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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Good day to you all...
I have a home here in NE Florida that long ago had a back porch enclosed and sided with T-111. After purchasing this home a few years ago I resided it with Hardie Panels (the 4'X8' panels). Last year I built a shed and sided it with the same materials. This year I am building an addition to the home and plan to side it exactly the same way...however, some of my research is making me wonder if I have been doing it incorrectly.

First off the only trim available in my local stores has been the 3/4" by 3.5" Hardie Trim with the grain look on one side.
The panels also have grain with the small indentions every 6 or 8 inches to give the appearance of vertical siding.

What I am installing it on is wood frame wall studs, 1/2" OSB sheathing over entire wall and then House wrap.
According to the Hardie installation instructions I believe it says you can install the panels directly onto 7/16" OSB or thicker.
It also says "best practice" is to install straps or a rain shield to create an air gap but does not say it is required.

I was not looking for the full Monty board and batten look with a batten every 16". I also was not a fan of the aesthetics of the battens having a full 3/4" reveal.
So what I ended up doing was installing all of the trim and battens first and then installing the panels in-between the trims and caulking all of the seams.
For example on my 8' by 8' shed I have corner trim and then one batten down the center of the wall plus window and door trim...then I installed two sheets on each wall between the trims. This gives me a little less than 4' between battens.

Figure two in the instructions shows three different ways of doing a joint. One of these ways is with no batten at all, just two panels with a caulked gap.
Am I wrong in thinking that what I have done would be no different than that application?
Thanks for any input you may have. I just want to make sure I don't do something stupid on my addition.

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks for asking that ... I couldn't understand what he was asking ...
The question is whether or not I am installing the siding incorrectly (against manufacturer install instructions) by doing the trim first and then the panels rather than paneling the entire wall and installing the trim/battens over the seams.
 

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The question is whether or not I am installing the siding incorrectly (against manufacturer install instructions) by doing the trim first and then the panels rather than paneling the entire wall and installing the trim/battens over the seams.
Any time you have a horizontal break in the siding where it will be exposed to rain, it should have a Z flashing to kick the water out, so trim over the hardy with caulk would be better. Usually it is the wood trim that rots first but you have hardy trim so that is in your favour.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Any time you have a horizontal break in the siding where it will be exposed to rain, it should have a Z flashing to kick the water out, so trim over the hardy with caulk would be better. Usually it is the wood trim that rots first but you have hardy trim so that is in your favor.
I did fail to use the Z flashing over the door but it is a shed and I beveled the top of the door trim. I plan to use all the proper flashing on the house.
My question however was in regards to the vertical seams.

I feel like what I have done, while not specifically shown as an option in the figure, would not be any less water tight than the third image and should be fine.
This stuff is super expensive and I do not want some inspector telling me I did it wrong and to redo it.
I am pretty sure this is the way lap siding is installed isn't it?

The simplest way I can figure to ask the question is...Is it OK to install the panels butting to the side of the trim instead of under the trim?
 

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I did fail to use the Z flashing over the door but it is a shed and I beveled the top of the door trim. I plan to use all the proper flashing on the house.
My question however was in regards to the vertical seams.

I feel like what I have done, while not specifically shown as an option in the figure, would not be any less water tight than the third image and should be fine.
This stuff is super expensive and I do not want some inspector telling me I did it wrong and to redo it.
I am pretty sure this is the way lap siding is installed isn't it?

The simplest way I can figure to ask the question is...Is it OK to install the panels butting to the side of the trim instead of under the trim?
If you are caulking the edges I would not be concerned about the vertical seams. How ever you did it.
Usually siding guys put trim around windows and corners first and then siding, but when they do board and bat the cover the join so both are acceptable.
 

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#1, I never ever would have used Hardee panels for many reasons!
#2, If I did I would have installed the panels first, painted it then installed the trim.
#3, I hate the Hardee trim with a passion, I would have trimmed it out with PVC lumber instead.
There's zero reason to have installed a rain shield on a simple shed.
I've been working on houses for over 50 years in NH and VA and have never once seen a house with a rain shield.
The way you did it your going to have to caulk everywhere, and count on that to keep water out, which is not going to happen.
 
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I personally think it is overkill to do plywood plus house wrap plus then T1-11 ... unless code for Florida ( hurricane resistance may now require it. For a shed in Florida I would have used stucco board over 16 OC stud work. Do the panels around the whole building, silicone and paint, then install the painted trim edges over it.

As now you have to make pretty precise cuts to mate various pieces between the trim, then seal all those joints.

But, evn taking the long route, it is going to be an awesome looking + strong little shed!
 

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Your installation will be fine. I have similar installation and after 16 years it looks just like the day it was installed. I used Sherwin Williams best exterior paint. Paint adheres great to hardi.
I love hardi trim. Very expensive and very durable. I would not put PVC on anything on my construction.
You are doing a great job that will last. When cutting the hardi, I recommend that you wear an excellent face and eye mask and be sure wind is blowing away from you. I prefer to be in grassy area so the dust settles.
 

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The last time I used Hardee the instructions that came with it was to leave 1/8" gap between siding, and trim, and calk with something that does not harden because of expansion and contraction. I always try to use an elastomeric sealant. The ones that says flammable usually have a 50 year life expectancy, some stretch 150%, and will reseal itself after cut, Lexel is one I use.
 

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I personally think it is overkill to do plywood plus house wrap plus then T1-11 ... unless code for Florida ( hurricane resistance may now require it. For a shed in Florida I would have used stucco board over 16 OC stud work. Do the panels around the whole building, silicone and paint, then install the painted trim edges over it.

As now you have to make pretty precise cuts to mate various pieces between the trim, then seal all those joints.

But, evn taking the long route, it is going to be an awesome looking + strong little shed!
Maybe you could do a detailed explanation on how to water proof a window when you have sheeting with nothing behind it?
 

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#1, I never ever would have used Hardee panels for many reasons!
#2, If I did I would have installed the panels first, painted it then installed the trim.
#3, I hate the Hardee trim with a passion, I would have trimmed it out with PVC lumber instead.
There's zero reason to have installed a rain shield on a simple shed.
I've been working on houses for over 50 years in NH and VA and have never once seen a house with a rain shield.
The way you did it your going to have to caulk everywhere, and count on that to keep water out, which is not going to happen.
Joe, it you have worked with a brick or stucco faced house, you have worked with a drain plane.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 · (Edited)
If you are caulking the edges I would not be concerned about the vertical seams. How ever you did it.
Usually siding guys put trim around windows and corners first and then siding, but when they do board and bat the cover the join so both are acceptable.
Thanks.

#1, I never ever would have used Hardee panels for many reasons!
#2, If I did I would have installed the panels first, painted it then installed the trim.
#3, I hate the Hardee trim with a passion, I would have trimmed it out with PVC lumber instead.
There's zero reason to have installed a rain shield on a simple shed.
I've been working on houses for over 50 years in NH and VA and have never once seen a house with a rain shield.
The way you did it your going to have to caulk everywhere, and count on that to keep water out, which is not going to happen.
I also hated working with the Harie Trim but the PVC is WAY more expensive here...it was a tradeoff.
I didn't consider rain shield on the shed, was asking about the house.
In reality, I am depending on the house wrap to keep the water away from the wood. The caulk is just to help keep it from the house wrap...sort of a screen door over the regular door kind of thing.
What are your many reasons against the panels?

The Everbuilt stuff in the picture ... is that a building wrap? If it is, and it's continuous behind the trim, it should be ok.
The house wrap is all one piece.

Your installation will be fine. I have similar installation and after 16 years it looks just like the day it was installed. I used Sherwin Williams best exterior paint. Paint adheres great to hardi.
I love hardi trim. Very expensive and very durable. I would not put PVC on anything on my construction.
You are doing a great job that will last.
I recommend that you wear an excellent face and eye mask and be sure wind is blowing away from you. I prefer to be in grassy area so the dust settles.
I am using best quality Behr. It also is sticking well. I used PVC to trim out a post on the front porch. Easy to work with, will probably last forever but spent way too much on a post. Couldn't imagine spending that kind of money to trim out the whole addition.

I personally think it is overkill to do plywood plus house wrap plus then T1-11 ... unless code for Florida ( hurricane resistance may now require it. For a shed in Florida I would have used stucco board over 16 OC stud work. Do the panels around the whole building, silicone and paint, then install the painted trim edges over it.

As now you have to make pretty precise cuts to mate various pieces between the trim, then seal all those joints.

But, evn taking the long route, it is going to be an awesome looking + strong little shed!
Figure 1 in the manufacturer instructions says to do it that way and I would be doing OSB and wrap no matter what kind of siding I was putting on.
The panels are pretty fragile without the solid backing. I also would be caulking the seams on all the trim regardless of which way it was installed.
 

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Maybe you could do a detailed explanation on how to water proof a window when you have sheeting with nothing behind it?
It is a shed. Not a house. So, I was curious if there was some regional code change or maybe if this material is thin as tissue paper, because I have yet to see any shed commercially available or assembled on site or built on site from scratch that has full on 1/2 5/8 3/4 OSB or Plywood on the walls, plus full house wrap, plus such siding over it. Plywood plus vinyl siding, sure.

As far as windows. There is additional framing added to make the rough opening and support the window install, hole cut in the siding to match, bit of sealant around the rough opening, window with exterior flanges set in from the outside. Add a thin bead around where the flange meets the wall. Never an issue in 10-20-30 years. Similar to storm windows. Fool proof. Then you can add some decorative trim over it to hide the flange if you want. It is not complicated.
 

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It is a shed. Not a house. So, I was curious if there was some regional code change or maybe if this material is thin as tissue paper, because I have yet to see any shed commercially available or assembled on site or built on site from scratch that has full on 1/2 5/8 3/4 OSB or Plywood on the walls, plus full house wrap, plus such siding over it. Plywood plus vinyl siding, sure.

As far as windows. There is additional framing added to make the rough opening and support the window install, hole cut in the siding to match, bit of sealant around the rough opening, window with exterior flanges set in from the outside. Add a thin bead around where the flange meets the wall. Never an issue in 10-20-30 years. Similar to storm windows. Fool proof. Then you can add some decorative trim over it to hide the flange if you want. It is not complicated.
Yes , standard installation here, I have repaired the rot in a few.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
It is a shed. Not a house. So, I was curious if there was some regional code change or maybe if this material is thin as tissue paper, because I have yet to see any shed commercially available or assembled on site or built on site from scratch that has full on 1/2 5/8 3/4 OSB or Plywood on the walls, plus full house wrap, plus such siding over it. Plywood plus vinyl siding, sure.

As far as windows. There is additional framing added to make the rough opening and support the window install, hole cut in the siding to match, bit of sealant around the rough opening, window with exterior flanges set in from the outside. Add a thin bead around where the flange meets the wall. Never an issue in 10-20-30 years. Similar to storm windows. Fool proof. Then you can add some decorative trim over it to hide the flange if you want. It is not complicated.
Honestly I overbuilt the shed. This was for 3 reasons. The same size shed at local big box was built with your standard t1-11 siding over studs or vinyl siding over OSB over studs and cost double what I spent on mine building it myself (and this didn't count installation cost). Secondly I have seen what those sheds look like after 10 or 15 years and was hoping I could do better. Lastly I was very keen on having it fit/match the house so I used the same technique and materials.
 

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Thanks. I hear you. I haven't done the store bought either for their cost vs quality.
Though in FL that may be more of a necessity if you need an engineering certificate, to satisfy code enforcement vs drawing plans, getting sign off. etc
And, a bit of overbuilding doesn't hurt, if the budget allows it. :)

I would make sure to use a high quality sealant to seal the gaps they advise to leave. I have had good luck with GE paintable silicone and GeoCell.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
No permit required here local if it is under 70 sq ft. So no drawings or sign offs.
I measured mine from the outermost piece of trim to outermost piece of trim after completion and did the math, I have 69.98 sq ft lol...originally wanted an 8X10 but made do with smaller.
 
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