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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hello!
I'm installing a brand new bathroom in my basement! I'm a DIYer, so I'm looking for some experienced advice with the layout. I've only done remodels, not new installs.
I'm thinking a pocket door will be necessary to save space, and maybe even making it a wet bath?
Constraints:
1. It's a very small space. Any wider, and the hallway becomes too small (less than 36"). Any longer and I have HVAC in the way (see below)
2. There's an 8" duct overhead that can't be raised (perpendicular to floor joints). I was thinking I'd put half in the wall and box the other half in the shower. Thoughts?
3. The wall on the top of the image is concrete foundation. Previous owners didn't fer it out. It's just glued-on drywall. Ferring out to have plumbing/electrical in that wall reduce the width.
4. The 4" main drain is nearby (space behind toilet), but very shallow. Only about 2.5" deep. So putting the toilet further away might be an issue.
5. I'd like to fit a toilet, sink, shower, and stackable washer/dryer it at all possible.

I've also attached a rough mock-up of the plumbing. I've hired out most of my plumbing, but I thought I'd give this a go. I don't really understand venting, so let me know if you see anything wrong here.

Rectangle Font Parallel Wood Pattern


Rectangle Map Land lot Slope Font


Ecoregion Rectangle Font Wood Slope
 

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Get a potty with a corner tank, rotate it 45* clockwise and put it in the corner. Pocket doors are troublesome … swing the door out, hinge on the left. Move the door to the left, make room for a towel bar where the door is now. Consider adding lots of blocking in the walls for grab bars.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Get a potty with a corner tank, rotate it 45* clockwise and put it in the corner. Pocket doors are troublesome … swing the door out, hinge on the left. Move the door to the left, make room for a towel bar where the door is now. Consider adding lots of blocking in the walls for grab bars.
The corner toilet is a great idea! I didn't even know they make those, though they look like they're pretty hard to find. I was worried about leg room in front of the toilet and that would take care of it.
I was also worried about the open shower being so close to the door, especially a pocket door that leaves an opening inside the wall, so it would make sense to move it. But designwise, I've read that you don't want the toilet to be the first thing you see. Thoughts there?
 

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But designwise, I've read that you don't want the toilet to be the first thing you see. Thoughts there?
You are talking subtleties of design when you have a very "coarse situation", if that makes sense. It's like you've got a broken leg and you're worrying about using a white cast because it's after Labor Day and you're not supposed to wear white after Labor Day. You have a challenging situation, so just focus on the function of the bathroom. Anyone who uses it will care much more about that than what they see first walking in.

For example, I'm not sure what code is in your area but I believe most codes require 15" from a wall to the center of the drain, and it looks to me like you've only got 13".

I hear what is being said about the pocket door, but I think I'd rather have a pocket door than a door that opens into that hallway.
 

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Another option may be narrow in-swing French doors. You'd have to close the doors anyway to use the toilet or shower, and can just leave them open if you just need to duck in to wash your hands.

You can try to find narrow doors, or you may be able to adapt a bifold door by unhinging the two doors.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
You are talking subtleties of design when you have a very "coarse situation", if that makes sense. It's like you've got a broken leg and you're worrying about using a white cast because it's after Labor Day and you're not supposed to wear white after Labor Day. You have a challenging situation, so just focus on the function of the bathroom. Anyone who uses it will care much more about that than what they see first walking in.

For example, I'm not sure what code is in your area but I believe most codes require 15" from a wall to the center of the drain, and it looks to me like you've only got 13".

I hear what is being said about the pocket door, but I think I'd rather have a pocket door than a door that opens into that hallway.
Haha nice analogy, I hear what you're saying. I installed the plumbing to the toilet yesterday. There are 16" to the current wall and 12" behind. I've read that I need 20-24" in front (depending on what code you fall under? I'm in Utah so I assume it's 24"). Based on bird's eye view plan, I don't have it. But if I do a pedestal sink, then measuring from the floor, I think I would. Not sure how an inspector would look at it.
I've installed a pocket door before. It'll only be a few extra steps instead of framing a new wall there.
 

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I installed the plumbing to the toilet yesterday. There are 16" to the current wall and 12" behind.
OK I guess I misinterpreted your drawing. It shows 2' 2" across, and I assumed the toilet was centered in that space, but I guess not. At 16" you're fine.
 

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The only thing that can intrude into the 15" is a toilet paper dispenser. Inspector will measure to the edge of the lav, not the pedestal

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The edge? It should be measured to the center of the drain, no? So you can put a toilet in a 30" space. For example, my toilet is in a 35" space, and the bowl is 15" wide, so obviously the math doesn't work out from that perspective.
 

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A toilet space is measured from the edge of the lav not the drain. And from the face of walls. So you need 30" min. clear space. The toilet will then center within the 30" giving you 15" each side of the toilet center line. This minimum code. The 15" is really the dimension to use. 14" on one side and 16" on the other of the WC is noncompliant
 

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Thanks for these images. I'm curious about how the inspector will measure the front 21" clearance. Rim of toilet to rim of lav? Or base of toilet to base of lav?
Rim of toilet to the closest obstruction
 

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A toilet space is measured from the edge of the lav not the drain.
This doesn't make any sense. If you center a toilet in a 30" space, you are obviously not getting 15" on each side of the toilet because the toilet itself takes up about 15". Measuring from the edge of the toilet is an irrelevant measurement.

IRC 2705.1 and UPC 407.6 clearly state the 15" clearance measurement it taken from the center of the toilet, i.e. the center of the drain. This is why a toilet is allowed in a 30" space, and in a 30" space it's impossible to get 15" clearance from the edge of a toilet to the wall.

 

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A toilet space is measured from the edge of the lav not the drain. And from the face of walls. So you need 30" min. clear space. The toilet will then center within the 30" giving you 15" each side of the toilet center line. This minimum code. The 15" is really the dimension to use. 14" on one side and 16" on the other of the WC is noncompliant

This doesn't make any sense. If you center a toilet in a 30" space, you are obviously not getting 15" on each side of the toilet because the toilet itself takes up about 15". Measuring from the edge of the toilet is an irrelevant measurement.

IRC 2705.1 and UPC 407.6 clearly state the 15" clearance measurement it taken from the center of the toilet, i.e. the center of the drain. This is why a toilet is allowed in a 30" space, and in a 30" space it's impossible to get 15" clearance from the edge of a toilet to the wall.

You don't measure to WC drains, you measure center of fixture. I don't believe you will find the word drain in any part of a toilet. You will find trap seal, trap, trap outlet, rim, and so on. Drains are pipes receiving waste from fixtures.
Not once did I reference a WC drain
Reread my post. I basically described the image above.
 

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You don't measure to WC drains, you measure center of fixture. I don't believe you will find the word drain in any part of a toilet. You will find trap seal, trap, trap outlet, rim, and so on. Drains are pipes receiving waste from fixtures.
Not once did I reference a WC drain
Reread my post. I basically described the image above.
What you said in your post is "A toilet space is measured from the edge of the lav not the drain. And from the face of walls."

First of all, "lav" (meaning lavatory I assume) has so many definitions no one should even be using it in a discussion because it's just too confusing. At first I thought you were talking about the lavatory meaning the toilet. In the context of this bathroom, it could mean the toilet, the sink, or the bathroom itself.

But even accounting for that confusion, the center of the toilet is the exact same geometrical spot (in 2 dimensions) as the center of the drain. The center of the drain is the easiest measurement to make (obviously) before the toilet is installed. Even if the toilet were there it's easier to measure the center of the drain. In any case, all this has to be determined before the toilet is installed anyway so in practice this is the point you measure from. When planning a bathroom, people don't bring in a toilet and put it in place to measure from the center point of it. They always measure from the center of the drain. When houses are built, the toilet normally doesn't even exist yet and they don't know what it will be (other than the offset behind.) If you are only allowed to measure from the toilet as you suggest, no construction of bathrooms would ever get done. It's measured to the center of the drain, because the drain is the first thing installed and you have to know where to install it!

In other words, exactly what is happening with this bathroom build here.
 

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I'm through Jeff. You seem to pick apart posts often and it gets old.

If the OP has any thoughts or questions I'll gladly discuss with him

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I'm curious about how the inspector will measure the front 21" clearance. Rim of toilet to rim of lav? Or base of toilet to base of lav?
The 21" clearance in front of toilet will be measured from the toilet rim to the edge of the lavatory sink bowl, not the pedestal under the sink bowl. You need clearance to stand up and sit down, not just kneespace tucked under the lavatory sink bowl. Jeff, that's what EPlumber described in his Post #9, I think you may have switched the word "toilet" for "lav" in your head.

James, if you are starting fresh with a full basement remodel, you should just lay out a standard size bathroom, so you don't have to shimmy around. Eliminate the maze of hallways or plan better adjacencies, whatever is available in the rest of the basement not shown in the drawing. Also, from the pic it looks to me on the demo slab edge like a ~2" mudslab floor (old house but with new ABS pipe?). If true I have never seen anything built on top of a mudslab nor would I suggest it. Also also never seen a laundry box installed upside down.
 
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