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With a tank or a tankless, the operational cost of natural gas will beat electric resistance heating pretty much every time. Operational cost of heat pump water heaters compared to natural gas apparently can go either way, depending on the gas and electricity prices in your location. The cost to get the heat pump system installed is much higher, though. Seems like in most cases it would only be worthwhile if the heat pump is one of the complete systems, which replaces the WH, furnace and A/C, although the chances of needing all 3 at the same times seems fairly unlikely.
Our local gas company used to charge about 40% over the cost of the gas itself per therm. Now they charge 2 to 3 times the cost of the gas per therm.
 

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Our local gas company used to charge about 40% over the cost of the gas itself per therm. Now they charge 2 to 3 times the cost of the gas per therm.
Everything used to be cheaper. Have you calculated the cost per watt/btu/therm of gas vs. electric for your utilities? When I did it for mine, it was about 6 to 1 more expensive to heat with electric resistance heating (at 80% efficiency for gas heating).
 

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Lifestyle also plays a part. I was determined to replace both of out tanks with tank-less, until I ran the numbers. We are retired, and home nearly all the time. There is no real savings under that scenario. When you are gone most of the day or even a good portion of it, there is some gain to the on demand, but not when the use is nearly continuous.
 

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Everything used to be cheaper. Have you calculated the cost per watt/btu/therm of gas vs. electric for your utilities? When I did it for mine, it was about 6 to 1 more expensive to heat with electric resistance heating (at 80% efficiency for gas heating).
My electric has been 12c a Kwh all in for as long as i remember. Gas only makes sense for me if i use it for home heat as well as the monthly meter charge alone is twice what i spend for hot water right now. I do install it in my rehabs and rentals though as it is nearly maintenance free.
 

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Most US homes use the hot water tank, which keeps 40 - 60 or so gallons of water hot 24x7.
Most UK homes use on-demand tankless heaters.
Just wondering why they are not popular in the US.
Electric Tankless require extensive electrical panel upgrades for most; and will incur a greater monthly expense unless its for only 1 or 2 people (not a big family); My suspicion is that heating water that quickly with electric heat is NOT a model for efficiency, for a lot of people (though it should work fine). I suspect it being more costly on power bills than a standard electric HWR. I've seen it done in small condos with limited space and no gas lines...The advantage being that it is a space saver.
Electric tanks are the most common and they work fine, they take up a bit of space; but if I was doing laundry and hot showers for a family of 5, I'd have a hard time thinking that any money would be saved with an electric tankless...so if not saving the planet or wallet why pay for a fancy tankless install and panel upgrade?
A GAS tankless HWR is a good way to go in my opinion. I would encourage spending a little more for the unit, because a cheap unit can have this effect where the sink hot water valve sometimes has to be open in addition to the shower valve; otherwise the unit stops making heat because it don't have enough cold water flowing through it. Back in the olden days before all the low flow toilets and shower nozzles, cheap units worked fine. A few extra dollars for a better unit is well worth it. We have a Noritz that's pretty good and also have a Rinnai. Rinnai is my favorite so far, I've never had a cold water sandwich (or whatever...) and it keeps up with any demand. I originally thought our Noritz was acting up, but then the shower valve started acting funny. When I replace the valve internals, it was like a completley different shower and Noritz worked great.
 

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I have always had tanks, 50 gal. Easy to replace easy to get parts (if needed), I usually replace every 10 yrs.
As I don't like emergency (have to do it now) weekend ,Sunday, holiday, bad weather etc.).
About 11 yrs ago I bought a Geyser add on heat pump by Nyle systems (no longer made) still works great saves me about 350 per yr in electric and helps dehumidify the basement.

I guess when it stops working I will have to replace it with one of the all-in-one hybrid tanks.
I had considered tankless many times, but could not justify the expense to change over, repair parts, or savings over a add on heat pump or a hybrid.
 

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I installed this NG 100 Gal AG Smith water heater in 2010 (actually a contractor installed it for me). What regular maintenance should I be doing, and how long should I expect it to last?
If you cannot find an existing thread on this topic, you should start one, rather than hijacking a thread on a different topic. You'll get better responses to your question, and you won't be distracting from the discussion here.
 

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My apologies, I won’t post on your forums again.
They're not my forums. They're here for everyone, including you. I wasn't trying to run you off; I just made a suggestion that would help you get answers to your question, and help those searching for answers or tryng to help with the question in this thread.
 

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The gas line from the gas company wouldn't need to be dug up. They might have to install a larger(higher CFH) gas meter, but not the gas line.
They would only have to increase the size of the regulator...the rest would be the same.. The pressure on gas lines is incredible. The larger regulator would match the max BTU requirements of the device it's supplying
 

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They would only have to increase the size of the regulator...the rest would be the same.. The pressure on gas lines is incredible. The larger regulator would match the max BTU requirements of the device it's supplying
Most residential service is usually at least 400 MBH. More then enough for a 200 MBH instant HWH and a furnace, a drier, and a range /oven depending on sizes.
 

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Your math works. From the post, I was not aware of the current BTU max input. If underrated, it’s the Regulator that’s increased, not the inbound piping or meter.
 

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Your math works. From the post, I was not aware of the current BTU max input. If underrated, it’s the Regulator that’s increased, not the inbound piping or meter.
There's a few legacy setups that max out at 200 MBH, but they are rare. Mostly in very old neighbourhoods that haven't been upgraded. I think Massachusetts and new York has some areas like that. In those cases, you'd be right. You're also correct in bringing it up. Assumptions cause issues.
 

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. Its still a loss, as you already paid to heat the water once. And your only getting 30 of the 40 gallons you had stored.
BASIC THERMODYNAMICS. the energy is not "LOST" it goes towards heating up the incoming colder water. if the 10 gallons of hot water wasn't in the tank it woudl take longer to heat up the extra 30 gallons of cold water coming in. you aren't loosing any energy, just time to get hot water. therefore you aren't loosing any money.

only way it is lost is if you stop using the water for long enough time for the heat to be lost through the tank's insulation.
 

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AMERICAN'S ARE DUMB WE WOULD RATHER PAY LESS UP FRONT AND THEN pay thousands more in fuel over the life of the home. It's the same reason we dont' drive around cars that get 50 gpm. the technology is there, but it would make the upfront cost of the car higher even though in the long run it would be cheaper overall cost of ownership.

no one ever said we were smart, the world correctly laughs at us.
 

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AMERICAN'S ARE DUMB WE WOULD RATHER PAY LESS UP FRONT AND THEN pay thousands more in fuel over the life of the home. It's the same reason we dont' drive around cars that get 50 gpm. the technology is there, but it would make the upfront cost of the car higher even though in the long run it would be cheaper overall cost of ownership.

no one ever said we were smart, the world correctly laughs at us.
Speak for yourself. My car can get 50-70 mpg depending on how I'm driving. My furnace and hot water tank are both condensing, and in excess of 94%.
 
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