[tjuser23]

Hey guys,

I am hoping some guys with experience installing recessed lights in basements can chime in with their thoughts on my layout idea.

I attached a picture of my basement blueprints with where I am thinking I will put lights.

The larger blue dots are 6 inch recessed LED's, there would be 8 of these.

The smaller brown/red dots would be 3 inch gimbal recessed LED's - 3 that would point toward the accent wall where the TV will be hung, and 3 that will point down and towards a dry bar.

Do you think this is enough lighting for that space? 8 foot ceilings. If not, any suggestions on how you would lay it out?

Also, as a side note, do you prefer cans with the LED retrofit units or canless LED's? I like the idea of the canless but I feel like with cans it may be easier to install before drywall is up to make sure they are all aligned straight etc?

Thanks for any help!

 

[Bondo]

The smaller brown/red dots would be 3 inch gimbal recessed LED's - 3 that would point toward the accent wall where the TV will be hung,

Ayuh,..... In my experiences, pointin' lights at a Tv, makes it awfully hard to see the Tv picture,......

 

[3onthetree]

Not enough lighting. But what are your uses? Pool/ping table? Flex area? What about the seating area, in my experience, 8'x14' is reeeeeaaaallly small for a family room gathered around a 70" tv (which is mandatory you must buy). Also, why are you gimballing the tv, for all the other electronic equipment below it? And where is the sliding door to outside, walking though the couch area?

I prefer standard edison socket housings. Then I can buy any type of LED I like, experiment, change my mind, or in the future a lamp that is yet to be invented. If you buy an LED fixture rated for 50,000 hours, that would last maybe 6 years at 1hr per day, so good luck trying to match that trim and exact color at that time. I also prefer the throw of recessed trim, rather than the "flush" LED panel type fixtures.

 

[tjuser23]

Not enough lighting. But what are your uses? Pool/ping table? Flex area? What about the seating area, in my experience, 8'x14' is reeeeeaaaallly small for a family room gathered around a 70" tv (which is mandatory you must buy). Also, why are you gimballing the tv, for all the other electronic equipment below it? And where is the sliding door to outside, walking though the couch area?

I prefer standard edison socket housings. Then I can buy any type of LED I like, experiment, change my mind, or in the future a lamp that is yet to be invented. If you buy an LED fixture rated for 50,000 hours, that would last maybe 6 years at 1hr per day, so good luck trying to match that trim and exact color at that time. I also prefer the throw of recessed trim, rather than the "flush" LED panel type fixtures.

Thanks for the reply!

We have a foos ball table that we will put down there for now, but in the future might get a ping pong table. I updated the blueprint with an orange rectangle of where the table would be.

The sliding door is where the window is in the blueprint next to the "dry bar" area. We have a walk out so instead of that window being there it is a sliding door.

Also, that TV area is 14' x 11'+ so I think it will be adequate. It is an open area so it feels bigger than the dimensions would seem.

I was planning on getting gimbals for above the accent wall because there will be a fireplace below the TV so I thought some small accent lights might be nice, but if you disagree I am open to changing things?

What do you think would be good for lighting?

 

[3onthetree]

The stair wall is only 6', and the stair closet comes out 8'. I imagine you have a main supply duct and return duct splitting the basement below the trusses at like 7' clear ceiling (hopefully any branches are run between joists or through the webs)? The mind visually follows those walls and ceiling jogs to get a sense of space, so effectively you have the main seating area in a small back nook. I think you have like 12" CMU stem walls reducing your floor space as well? How are you furring those out?

Anyways, if it's all an open ceiling you can basically lay out a grid of 6" cans about 5' to 6' apart. So across the side wall would be (3) cans, and the (4) across the back is good, maybe (5) is needed. That gives you either (11) or (13) total cans for general lighting that the furniture can be flexible with.

At the 8' bar I'd use (3) 4" cans 2'-0" away from the wall to light the counter and wash the wall.

The fireplace I'd keep (2) gimbals if you have a mantel, but more info is needed on that, like the tv being set back on the stud wall and the fireplace is how long and sticks out into the space how much?

What kind of lighting is at the stair?

I can do a quick sketch looking at scale better, but the ductwork may affect the layout.

 

[tjuser23]

The stair wall is only 6', and the stair closet comes out 8'. I imagine you have a main supply duct and return duct splitting the basement below the trusses at like 7' clear ceiling (hopefully any branches are run between joists or through the webs)? The mind visually follows those walls and ceiling jogs to get a sense of space, so effectively you have the main seating area in a small back nook. I think you have like 12" CMU stem walls reducing your floor space as well? How are you furring those out?

Anyways, if it's all an open ceiling you can basically lay out a grid of 6" cans about 5' to 6' apart. So across the side wall would be (3) cans, and the (4) across the back is good, maybe (5) is needed. That gives you either (11) or (13) total cans for general lighting that the furniture can be flexible with.

At the 8' bar I'd use (3) 4" cans 2'-0" away from the wall to light the counter and wash the wall.

The fireplace I'd keep (2) gimbals if you have a mantel, but more info is needed on that, like the tv being set back on the stud wall and the fireplace is how long and sticks out into the space how much?

What kind of lighting is at the stair?

I can do a quick sketch looking at scale better, but the ductwork may affect the layout.

There are 2 supply ducts running perpendicular to the joists, but they are actually running through the joists, not below them. The main return duct is short and stops in the utility room right before the back hallway wall I put in, and then there are just branches running off of that.

So ducting and everything is up in the joists, and my ceiling is 8' everywhere with no obstructions.

You are right about the 12" CMU stem walls, I framed them in with 2x4's as a 4' high "knee" wall, and then the accent wall is basically just a 6' wide continuation of the knee wall up to the ceiling, but it extends out about 4" further than the knee wall. I attached a picture of the knee walls and "accent" wall to help explain.

The accent wall is just going to be a flat wall with an electric fireplace in it (the point of the accent wall was because we needed the depth for the fireplace but didn't want to lose all the floor space of extending the entire wall out that far). And then a TV hung above the fireplace.

I sketched out a new diagram with measurements, they aren't exact because of the knee walls, etc but pretty close. I tried taking the knee walls into account in my sketch but I haven't actually measured the rooms after framing.

So, based on what you said I think I changed my mind about the gimbals and in my new drawing I switched them out for 4" LED's, basically just separate light that is on a separate dimmer, because obviously I wouldn't point the gimbals directly at the TV anyway.

I also added a sectional couch similar to what we want in my sketch, and based on that scale I may have to look into moving the accent wall over to keep it somewhat centered? Also, the storage under the stairs is not framed out all the way to the corner, we kept it set back to hopefully keep the area feeling open and avoid what you were saying with it appearing to be a small nook in the corner.

This means obviously the back of the couch will stick out a ways but should hopefully make it appear as more of an open/bigger area...

What do you think about my updated sketch? Feel free to modify it with any suggestions

 

[3onthetree]

Alright! Those last two pics were good at getting a feel for the space. Your layout is pretty good.

I'd cover the dark area by the slider and still move the bar lights to the counter edge, just like you would have in a kitchen. No need for lighting to accentuate the stair and bathroom doors, but the one by the bedroom is probably needed, I'd go with another 4". I think you can still have the 3"gimbals pointed at the accent wall, it's not like the tv and fireplace are on all the time. The 6" cans should be 3'-4' from the stud wall (vs stem wall), and 5'-6' apart for general living space, any closer than that would be for a bright kitchen (think I have a 5'x5'-4" grid).

As an alternative, because you've created a nice intimate space with the fireplace, maybe doing 4" cans there. It would be darker at this grid size but more lights kinda intrudes on the accent wall and lights up the foot space too much. Either scenario I'd have these lights on a separate dimmer.

 

[tjuser23]

Alright! Those last two pics were good at getting a feel for the space. Your layout is pretty good.

I'd cover the dark area by the slider and still move the bar lights to the counter edge, just like you would have in a kitchen. No need for lighting to accentuate the stair and bathroom doors, but the one by the bedroom is probably needed, I'd go with another 4". I think you can still have the 3"gimbals pointed at the accent wall, it's not like the tv and fireplace are on all the time. The 6" cans should be 3'-4' from the stud wall (vs stem wall), and 5'-6' apart for general living space, any closer than that would be for a bright kitchen (think I have a 5'x5'-4" grid).
View attachment 586627


As an alternative, because you've created a nice intimate space with the fireplace, maybe doing 4" cans there. It would be darker at this grid size but more lights kinda intrudes on the accent wall and lights up the foot space too much. Either scenario I'd have these lights on a separate dimmer.
View attachment 586629

Awesome, thanks 3onthetree! Those layouts you put together really help!

I do like the idea of a slightly darker area with the 4" cans but I think you are right, it might be too crowded and kind of overtake the accent wall...

If I put the 6" cans over there on a separate dimmer I could use that to make it slightly darker I suppose?

As for dimmers, maybe a dimmer for the grid of (10) 6" cans, a dimmer for the (4) 6" cans over the TV area. Would you add the 4" lights by the bar into these dimmers or put those on a separate? I am thinking separate. What switch would you put the hallway light on, its own separate switch?

Also, if you don't mind, I really like your thought process, would you mind telling me what kind of lighting you would do for the bathroom? I was thinking (2) 4" cans, one above shower, one centered over rest of bathroom, and then vanity lights.

 

[3onthetree]

I do like the idea of a slightly darker area with the 4" cans but I think you are right, it might be too crowded and kind of overtake the accent wall...
.

If you went with the 4" cans in the seating, I was thinking out loud about getting the proper uniform light and wall wash using 4" cans, so if you were concerned about achieving that, it would look more like this:

However, that seems to be too much light for your purpose, so reducing the # of fixtures to (6) is ok with the gimbals and not worrying about lighting up the circulation space around the couch. So came up with the sketch from post #7 which IMO is much better, if you go with 4" cans.

As far as switches, how bout
- bar its own single gang on that wall. Maybe think about dual gang if ever upper cabinets and undercab lighting, or switched outlet for beer signs/whatever.
- main flex area + hall light switched right after exiting the stair. Maybe need 3-way by slider door ganged with outside light.
- seating its own dimmer switched right after exiting the stair.
- fireplace wall gimbals switched on side of accent wall bumpout
If the words are unclear I can do a sketch but it takes a little more time with MSPaint to show switches.

 

[3onthetree]

what kind of lighting you would do for the bathroom? I was thinking (2) 4" cans, one above shower, one centered over rest of bathroom, and then vanity lights.

Bathroom lighting is more or less based on user tastes. Some people like wall sconces, some like uplights (but then too dark for makeup in the mirror), some don't like downlights because of glare, some don't like fan/light combos, but mostly it should be associated with the level of cost. If you have a 2-piece acrylic shower, why spend $ on mood lighting, and on the other hand, if you have nice tile work you don't want to cheap out on a 12" round fluorescent.

Start with the size of room and your fan style. Your size of 6x9 can get away with a 3-light wall fixture. Cheap tub do fan/light combo right at edge of tub. Nice walk-in glass door do wet-rated can. Depending on what else you choose, you may need a light near/in the linen closet. But, you have to be aware of how many switches are at the door, 3 is comfortable, 4 or more starts to confuse people.

 

[tjuser23]

As far as switches, how bout
- bar its own single gang on that wall. Maybe think about dual gang if ever upper cabinets and undercab lighting, or switched outlet for beer signs/whatever.
- main flex area + hall light switched right after exiting the stair. Maybe need 3-way by slider door ganged with outside light.
- seating its own dimmer switched right after exiting the stair.
- fireplace wall gimbals switched on side of accent wall bumpout
If the words are unclear I can do a sketch but it takes a little more time with MSPaint to show switches.

Awesome, that is similar to what I was thinking. I drew up a quick drawing and I think it is pretty similar to what you were saying.

Would this work?

3 gang by sliding door: (1) - bar lights color coded BLUE; (2) - 6" cans color coded RED; (3): outside light

3 gang by stairs: (1) - bar lights color coded BLUE; (2) - 6" cans color coded RED; (3) - 6" cans in couch area color coded ORANGE;

1 gang by accent wall: (1) - 3 inch gimbals color coded GREEN'

Thanks again for all your help I really appreciate it

 

[3onthetree]

Sounds like you know what you want for switching. One more option to muddle it up, I didn't think of it before - if you just do laundry or retire to the bedroom you may not want to light up the whole basement, so having two lights there on a 3way just for that circulation route, wouldn't be on all the time to show the hot spot on the wall.