[jstluise]

I'm tearing out my front porch deck and starting fresh. The original deck, while it feels solid, is poorly constructed and doesn't follow much of a building code. I won't go into details on how bad it is, but some of it is hilariously bad (see how the center beam supports are hanging in mid air?).

Here is what I'm tearing out:

My plan is to redo it in a similar layout, but with proper supports under the center beam and the right side of the lower deck. And a proper ledger attachment to the house, with that being the only connection to the house (small gap everywhere else the deck meets the house).

I'm looking for advice on how to properly support (i.e. to code) the center beam and right side of the lower deck. Ideally I'd have a center beam run the entire length of the lower deck, but I'd like to reuse the beam I have if possible. And getting a footing right next to the house may not be easy/possible. Also, I need to have the upper deck rim joist pushed back farther than it is to account for a fascia board and decking overhand (so it blends with the house corner trim better).

A couple ideas:

Option A - This isn't to code, and like I said getting a footing that close to the house would be a challenge.

Option B - I think having another beam is more to code. It's basically like supporting a freestanding deck.

Thoughts and advice is appreciated!

 

[Nealtw]

Have you also considered how you are going to do the flashing properly for the siding?

what are the two things sticking in the ground under the deck

 

[jstluise]

Have you also considered how you are going to do the flashing properly for the siding?

what are the two things sticking in the ground under the deck

Thanks for the reply. Just to be clear, that picture is the current deck I'm tearing out. The two things are beam support brackets/post and they aren't sticking into the ground, but rather just hanging in mid air. This is one of those hilariously bad issues. Looks like the builders began to dig out holes for footings and support posts but ultimately decided nailing the ledger and rim joists directly to the house (over the siding, without flashing) was good enough. :huh:

As far as the flashing goes, my plan was to only flash where the upper deck ledger attaches to the house. The remaining deck structure would have a gap between it and the house for airflow, so I figured flashing wouldn't be required there?

 

[Nealtw]

Thanks for the reply. Just to be clear, that picture is the current deck I'm tearing out. The two things are beam support brackets/post and they aren't sticking into the ground, but rather just hanging in mid air. This is one of those hilariously bad issues. Looks like the builders began to dig out holes for footings and support posts but ultimately decided nailing the ledger and rim joists directly to the house (over the siding, without flashing) was good enough. :huh:

As far as the flashing goes, my plan was to only flash where the upper deck ledger attaches to the house. The remaining deck structure would have a gap between it and the house for airflow, so I figured flashing wouldn't be required there?

The way I see it you one support for the bottom right corner in this picture.

You likely already have water damage to the walls below this so it should be opened and looked at I would hang it properly off the house.

I would cut that trim and remove all the siding between my red lines.

 

[jstluise]

The way I see it you one support for the bottom right corner in this picture.

You likely already have water damage to the walls below this so it should be opened and looked at I would hang it properly off the house.

I would cut that trim and remove all the siding between my red lines.

The one existing beam (farthest from house) is properly supported on two posts, so I plan to reuse it as-is (at least for now, we'll see when I remove everything).

Luckily most of the deck is covered, except for one area that did have water damage (because the rim joists were nailed directly to the siding). I already cut out all the rot and will repair that section. Everywhere else looks unaffected, but I'll inspect it better once the structure is removed.

So I guess my main question is do I need flashing around the entire perimeter of the deck (except at the ledger) if I leave a gap for airflow between the structure and siding? Like this:

In reality I'm only concerned about protecting the area that was damaged, since it took 30 years to get this bad. However, I'd like to follow code on the rebuild. I've seen other decks leave gaps between the house and structure in a situations like mine, but just didn't see anything specified in DCA6.

I appreciate your help!

 

[Nealtw]

The one existing beam (farthest from house) is properly supported on two posts, so I plan to reuse it as-is (at least for now, we'll see when I remove everything).

Luckily most of the deck is covered, except for one area that did have water damage (because the rim joists were nailed directly to the siding). I already cut out all the rot and will repair that section. Everywhere else looks unaffected, but I'll inspect it better once the structure is removed.

View attachment 593669

So I guess my main question is do I need flashing around the entire perimeter of the deck (except at the ledger) if I leave a gap for airflow between the structure and siding? Like this:

View attachment 593671

In reality I'm only concerned about protecting the area that was damaged, since it took 30 years to get this bad. However, I'd like to follow code on the rebuild. I've seen other decks leave gaps between the house and structure in a situations like mine, but just didn't see anything specified in DCA6.

I appreciate your help!

The height distance between the two decks should not be more than 7 3/4"



I will give you a run down of what I would do and you can see what you think.
You want ledger flashing even in protected areas for the times that water does get there even if it only the occasional cleaning with a hose.



To do free standing would have to deal with footing or just pour a slab to work off.

 

[jstluise]

The height distance between the two decks should not be more than 7 3/4"

I will give you a run down of what I would do and you can see what you think.
You want ledger flashing even in protected areas for the times that water does get there even if it only the occasional cleaning with a hose.

To do free standing would have to deal with footing or just pour a slab to work off.

Great! Looking forward to your run down.

Yes, for sure I'll have the ledger flashed, even though it is very protected. My question was about if flashing is required at the rim joists even if I leave a gap (1/2"-3/4") between the house and rim joists.

No problem with the step, it will be less than the max allowed (7 3/4").

I want to avoid free-standing. The ledger option is better since I'll have a good connection to my house rim joist (already confirmed from the crawl space it is located in the right spot).

 

[Nealtw]

Great! Looking forward to your run down.

Yes, for sure I'll have the ledger flashed, even though it is very protected. My question was about if flashing is required at the rim joists even if I leave a gap (1/2"-3/4") between the house and rim joists.

No problem with the step, it will be less than the max allowed (7 3/4").

I want to avoid free-standing. The ledger option is better since I'll have a good connection to my house rim joist (already confirmed from the crawl space it is located in the right spot).

Lower deck I shortened the beam because it is ugly but it could extend out to the green joist and the bottom could be cut back on an angle to help it hide.

Notice how the outside joist caps the rim and the ledger so you don't need a hanger.

The ledger on the left and the one that runs in longer give you a good base to hang the double across the back The grey bits are hangers and on the outside I put a paint grade 2x that hangs down 2 inches lower than the rim joists.

 

[Nealtw]

We would notch the ledger so siding can be tucked up under it

and this is what we usually do to the beam with the paint grade 2x on the outside.

 

[Nealtw]

I have added the asphalt peal & stick to protect the framing. and ledger flashing

 

[jstluise]

Thanks for the details!

So if I understand correctly, you have the entire perimeter of the deck secured to the house like the original deck, but of course secured better (not over siding) and with flashing. I like this option because I won't have to pour any additional footings. The downside is I'll have to deal with siding and flashing everything which wouldn't be too bad.

I think the alternative would be what I outlined before with only 1 ledger attachment and gaps everywhere else. But that would require pouring some footings.

Good idea about shortening the ugly beam. I do plan to have some sort of deck skirting, maybe a stone veneer, so I'll be able to hide everything underneath.

 

[Nealtw]

Then the upper deck is straight forward 2x8 deck with the front rim directly above just one of the double below. With a couple blocks on the backside to hole the two decks together

Then after the lower decking is done dress the upper rim with a paint grade 1x?

Hangers and asphalt tape.


Thoughts?

 

[Nealtw]

Thanks for the details!

So if I understand correctly, you have the entire perimeter of the deck secured to the house like the original deck, but of course secured better (not over siding) and with flashing. I like this option because I won't have to pour any additional footings. The downside is I'll have to deal with siding and flashing everything which wouldn't be too bad.

I think the alternative would be what I outlined before with only 1 ledger attachment and gaps everywhere else. But that would require pouring some footings.

Good idea about shortening the ugly beam. I do plan to have some sort of deck skirting, maybe a stone veneer, so I'll be able to hide everything underneath.

Simpson's now has a screw that they say are ledger screws I would thin if you can get 3 into every stud you would be strong enough,

All hangers and screws or nails have to be HDG or other wise treted for the treated lumber and NO aluminum flashing.


https://www.strongtie.com/strongdri...dws-db_screw/p/strong-drive-sdws-timber-screw

 

[jstluise]

Thanks again for all the info! Looks like I have a couple options.

While attaching a ledger to anything but the house rim joist isn't to code, anything I do will be better than the original deck...I mean, they just nailed the thing in place, I'm surprised they hit any studs. And good idea about the thinner ledger screws.

Part of me would rather pour a few footings and support it with beams (with a single ledger, gaps everywhere else), rather than dealing with attaching everything to the house and flashing it, but in the end the latter would probably be less work.

Looks like I have something to think about as I get this thing torn apart!

 

[Nealtw]

Thanks again for all the info! Looks like I have a couple options.

While attaching a ledger to anything but the house rim joist isn't to code, anything I do will be better than the original deck...I mean, they just nailed the thing in place, I'm surprised they hit any studs. And good idea about the thinner ledger screws.

Part of me would rather pour a few footings and support it with beams (with a single ledger, gaps everywhere else), rather than dealing with attaching everything to the house and flashing it, but in the end the latter would probably be less work.

Looks like I have something to think about as I get this thing torn apart!

I don't think it is against code to have it free standing:wink2: