[Dahammer]

Hey guys I've got a fastener question. I'm about to install some of the GP Ply-Bead ship lap paneling (11/32" x 4' x 8') in an outbuilding on the walls & ceiling. The instructions from GP (https://pdf.lowes.com/installationguides/081999381738_install.pdf) recommend using 6d (2") casing, finish or ring shank paneling nails. They go on to say longer nails are necessary if solid backing is over 1/2" thick to penetrate 1" of the framing.

First, there will be no backing or furring. I plan to attach it directly to the 2x4 framing. So I think 2" nails are excessive and run the risk of penetrating electrical wiring ran through the framing. So I'm thinking 1-1/2" fasteners are a better choice and they'll still penetrate a little over an 1" into the framing.

Second, I have a 15 gauge pneumatic finish nailer that I can use. Or I also have an 18 gauge 7/32" narrow crown stapler that I can use. I'm concerned about the finish nails pulling through, especially on the ceiling. Would it be better to use the stapler?

Also, the building has sort of a vaulted ceiling. It has a 6' wide flat ceiling down the center and 30" high knee walls on both sides. The framing is on 24" centers for both. The vertical wall framing is on 16" centers. I plan to run the ply-bead's long side (strength axis) perpendicular to the framing (as GP recommends) and I've installed blocking to catch the seam down the center. All butt ends will also be supported by framing. I had originally planned to NOT install blocking for the seams where the knee wall meets the flat ceiling or where it meets the vertical walls. Instead I was going to put 1x4s underneath those seams as trim to support it from below. However, now I'm rethinking that plan. Will I have issues with the ply-bead lifting off the 1x4s if there is nothing holding it down to the 1x4? If so, would it be sufficient to toe nail the 1x4 into the plybead from below or best to just add blocking in the framing to nail the ply-bead into?


Thanks in advance for your help and suggestions.

 

[P C D]

Per IRC Table R602.3(2) you can substitute the 6d nails with 1.75" 16 ga. staples at 3"/6" spacing. Staples will look cheap-o where exposed.


Those panels will be part of your shear walls, so use shorter/thinner nails at your own risk.

 

[Dahammer]

Per IRC Table R602.3(2) you can substitute the 6d nails with 1.75" 16 ga. staples at 3"/6" spacing. Staples will look cheap-o where exposed.


Those panels will be part of your shear walls, so use shorter/thinner nails at your own risk.

These are interior walls and a ceiling of an outbuilding/shed/workshop. I'm not concerned about sheer strength. I just don't want the plywood coming down or warping. So whichever fastener has the better holding strength is the one I want to use.

 

[P C D]

These are interior walls and a ceiling of an outbuilding/shed/workshop. I'm not concerned about sheer strength. I just don't want the plywood coming down or warping. So whichever fastener has the better holding strength is the one I want to use.

Why are you bothering about strength axes and blocking then? Use drywall screws.

 

[Dahammer]

Why are you bothering about strength axes and blocking then? Use drywall screws.

Because the framing on the ceiling and knee walls is on 24" centers and the documentation from GP states that the 11/32" sheets need to be turned with the strength axis perpendicular to the framing when on 24s and to use blocking on all seams/ends. The stuff bows a little laying on flat on the floor, let alone installed.



I could use screws but it will be painted and I figure the staples or finish nails would look better and be much faster.

 

[P C D]

Wouldn't you prefer the grooves on the wall panels to run vertically? It should be okay to install your panels long-side up. If you use adhesive, your finish nailer should work fine also.

 

[Dahammer]

Wouldn't you prefer the grooves on the wall panels to run vertically? It should be okay to install your panels long-side up. If you use adhesive, your finish nailer should work fine also.

Yes, the seams will be run vertically on the vertical walls. That's not an issue since those walls are on 16" centers and every seam/end will be supported by studs. But I don't plan to use glue, as I may want to take a panel down some day. I figure either the finish nailer or stapler will work fine on the vertical walls.



But as I said in my original post, I'm mostly concerned with the ceiling and knee walls, which has 24" centers. It will be ran perpendicular to the framing on the ceiling and knee walls. There is no blocking where the knee walls meet the vertical walls or flat ceiling, which will have seams. I'm wanting to know whether or not I should install blocking at those seams. Or if the 1x4 trim that will be installed underneath it will suffice. Also wondering whether the narrow crown staples or 15 ga finish nails are the better choice on the ceiling.

 

[Dahammer]

Some additional info/thoughts on the ceiling and knee walls. Instead of installing blocking, I thought about shooting a couple finish nails at opposing angles through the 1x4 trim boards and the ply-bead at the unblocked joints/seams. I'm thinking that may prevent the ply-bead from bowing upwards into the cavity. I've done that on sheet rock and it worked fine but never done it on thin plywood. The stuff appears to be pretty unstable.



On the ceiling and knee walls, I'll also be covering the joints/seams with 1/4" lattice, which will also cover the fastener heads. The only exposed fastener heads will be out in the field of the sheets. Given that, it just appears to me that the narrow crown staples would hold better than the 15 ga finish nails, but I'm not sure.


If I had a siding nail gun, I'd just use that but I don't.

 

[P C D]

Some additional info/thoughts on the ceiling and knee walls. Instead of installing blocking, I thought about shooting a couple finish nails at opposing angles through the 1x4 trim boards and the ply-bead at the unblocked joints/seams. I'm thinking that may prevent the ply-bead from bowing upwards into the cavity. I've done that on sheet rock and it worked fine but never done it on thin plywood. The stuff appears to be pretty unstable.



On the ceiling and knee walls, I'll also be covering the joints/seams with 1/4" lattice, which will also cover the fastener heads. The only exposed fastener heads will be out in the field of the sheets. Given that, it just appears to me that the narrow crown staples would hold better than the 15 ga finish nails, but I'm not sure.


If I had a siding nail gun, I'd just use that but I don't.

It would take me longer to figure out why you don't want to add that blocking than to add that blocking for you if I were your neighbor.

 

[chandler48]

If you don't add blocking that thin sheeting will fail between the 24" centers and it will look a mess. If you can, go up to a 3/8" T1-11 design product. It will have more stamina and should look good. I always put my panels up with 7/32" narrow crown staples in an according length to hold the product.

 

[Dahammer]

It would take me longer to figure out why you don't want to add that blocking than to add that blocking for you if I were your neighbor.

A few reasons. The building is already insulated with fiberglass batts and I do not want to take it out. The knee walls are 2x4 with R13 batts and rafter vents, so there is very very little room for adding blocking. In fact I looked at it last night and adding them would likely compress the rafter vents to where they are useless.


The only way I see to do it with support underneath the plywood would be to fur out at least the knee walls with 1x furring strips. I can do that but I'll have to move the light boxes down due to the additional depth. The original plan was to use corrugated metal on the knee walls and ceiling, which would work fine but my BIL changed his freaking mind after the insulation was installed!!

 

[Dahammer]

If you don't add blocking that thin sheeting will fail between the 24" centers and it will look a mess. If you can, go up to a 3/8" T1-11 design product. It will have more stamina and should look good. I always put my panels up with 7/32" narrow crown staples in an according length to hold the product.

Thanks! That never occurred to me. I'll see what I can find. So you think it would work without backing on the 24" centers?

 

[Dahammer]

Lowe's has the T1-11 rough sawn siding for about the same price but the installation instructions don't mention ceiling installs so I'm somewhat hesitant. It does say it can be installed on 24" centers on walls though, as long as you turn the strength axis perpendicular to the framing. I'm going to go take a look at it though because I'd much rather do that as to install furring strips.


https://pdf.lowes.com/installationguides/081999104528_install.pdf

 

[chandler48]

Yes, you would turn the ceiling perpendicular to the strength axis along the joists. It is fine for ceilings and great for walls.