[jkhicks3]

Hi all - I'm new here but hoping you all can help me out. I'll preface this with we had 2 contractors out who said this wall would be non-load bearing since it runs parallel to the floor and ceiling joists. We have a perpendicular wall that is obviously load bearing, but I'm wondering if this wall is "sharing" some of the roof weight because of the pictures below.

First picture shows the wall that we want to come out, ripped open. The finished wall in the picture is the load bearing wall.

Next picture is my attic - notice the ridge support beam coming down straight in the middle of the attic. This beam is coming down about 7 inches away from the load bearing wall (picture 4) and is sitting on a flat beam ceiling joist (picture 3) that is the top of the wall I want to take down. This flat board does not run all the way across and is not joined with the ceiling joist that is sitting on top of the load bearing wall going to the front of my house.

Was I led astray by the initial contractors that came out to look at taking this wall out? We've already committed to the project by buying and hanging new cabinets (expanding our kitchen).

Thanks all!

 

[Nealtw]

I am glad you asked, it is not so much load bearing but it does have a purpose.
The ceiling joist are going the wrong way to hold the exterior walls from splaying out under the weight of the rafters. So at the very least you will want to add rafter ties from rafter to rafter in the attic. Should be 2x4 nailed to the rafters and can be set on the joists and nailed down about every four feet. Then we can look at anything else that wall is doing.

 

[nauti1]

Actually, from the pictures it doesn't appear to be a load bearing wall as was stated by NealtW that the wall is parallel to the ceiling joists.

I hope I'm not out of line with this comment, I just read your thread and the first thing that hit me when I saw the attic pictures is that the collar/roof ties are few and far between, plus I've never seen a ridge beam supported in that manner. Perhaps it's a regional thing where snow load is not a fact, but...?

In the NE collar ties are fastened to each rafter and they are located 1/3 down the peak height from the bottom of the ridge beam. As noted before, the collar ties should run parallel to the rafters and are used, in addition to the ceiling joist that are placed on top of the exterior double plate wall, to tie & hold the rafters together, as well as to prevent the exterior walls from spreading apart.

Additionally, a “knee” wall is frequently used to provide additional support & stability on wider homes with large roofs. This is very important in snow areas where the snow load can really add up, especially when heavy snow melts & turns to ice and winds are strong, particularly in a blizzard situation.

Typical construction in the NH area of multi-story homes:

• Ridge Beams - 14" LVL
• Roof Rafters - 12"
• Collar Ties - 8"
• Floor Joists - 10"
• Ceiling Joists - 8"
• Exterior Walls - 6"

The above comments would not typically apply in those areas of the country where single level houses are the norm and are located in hazard free areas. By hazard free I mean the snow belt, earthquake prone zones, tornado/hurricane prone areas, etc. In these areas much stricter construction codes are in place to help prove protection against these potential hazards.

 

[jkhicks3]

Thank you both for your reply. Sounds like either way I should get the contractors back out here to look at what we should do with the ridge support (is that the proper term?)

nauti1 - Thank you for your comments on the attic space, I certainly don't take offense as I didn't build the house This is a 1970's build in NC. This portion of our house is single story. I peaked in the attic above the 2 story section and the supports don't look much different. Perhaps that was code back in the day when this house was built.

 

[AndyGump]

No-one has yet mentioned that there is a let-in brace in the wall that the OP wants to remove.
The let-in brace in there for bracing or shear. That is an issue that needs to be addressed before taking down the wall.

Andy.

 

[Nealtw]

No-one has yet mentioned that there is a let-in brace in the wall that the OP wants to remove.
The let-in brace in there for bracing or shear. That is an issue that needs to be addressed before taking down the wall.

Andy.

I had a question about the direction of the joist if they are running the wrong way the wall would be the rafter tie.

 

[AndyGump]

I believe he said that the wall is running parallel to the ceiling joists.

I have seen this kind of framing before but usually, there are actual rafter ties parallel with and connected to the rafters every 4 feet just above the ceiling joists.

This is a bit of an odd one. The bracing from ridge board to whatever below may have simply been there for racking during construction until the roof sheeting was applied. I don't know why they would leave them there though.

Andy.

 

[ront02769]

Lo5s of opinions...so I’ll add mine....and start off by saying that I live in New England. First of, RAFTER ties are in the bottom third of the rafters and work with the ceiling joists to keep the walls from COLLAR ties, which are what the op shows, are intended to keep the TOP of the rafters from coming apart during unbalanced loads (wind, etc)....and they are not required to be installed at every rafter. Second, can’t tell whether that is a ridge BEAM which carries some of the load of the roof and thus requires support.....or a ridge BOARD....which is just a nailing surface for the top of the rafters....which does NOT need support as it doesn’t carry a load. The long diagonal bracing from the gable end down to the ceiling joists is required and meant to stay....at least where I am (and I know that since I just had to climb up into an attic and install them by the building inspector a few months back.

 

[carpdad]

The braces look like they're doing work. But they can be relocated, even if at an angle to the main supporting wall. What did the carpenters say about it?
You have a ridge board, not a beam. Board stays up because rafters are holding it (top of a triangle), but you don't have the base of a triangle (usually ceiling joists). And not sure if your rafters are 2x4 or at least 2x6. Also not sure if that would have spread out your walls or if there is something else holding the walls parallel or just happened to work. But I'd clear away some of the insulation and take a good look. You may want to add rafter ties (bottom part of the rafters) as well as additional ridge board. Usual framing is ceiling and rafter joists go in same direction and tie together to make a triangle. Again, looks like your ceiling joists are in different direction but not sure. With the main beam going along with the ridge board, I'm not sure why ceiling joists are in wrong direction. Make sure. Did the carpenters go into the attic and actually count the ceiling joists? It almost has to be that way.

 

[jkhicks3]

Perhaps my pictures are slightly misleading. The ceiling joists are running the correct way and connect with the rafters. The ceiling joists connect and overlap on top of the load bearing wall. The wall I want to take down is parallel to the ceiling joist.

In the case of my roof - aren't the ceiling joists my rafter ties?

I'm in NC with not a lot of snow. Also this is in a single story section of the house.

Considering the option of adding a rafter tie on the rafter associated with this wall to replace the support that was created by the wall and the let in brace.

Or replacing the current flat board with a 2x6 on end like the rest of the ceiling joists.

Also, confirming that the board I was concerned about is not a ridge BEAM, just a board - it's a 2x4 secured with 2 nails at either end and is not even touching the ceiling joist that it's connected to.

 

[Nealtw]

On the safe side you could replace the 2x4 with one going to the load bearing wall
If you are looking for a flat ceiling I would cut back some on each side of the wall as there will be a build up if filler where the old inside corner were.
I would just remove the wall and yes a ceiling joist is a rafter tie if it is in the right direction.