[wguttrid]

Hi Guys,

Need some expertise on how to go about installing a 220V outlet in the garage to run a Lincoln 225/125 welder I am thinking of buying. Also as the garage currently only has one plug for the garage door opener I would like to have room to add two more 110v plugs and another 220/240v for an air compressor down the road.

The main service panel is in the basement and the garage is on the other side of a 1950 ranch style house. I am still planning just how I am going to run the wire (e.g up throu wall and into attic and into garage, out basement wall and run conduit to garage following eaves). I am still working on this but I am comfortable runing/fishing the wire once I figure out the run. I will be hiring an electrican for the hook-ups but before I contact an electrician I want to understand the different options.

I have taken a picture of the meter outside the house, which looks like 200a service.

I have also taken pictures of the service panel downstairs, it is an older federal pacific panel. The sticker mentions "Mains 100amp max". The main on/off switch states 100A so I guessing this is a 100a service panel.

Now I am looking at the most economical way of getting power to the garage for the welder and also enough headroom to put in other plugs in the garage. The wife and I are only planning on staying here for about five years so don't want to throw alot of money at it but at the same time for the next five years want to have a garage where I can work on stuff.

Please note I have limited electrical experince and I would only run the wires to help save some money, the electrcian would do the hook ups and rest of the install just afriad if I call someone right now they are going to quote somehting extremely high if I don't research it.

So guys what would everyone suggest I do???? Here are my ideas to toss around but not sure if feasible or not!
1.) Install a seperate 100A panel after the main meter. Thou not sure on what would be needed to do this.
2.) Install a sub-panel from the main service panel either in the garage or near the main panel. Not sure what size sub-panel can be pulled from the current main panel.
3.) Rip out the current 100a panel and have installed a 200 amp panel. But do I still need some sort sub-panel in the garage so I only need to fish one run of wires to the garage and distribute from the sub panel.

In a nutshell looking for the cheapest route but still haev capabilities of adding other things easily in the garage down the road as I need them.

Thanks for all the help guys, look forward to everyones idea.

 

[rrolleston]

I would look into getting the service upgraded.

 

[joecaption]

Hate to be the one to tell you but that panel has to go anyway.
Go with 200 amp up grage and run wiring for a sub panel in the garage.
http://www.usinspect.com/blog/federal-pacific-panels-and-associated-danger

 

[wguttrid]

Yes, leaning towards upgrading the service.

 

[wguttrid]

Maybe someonce can helps shed some light on this idea that I have been reading about and that is to go with a 325a double lug meter, which means you can run to panels parallel seperatly.

So going with this idea:
1.Would need to buy a 325a double lug meter socket. Not sure if hydro company would pay for this or I will.
Option A- Have installed one of those small cheap 100amp panels ($50-100)right next to my current panel in the basement that only has a few spots for breakers (kind of like a hot tub panel) and from this panel I could install another small 100a sub-panel ($50-100) in the shop.
Option B- Not sure if there is a such thing but instal next to the current basement federal panel one of those old school 100amp fuse breakers/disconnects/on-off switch (not sure what terminolgy to use) and from this put in a small 100amp subpanel in the garage

Not sure how much a 325a double lug meter socket will cost - guessing $200-300.

Curious on everyones thoughts?

 

[frenchelectrican]

Maybe someonce can helps shed some light on this idea that I have been reading about and that is to go with a 325a double lug meter, which means you can run to panels parallel seperatly.

So going with this idea:
1.Would need to buy a 325a double lug meter socket. Not sure if hydro company would pay for this or I will.
Option A- Have installed one of those small cheap 100amp panels ($50-100)right next to my current panel in the basement that only has a few spots for breakers (kind of like a hot tub panel) and from this panel I could install another small 100a sub-panel ($50-100) in the shop.
Option B- Not sure if there is a such thing but instal next to the current basement federal panel one of those old school 100amp fuse breakers/disconnects/on-off switch (not sure what terminolgy to use) and from this put in a small 100amp subpanel in the garage

Not sure how much a 325a double lug meter socket will cost - guessing $200-300.

Curious on everyones thoughts?

First of all did you ever done the load demand caluation to see how much load it will be used in your house plus garage?

The reason why I say this due IMO it kinda borderline for few reason.,

A) I do not know what size of the house you have
B) What major applanices you do have in there like stove , dryer etc
C) Garage size.

This will give you a basic guideline what to start and the load demand caluation will assit you properly what service size you will need.

Basically IMO just go with single 200 amp panel with plenty breaker slots. ( 30 or 42 space slot is most common size but there is other size as well )

That way if the demand caluations come up under 200 amp you are fine with this service size.

So that way you have plenty room for expandison when you get there.

325 amp double lug socket? that something I have not heard much in either USA or France but sure., the 320 class socket that is common either side of pond ( in USA or France )

Basically it is a 400 amp resdentail verison meter socket which it is rated for 320 amp contiounus and tempory 400 amp max.

Cost for that I know you mention 200-300 Euros/Dollars but all it depending if underground verison or overhead verison that will make the differnce.

And useally more higher than you qouted the price.

Also one more thing before I forget any more items check with your Hydro / inspectors to see what they do allow in your area due I know Hydro Quebec is very strict with this.


Merci,
Marc

 

[wguttrid]

Hi Frenchelectrician, yes I am working on a load demand study of the actual house.

The only big loads for the house are the oven/stove, a.c, and dryer. The water heater and furnance are gas. The house is a 1300 ft2 ranch house with single bay garage and basement.

Read last night how to calcuate the watts-va and will be putting together a matrix of everything in the house to come up with actual real loads for the house. The only thing I am not sure is which I need to read up on is once I have the VA for everything in the house right down to lighting and receptables and what are plugged in just not sure how to get real world number as not everything is on at the exact same time.

 

[AllanJ]

HiThe only thing I am not sure is which I need to read up on is once I have the VA for everything in the house right down to lighting and receptables and what are plugged in just not sure how to get real world number as not everything is on at the exact same time.

Finish the load calculation as described in the National Electric Code.

As far as getting a real world number, you will probably get as many different real world numbers as the number of articles you read up on plus the number of people you asked.

Your own real world number is probably more important than anyone else's, but use the NEC load calculation number if that is higher.

Of course yours is better than mine which is that you get from the NEC calculations plus the wattages (or VAs) of the tools and appliances that will be used at the same time and not yet taken into account after you finished the NEC calculations.