We recently bought a 40 year old home which we are remodeling. Part of our remodel has been switching out all of the old yellow switches and plates for white. While doing so, we've run into an issue. In our kitchen, the over head light is controlled by two switches and (I assume) the light is in the middle on the circuit. We changed out the switch on one end of the room (assumed to be the first switch in the circuit) with a standard three way switch. We connected the wires exactly how they were on the old switch and now the other switch will only work if the new one is in the "up" position. This was not an issue before. There is also another switch in the house that has the same issue but it was that way before we moved in. I'd like to fix both if we can.
One switch controlling another!!
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If you have old switches you took out, look carefully at terminal (screw?) color.
A light (silverish) screw is the common. If one looks reddish, it is one of the 2 travelers. The last should be blackish, the other traveler.
There really is no standard on a standard 3 way switch that defines where each type terminal should be.
You might be able to figure out the layout of the old switch and how it is different on the new switch.
You can try: On one switch, swap the location of the red and black wires. If it blows the circuit immediately, something else may be wrong and you will have to figure out which wire goes where.
Always take a pic with phone or whatever before starting a project.
A light (silverish) screw is the common. If one looks reddish, it is one of the 2 travelers. The last should be blackish, the other traveler.
There really is no standard on a standard 3 way switch that defines where each type terminal should be.
You might be able to figure out the layout of the old switch and how it is different on the new switch.
You can try: On one switch, swap the location of the red and black wires. If it blows the circuit immediately, something else may be wrong and you will have to figure out which wire goes where.
Always take a pic with phone or whatever before starting a project.
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On a 3-way switch, the "identified terminal" is the common terminal... the other two identical looking ones are the travelers. The common terminal is the only one you need to get wired to the correct wire.
The terminal position/relative location can vary between manufacturers and especially with older ones so take heed.
ps: You can't wire it wrong and cause it to create a short.
The terminal position/relative location can vary between manufacturers and especially with older ones so take heed.
ps: You can't wire it wrong and cause it to create a short.
This gets everybody the first time they deal with 3-way switches.
You carefully move upper left to upper left, lower right to lower right etc. "Surely that must be standard, right?"
Except actually, what matters is the screw colors, and/or the word "Common". And the positions of the 2 brass and 1 black screw are randomized on every switch! I am not kidding!
Roll it back to the switch before, just as you did it originally. Make sure it works. Then take careful note of the travelers (brass screws) vs common (black screw). Harper's thing is to mark the traveler wires with yellow electrical tape; there's really no need to distinguish them *from each other*, and 2 yellow wires is highly distinctive in any junction box.
You can *often* work it out with the power of logic: Travelers are always in the same cable. So if you have 2 wires in 1 cable and 1 wire in the other, you got it
By the way, travelers can be ANY color - there is no color code for travelers (or to be more precise, there *are* color codes for the remaining wire depending on where in the circuit you are, and the travelers get the 2 leftovers.) Hence my yellow tape.
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No! The Common terminal on a 3-2ay is (usually) Black!
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There are 1 wire cables???:surprise:This gets everybody the first time they deal with 3-way switches.
You carefully move upper left to upper left, lower right to lower right etc. "Surely that must be standard, right?"
Except actually, what matters is the screw colors, and/or the word "Common". And the positions of the 2 brass and 1 black screw are randomized on every switch! I am not kidding!
Roll it back to the switch before, just as you did it originally. Make sure it works. Then take careful note of the travelers (brass screws) vs common (black screw). Harper's thing is to mark the traveler wires with yellow electrical tape; there's really no need to distinguish them *from each other*, and 2 yellow wires is highly distinctive in any junction box.
You can *often* work it out with the power of logic: Travelers are always in the same cable. So if you have 2 wires in 1 cable and 1 wire in the other, you got it
By the way, travelers can be ANY color - there is no color code for travelers (or to be more precise, there *are* color codes for the remaining wire depending on where in the circuit you are, and the travelers get the 2 leftovers.) Hence my yellow tape.
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8,179 Posts
I just removed some old 3 way switches that had all 3 screws the same color; on the back of the switches it said “common” by one screw in tiny letters, barely legible to my old eyes. As said, there is no standard location for the common terminal.
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3,257 Posts
There are cables where 1 wire goes to a 3-way. Try to keep up
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3,257 Posts
:biggrin2: Jethrow Bodine was all knowed up on ciphering! I was also an Ernest T. Bass math fan, his method being more physical.
Way back when I was a kid in the 6th grade, and that's waaaaay back, Mrs. Ruby Hirons taught me how to calculate factorials and also how to the calculate square root of any number using an adaptation of long division. I can't say that I've ever really needed to use either of those skills. You wouldn't want to know how many different ways you can rack 15 pool balls would you? I didn't think so...
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