[bcemail]

I am replacing the deck boards and railings on my deck, and trying to leave the support structure as much in place as possible. I think it was built about 15 years ago. Not sure if there were permits, inspections, etc., or not.

1. I noticed that where some of the joists attach to the house, they are not flush. It doesn't look like they have moved, it looks like the ledger board just isn't perpendicular to level (if that makes sense). I've attached a pic. Anything to be done? It has survived this long, but.... I was thinking of maybe a short piece of 2x8 attached at an angle to the joist and then flush to the ledger with a new joist hanger? Not sure if this would even help.

2. Some of the joist have damage from the nails and screws used and now pulled out. I attached a pic of something typical where the surface is not as solid as it was (pic is blurry, but the light part is newly exposed wood). I am topping the joists with joist tape, but should I add some 2x8 to the side of the joist to provide a better surface for screwing? Or since most of the joists are good, just try and hit the good part of these and move on?

3. The joists were toenailed to the beams, but I was considering putting in hurricane ties. It would be 50 ties, 500 screws, and many hammer swings. Worth the time? Again, they don't seem to have moved much, but I have found some corrosion of the toenails.

Thanks so much for the help! Trying to battle the rain to get this done!

 

[joecaption]

You have several issues going on that we can see so far, there's no flashing over the rim joist and up under the siding for one.
Something has to have moved a lot on the other end of that deck, those joist are not even nailed in place any more.
Post sunk or rotted out? Undersized joist that have sagged in the middle?
What's up with all the saw dust on top of the ledger?

 

[bcemail]

The saw dust is just from me cutting the railings down. So that's one problem down. I plan on adding flashing once I realized there wasn't any. Something else to add to the job...
For the joists and the ledger, the joists are level in places or maybe slightly sloped away from the house, but the ledger is also sloped away from the joists at the top. Looking at the bottom of the ledger there may be aluminum siding underneath. There is something there that's metal and I don't think it's flashing. I would've thought that bolting the ledger on would flatten any siding underneath. Is it possible that siding would push the bottom out?
Anything to be done in this situation? I really don't want to take all the joists off and redo the ledger. Maybe I can cut the siding away and try and tighten the bolts?
Not what I wanted to find!

 

[Daniel Holzman]

Those joist hangers do not look like conventional joist hangers, I think they are Simpson hangers for a different connection. If all the joists are that far from the ledger, they look like the joists are ready to fall off. I can't tell from the picture how the ledger is attached, but improper flashing is one of the most common problems on a deck, and from your description it sounds like the ledger may have been attached over aluminum siding. That would be incorrect, the siding needs to be removed, ice and water shield installed between the ledger and the framing, and metal flashing installed over the ledger.

Improper flashing generally leads to rot over time, which is a serious problem both for the deck and the house. Improper joist hangers can lead to failure of the joists, needless to say a potentially serious problem. Best to correct all the problems while you are working on the deck, if that means tearing it down and rebuilding, that is unfortunate, but may be necessary.

 

[bcemail]

The ledger is attached with through bolts. You can just see one of them in the upper corner of the pic. Just noticed the pics posted sideways. Sorry! I haven't gone in the crawl space yet but I'm guessing I should be able to access them on the other side.
Any chance it would work to try and replace the ledger without taking down all the joists? The joists are only toenailed to the beam so I may try and remove those nails just so the joists can be nudged over to let me access the ledger. Then add flashing etc.
Not surprised I found problems like this. Always opening a can of worms with this house. The past owners cobbled everything together and not very well at that.
Thanks again for all the help. Hoping to be able to get this fixed before summer ends...

 

[roobinsteen]

There's no way you can address the lack of flashing without taking off the ledger-the whole point is that there must be flashing behind the ledger. I know it's a drag, I did the same thing with my deck a year ago. I temporarily supported the joists with a 2x4 wall underneath, removed the ledger, patched rotted rim joist sections (due to the lack of ledger flashing), and reattached a new ledger with ledgerlok screws (as opposed to conventional lag screws, ledgerloks are easier). About your joists that don't quite reach the ledger, I had one joist on my deck that was like that. I fixed that joist by sistering another 2x8 to the short joist, making sure that the sister fully reached the ledger. I used a double joist hanger where both joists met the ledger. This was ok for a single "short" joist, but if all or most of your joists are like that, that's a different story.

 

[woodworkbykirk]

if the deck is in as rough shape as described and that age. i woiuld be more inclined to just tear it down and rebuild... the amount of time youll spend messing around trying to fix it could youd have a new deck up anyway

 

[bcemail]

The joists and posts and beams are in good shape so I'd like to keep them as is. And the time and money to put new in would be to much.

Thanks for the 2x4 support idea. I think I'll try the Ledgerlok screws. Are they as strong as using bolts or lags?

Couple more questions:
For the bolt holes in the house framing and ledger board (if I reuse it) do I need to fill those with anything? Should I consider the ledger shot since it has bolt holes, nail holes from the joist hangers, etc?

I see that some people recommend spacers between the ledger and the house, using a couple washers or small pieces of wood. Good idea?

When I put in the flashing, should I cut notches so it goes over the joists? Or just put the joists up against it?

Is the layer behind the ledger and under the siding just house wrap? Or some other specific product?

 

[bcemail]

I have done a bunch of work on the deck and the ledger. I disconnected all the joists from the old ledger and pulled them back to give me some room. Then I started removing all the lag screws holding on the ledger. Thought my driver was going to melt trying to get the rusty lags out but we made it. As I thought, the ledger was put on over the old aluminum siding. Since siding is wider at the bottom, the ledger was not flat. So I ripped all that off.

Pulled up the siding and moved the house wrap. I've now put up a couple layers of weather seal,a drip edge, and some more weather seal. Just got the new ledger up using Ledgerloks, which were great! Joists have been taped on top and are ready to be reattached. Also had to reroute some crazy electrical work. I actually may be able to put down some deck boards soon!

Luckily everyone around here was able to answer most of my questions. So here's another one:
I'm pretty sure my posts are buried, and there is clay soil up against them covering the concrete. Should I did them out a out something else around them? Maybe some gravel? I'm afraid to investigate but hoping I don't find rot. Anything else I can do to help extend their lives?

Thanks again for all the help!


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