying real Wago from an Amazon seller. Turned out to be China junk. You can get real Wago on Amazon but read the fine print.

The China knock offs did hold the wire secuely.

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That was supposed say did not hold the wire securely.

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[miamicuse]

That was supposed say did not hold the wire securely.

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Thanks for the clarification that makes all the difference in the world :devil3:

 

[miamicuse]

The process that I described earlier, is called Tinning.

Your list says Tin bonded. ( same thing.).

And if you properly TIN the stranded the required 3/8 - 1/2 inch, it will be stiff enough to push in, especially, if you "FINESSE" the tip properly with the emery cloth.

As for it being too much work, for RJ, that shows that you don't care enough to do what it takes to do the job :devil3:.

ED

Since I am staying at home and have plenty of time, I actually did a test yesterday and tried this soldering just as a test out of curiosity, and not that I would actually do it for my actual wiring.


The push in connector's manufacturer recommendation is to strip 0.45" of the insulation, so I stripped 0.5" of the stranded insulation and soldered almost the entire stripped section. It is still difficult to push it in till it "bottoms". What I mean is it is not enough to just push into the connector and have it catch, as you can wiggle, turn, twist, and pull it off. With the solid conductor I can push it in all the way till it bottoms, with a stranded with soldered tip, to get it to go in and bottom, requires that you hold the conductor as close to the soldered end as possible. While holding the conductor with two fingers as close as possible, note that there are other solid conductors already in the connector 1/8" away interfering with this action, there is a high likelihood the conductor would just bend where the solder ends and the insulation begins while you push it half way in. I was able to do it successfully on two #12 stranded conductors out of eight I soldered by using a needle nose plier to hold real tight on the conductors as I push in. If it bends once that end cannot be used, you have to cut, re-strip and re-solder.


May be the issue is with the particular brand of connectors "IDEAL INSURE" which is the only one I can find that listed stranded on it's specifications.