[Fred_]

Hi all,

I am currently rewiring a big part of my house to replace old ungrounded cables with proper grounded wires. Last week I had the opportunity to ask an electrician a few questions; one of those was "Is it ok to splice wire in a junction box with electrical tape ?" His answer was, "Pretty much anything reasonable is ok within a junction box".

But the more I read, to more it seems it's not ok. Problem is I already have quite a bit of work involving taped splice done. So here is my question - Is it really a problem or should I leave it like this ?

I plan to have it inspected at the end to prevent any insurance related problem in the case of an accident (even though the guy inspecting it will probably be the guy who told me it was fine).

The wire is all 14. I live in Quebec, Canada.

Thanks !

 

[sixeightten]

Why on earth would you not use wire nuts? Am I misunderstanding something here?

 

[Jim Port]

Twist-on connectors (wire nuts) or something like the Ideal push-ins are the correct way to ensure a tight connection. Tape is definitely not the way to make a secure problem free splice.

 

[Red Squirrel]

Just make sure the junction boxes are easily accessible.

You'll need to get to them in a few weeks from now. :laughing:

 

[Scott3229]

No that is not the proper way to splice, you should be using wire nuts.

 

[sixeightten]

The guy who told you that you could is no electrician. Maybe he is an elect ition cause he told u lies.

 

[Fred_]

Haha!

he is a proper electrician with licenses an' all ! He seemed competent apart from that answer (or maybe it's common practice around here ?).

I should have mentioned that my wires are tightly twisted together under the tape. But still, If I must, I will redo those darn connections.

However, since my house is fairly old (1949) a lot of the original splices are tape only and still good after 62 years.

So, is it a total no go or more like a "it will fail earlier than wirenuts ?"

Thanks again !

 

[Leah Frances]

Those old splices may not just be taped. They are likely soldered also.

 

[Fred_]

While we're at it, another quick question,

Is it ok to run two wires through one hole in a junction box ? I have only four holes and need 5 wires in one spot. I could do otherwise but running two wires in one hole would save me 5 joist holes !

 

[Fred_]

Those old splices may not just be taped. They are likely soldered also.

Some are, some are not, I took a few apart to ground outlets and some were just twisted.

Ain't that twisted !

 

[Wildie]

Twisted with tape isn't adequate in Ontario and I doubt its legal in QC either.

Splices require a certain amount of mechanical pressure that is achieved by the use of wirenuts. Merely twisting isn't sufficient.

I have made splices for street light cables. We used Burndy mechanical connectors. These were wrapped in rubber tape, followed by electrical tape and then coated with 3M Scotch Coat.
This is the only way that we were allowed to tape electrical connections.

 

[md2lgyk]

Are you sure your "electrician" didn't misunderstand your question? I have seen electrical tape in junction boxes many times, but it was always wrapped around the wire nuts. Why, I don't know.

 

[Fred_]

I was pretty clear about it as I was a bit doubtful so I don't think he misunderstood...

 

[J. V.]

Haha!

he is a proper electrician with licenses an' all ! He seemed competent apart from that answer (or maybe it's common practice around here ?).

I should have mentioned that my wires are tightly twisted together under the tape. But still, If I must, I will redo those darn connections.

However, since my house is fairly old (1949) a lot of the original splices are tape only and still good after 62 years.

So, is it a total no go or more like a "it will fail earlier than wirenuts ?"

Thanks again !

Have you ever witnessed a house fire? Electrical tape was never an approved connector.
Years ago solder was used and then taped. The wirenut was then invented and the use of tape has all but disappeared. Thankfully!

I was pretty clear about it as I was a bit doubtful so I don't think he misunderstood...

Hes a hack. I would not let him do any work for me.

 

[Fred_]

Have you ever witnessed a house fire? Electrical tape was an approved connector.
Years ago solder was used and then taped. The wirenut was then invented and the use of tape has all but disappeared. Thankfully!

How can tape inside an electrical metal box cause a fire ? I thought fire were mostly due to wrong wire gage or junctions outside of metal/plastic boxes.

Anyhow, I redid the taped junctions with wirenuts but some of the old stuff I often don't have enough loose wire to redo...

Hes a hack. I would not let him do any work for me.

I will have him do the inspection only, I will have an easier time The work I do myself anyway.

Another question, what do you guys think of plastic boxes ?

 

[jbfan]

Nothing wrong with plastic boxes.

 

[SD515]

How can tape inside an electrical metal box cause a fire ? I thought fire were mostly due to wrong wire gage or junctions outside of metal/plastic boxes.

Loose wire joints can cause arcing. Arcing melts and burns things. I've worked on circuits before that have melted the wirenuts due to improper installation. That said, I still would never trust a joint made up solely with tape.

Anyhow, I redid the taped junctions with wirenuts but some of the old stuff I often don't have enough loose wire to redo...

If you had enough free conductor to wrap them with tape, you have enough conductor to put a wirenut on.

Another question, what do you guys think of plastic boxes ?

Nothing wrong with plastic boxes.

 

[Perry401]

The instructor at the local vocational school used to tell his class that wire nuts were invented specifically to melt in the event of an overcurrent issue. He even had some sort of demonstation he would set up to show this. He told them that the manufactures made wire nuts this way so that bad portions of circuits would dis-connect themselves from the rest of a circuit! He taught this for at least 4 years, and there were dozens, if not hundreds of students, some of whom are still around who believed him. He also advocated punching every possible knock-out from boxes where wire nuts were used to let them run cooler and to give a way for smoke to be disipated! The students who got into professional electrical firms -- ones who went through inspections and subject to peer reviews of their work quickly learned that this was not so. But those who became handymen, worked un-supervised, and who's work was never inspected needed a long time to learn this method of installation is not generally acceptable.

This same teacher insisted that "Every connection", be it wire-nut, push-in (without screw clamp), screw clamp, wrap around screw, etc. required "exactly" 9/16 inches of insulation removed from the wire. He told his students to "ignore" wire strip indicators on receptacles, etc. since all are based on "exactly" 9/16 inchs of insulation being stripped!

This was in the 1980-1985 period. How this "Electrical Professional" got his job teaching high-school and night school students is still beyond me.

 

[Perry401]

I have occationally used a different type of connector when wires are very short. I don't know now if what I have done is legal. I don't know what they are called, but they are a hollow tube like thing with a "set screw" in the side. They, like wirenuts are rated for how many wires can be used, etc. To use them you put the wires into the tube, then screw down on the "set screw" until they are tight. THen you screw a plastic insulating cap over the wire assembly. Because there is no twisting, wires can be extremely short and a connection still made.

 

[SD515]

The instructor at the local vocational school used to tell his class that wire nuts were invented specifically to melt in the event of an overcurrent issue. He even had some sort of demonstation he would set up to show this. He told them that the manufactures made wire nuts this way so that bad portions of circuits would dis-connect themselves from the rest of a circuit! He taught this for at least 4 years, and there were dozens, if not hundreds of students, some of whom are still around who believed him. He also advocated punching every possible knock-out from boxes where wire nuts were used to let them run cooler and to give a way for smoke to be disipated! The students who got into professional electrical firms -- ones who went through inspections and subject to peer reviews of their work quickly learned that this was not so. But those who became handymen, worked un-supervised, and who's work was never inspected needed a long time to learn this method of installation is not generally acceptable.

This same teacher insisted that "Every connection", be it wire-nut, push-in (without screw clamp), screw clamp, wrap around screw, etc. required "exactly" 9/16 inches of insulation removed from the wire. He told his students to "ignore" wire strip indicators on receptacles, etc. since all are based on "exactly" 9/16 inchs of insulation being stripped!

This was in the 1980-1985 period. How this "Electrical Professional" got his job teaching high-school and night school students is still beyond me.

That is hilarious only because I know better. I suspect Captain Morgan was one of his best friends?