Maybe a dumb (real dumb) question, but I have a 3/4" gas line now. I need to upgrade that to 1", but the connection at the gas meter is 3/4". Can that be swapped out, or do you just put 3/4" stub and then adapt to 1"? Just wondering if you'll really be effectively using 1" pipe if you start with 3/4" (even if just a little piece).
gas line supply
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Because there are things that you should be doing yourself, and other things that you shouldn't even attempt, that's why.
My guess (we don't have natural gas here) is that you'll have to call the gas company to upgrade the meter.
:thumbsup::thumbsup:
In a perfect world, true. But in my world, contractors dont give a rip about you or doing a job right. They just want to come in, over charge you, cut corners, and move on. not only from ones i've hired in the past, but also ones i've gone behind to fix the crap they got away with.
Running gas line is not rocket science, and if i'm going to pressure test and have it inspected, I'm a lot more comfortable with my own ability than someone else. I'm really just wondering to the logic of the science in running a 1" pipe that starts with one smaller. If i need to call the gas company that's what i'll do, but you come to a forum, hoping to get constructive advice to make sure you do something right. If you want to point me to the code i'll read that, but so far i haven't seen that kind of answer and dont expect i would.
Really, why even have forums if you're not going to be helpful. You can run people away from everything....Don't do your own plumbing cause if you have the slightest water leak, you'll attracked termites and bring your house down. Don't run your own electrical cause you could shock your self and die. Don't frame your own room cause if you don't propperly support it, you're house will fall in on you and you'll die. Don't try to insulate your self because if you don't account for moisture properly, you'll risk mold take over and die, not to mention termites, etc...
Running gas line is not rocket science, and if i'm going to pressure test and have it inspected, I'm a lot more comfortable with my own ability than someone else. I'm really just wondering to the logic of the science in running a 1" pipe that starts with one smaller. If i need to call the gas company that's what i'll do, but you come to a forum, hoping to get constructive advice to make sure you do something right. If you want to point me to the code i'll read that, but so far i haven't seen that kind of answer and dont expect i would.
Really, why even have forums if you're not going to be helpful. You can run people away from everything....Don't do your own plumbing cause if you have the slightest water leak, you'll attracked termites and bring your house down. Don't run your own electrical cause you could shock your self and die. Don't frame your own room cause if you don't propperly support it, you're house will fall in on you and you'll die. Don't try to insulate your self because if you don't account for moisture properly, you'll risk mold take over and die, not to mention termites, etc...
That's a pretty lousy world. I can't believe there's not a single contractor in your area that isn't competent and conscientious - that BS. On one hand, you're claiming we (licensed, professional contractors) are a bunch of incompetent crooks who don't care, overcharge etc. And on the other hand, you expect (demand, in fact) that we give you all the answers so you can go and blow yourself up along with any near-by neighbors. WHERE DO I SIGN-UP?!?!
You're not listening either apparently. No one has given me any advice except for alan which was proceeded with "my guess". So really...how am in not listening? and your "you will prob". So it sounds like i'm not listening to a bunch of people who don't really have any good info to give.
One, it's not illegal where I am. Only regulation is for wiring your own home which you have to pass a test if you want to do that, which i've done. Plumbing is all yours as long as you have a permit, which i do.
Edit: I stand corrected. The inspector I talked to told me what I needed to do for the inspection but failed to tell me I was not allowed to do the work. And when I got my general permit, they said electrical was the only thing a home owner couldn't do without passing the electrical test. However, where I am...turns out you can NOT run your own gas. I found this out when the inspection office called me after I filed for my inspection. First quote I've got now is $800-1200 for someone to run the line for me :/ Seems a bit high to me considering it's a small job. Tpolk you were right below, thanks for pointing that out for those in the future.
One, it's not illegal where I am. Only regulation is for wiring your own home which you have to pass a test if you want to do that, which i've done. Plumbing is all yours as long as you have a permit, which i do.
Edit: I stand corrected. The inspector I talked to told me what I needed to do for the inspection but failed to tell me I was not allowed to do the work. And when I got my general permit, they said electrical was the only thing a home owner couldn't do without passing the electrical test. However, where I am...turns out you can NOT run your own gas. I found this out when the inspection office called me after I filed for my inspection. First quote I've got now is $800-1200 for someone to run the line for me :/ Seems a bit high to me considering it's a small job. Tpolk you were right below, thanks for pointing that out for those in the future.
No Ishmael, I'm saying i've never hired someone that's done a satisfactory job, they've all cut corners and ripped me off. Even people who have come highly recommended. So sorry, i'm done hiring people to find out after the fact if they have integrity or not. I'm not saying there aren't any good contractors out there. But I'd expect the ones involved in forums have passion for what they do and want to help people, and not everyone on here has to be a professional to have wisdom. So I'd rather learn how to do something right, and do it myself, rather than pay someone to rip me off and then have to fix their work. Not to mention I really enjoy doing/learning this kind of work.
Yes polk. I have checked with the inspector and he just wants to see a pressure test on it when i'm done.
Yes polk. I have checked with the inspector and he just wants to see a pressure test on it when i'm done.
That being said, there are more people out there who are DIYers that don't have a clue what they're doing and are dangerous, so I can respect your natural inclination to try to run me off rather than help like my natural inclination is to do something myself rather than trust someone else. But it is frustrating when you want to do something your self (partly cause you dont trust contractors but mostly cause you enjoy it) and you want to do it right so you come to a forum for info and people want to treat you like your incompetent. Just because someone asks a question doesn't mean they don't know anything.
Now to my original question, I could just hook a reducing fitting to go from 1" to 3/4" and pass a pressure test and be good to go. However, I'm curious if there's a point to that because it starts with 3/4" so would I really be making full use of the 1" pipe? I just want to learn people!
Now to my original question, I could just hook a reducing fitting to go from 1" to 3/4" and pass a pressure test and be good to go. However, I'm curious if there's a point to that because it starts with 3/4" so would I really be making full use of the 1" pipe? I just want to learn people!
autix790: Back to my original answer I think. I understand the DIY credo but since it doesn't seem logical to just go from 3/4 to 1" with a fitting as the the port is 3/4" on the regulator you'll likely (again a guess) need a new meter. Thus, gas company and either they or a licensed pro would need to be involved.
I'm guessing you are in/near Austin, Tx; a bit from their site on inspections not required
from: http://www.ci.austin.tx.us/development/onestop/permits_work_exempt.htm
Gas
I'm guessing you are in/near Austin, Tx; a bit from their site on inspections not required
from: http://www.ci.austin.tx.us/development/onestop/permits_work_exempt.htm
Gas
- Portable heating, cooking or clothes drying appliances.
- Replacement of any minor part that does not alter approval of equipment or make such equipment unsafe.
- Portable fuel cell appliances that are not connected to a fixed piping system and are not interconnected to a power grid.
Well here's my thought to an answer. If my logic is wrong please explain.
Based on the table TABLE 402.4(2) from the 2009 IRC, If a 3/4" line can supply 360CFH at 10ft (which I'll only have about 2 inches) and a 1" line can do 284CFH at 50ft, the 284CFH will be my limitation. So running a 3/4" line into a 1" pipe, the most I could expect to get would be 360CFH (or probably a little more since I dont have 10 full feet of 3/4") but would start decreasing at about 30ft.
Bob, thank for the info. Sorry, i'm not in Texas, though I did live there for a bit a while back. Glad to be gone! I do have a permit, but still don't want to rely on the inspector to catch everything. I want to learn as much as I can.
Based on the table TABLE 402.4(2) from the 2009 IRC, If a 3/4" line can supply 360CFH at 10ft (which I'll only have about 2 inches) and a 1" line can do 284CFH at 50ft, the 284CFH will be my limitation. So running a 3/4" line into a 1" pipe, the most I could expect to get would be 360CFH (or probably a little more since I dont have 10 full feet of 3/4") but would start decreasing at about 30ft.
Bob, thank for the info. Sorry, i'm not in Texas, though I did live there for a bit a while back. Glad to be gone! I do have a permit, but still don't want to rely on the inspector to catch everything. I want to learn as much as I can.
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Add up your total btu load divide by 1000 (gas btu's/cf)
Now look at the plated or rating information on your meter, multiply the rating by .7 this is the usable CFH of the meter.
Can't find the information on the meter, call the gas company, they will have this information, again multiply the information by .7 (derating)
Is the load greater than the meter's capability? --Yes -- new meter required ---> call gas company----> pay $$$ and hope the incoming line is big enough.
Load less than meter's capability ---- No ----- increase pipe size.
Although not rocket science it is dangerous and most advise against doing it yourself.
Mark
Now look at the plated or rating information on your meter, multiply the rating by .7 this is the usable CFH of the meter.
Can't find the information on the meter, call the gas company, they will have this information, again multiply the information by .7 (derating)
Is the load greater than the meter's capability? --Yes -- new meter required ---> call gas company----> pay $$$ and hope the incoming line is big enough.
Load less than meter's capability ---- No ----- increase pipe size.
Although not rocket science it is dangerous and most advise against doing it yourself.
Mark
Hey Mark, Thanks for the info!
I have a tankless that's 180000btu and then will be adding a range that is 65000btu. This brings me 245. My gas meter says it's rated to 275 but if you have to multiply that by 0.7 it looks like I'll need a new meter. I had talked to the gas company a couple of weeks ago and they told me they would replace the meter for free if needed.
I have a tankless that's 180000btu and then will be adding a range that is 65000btu. This brings me 245. My gas meter says it's rated to 275 but if you have to multiply that by 0.7 it looks like I'll need a new meter. I had talked to the gas company a couple of weeks ago and they told me they would replace the meter for free if needed.
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Glad I can be lumped into that side of it. . . .
On the other hand, gas isn't usually considered plumbing, it's considered mechanical.
With that said, have you taken any of the steps i've reccomended, or are you just on here to argue? ? ? :huh::huh: No offense intended, but if you were in a rush to get it done, i'd assume you'd either have started on it yourself or hired a crooked contractor.
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Seeing you have a tankless heater and gas range that gets you pretty close to maxing out BTU's, I'd seriously consider a meter upgrade, and if it's allowable in your area, even bumping up your gas pressure in your home to 2 psi from inches of water column. You'll have the expense of adding individual appliance regulators, though. I always find that a tankless, when used on the same pressure regulator as other appliances, will starve everything else due to the huge pressure drop when they start up.
Sorry about your bad luck with contractors. You'll likely need one at some point in the future, maybe a better attitude could help out with that.
Sorry about your bad luck with contractors. You'll likely need one at some point in the future, maybe a better attitude could help out with that.
Alan, I wasn't here to argue with anyone and my only reason for arguing was point out the reason for forums and express my frustration that people want to tell you to run when you're trying to learn. Especially considering this is a DIY forum. The response I got, i would expect from a professionals only forum. I only lumped you in cause Polk was saying I wasn't listening to anyone, but no one was really giving me concrete advice (at that time).Glad I can be lumped into that side of it. . . .
On the other hand, gas isn't usually considered plumbing, it's considered mechanical.
With that said, have you taken any of the steps i've reccomended, or are you just on here to argue? ? ? :huh::huh: No offense intended, but if you were in a rush to get it done, i'd assume you'd either have started on it yourself or hired a crooked contractor.
I'm in no rush...I've been working on my house for 2 years now, working with the city architectural review board, the livability department, and the inspection office, and making sure all that i'm doing is in compliance and done right. And yes, i've finished all my plumbing and mounted my water heater and run the gas to it. I have my test pieces in place and was going to do my pressure test and came up with that question and was curious to learn what I should do. My next step is to test my line, and then call the gas company to have them swap out my meter and remove the second one (house is being converted from a duplex). I mean no offense to anyone and appreciate the constructive feedback I received!
Thanks! I dont have a bad attitude, just got frustrated that I come to learn and basically get a people telling me i'm not compentent to learn gas and to hire someone. I don't look down on all contractors, I just chose not to hire them any more if there's something I feel I can do my self.
Not to go off on a tangent, but here are some examples. My parents hired an electrician who when I went back to re-wire their house found that instead of running new wire all the way to the panel, they stoped about four feet away with the new wire and joined old wire, not in a junction box, but that pro knew simply wrapping with electrical tape would do the job. That was done several times. I had a plumber who found my roommates power vent fan for his heater was bad. Wanted $600 to replace it. I took it out, brought it to the lab and found it only had a bad solenoid. Fixed it for $20 and 2 hours to remove/diagnose/replace. Hardly the $300 in labor he wanted. I had a mechanic tell me there was absolutely nothing wrong with my car. I couldn't drive over 40. He said no problem going 70. Two days later my drive shaft blew off. He said oops, I should have caught that. Next mechanic told me he put a laser in my rear differential and could tell the gears were wiped out and there was so much more stuff wrong with my car it wasn't worth fixing.. Oh, but he'd buy it off me. Took my car and left (6 years ago) and have driven 60,000 miles on that car with no trouble. Had a contractor who was highly recommened replace a load bearing wall for me. I got home, he was already rushing out the door. I found out later as I inspected, several of the studs had shims on them which i could flick out with my pinky. Not to mention he skipped over another spot of fixing my soffit (which let bats in). I can go on and on. I am very nice to people and don't argue with contractors or try to micro manage or hassle with pricing. Though I had a guy come redo my fireplace (recommended by a good friend), and had I not micromanaged him, he would have done half the work he did in the end. His work didn't hold up, he opted out of putting the damper on, and had cosmetic flaws, but eventhough he said he'd come back, he never did.
I did meet a very nice plumber the other day my sister recommended. He came by gave me some good advice (some bad) but when I told him I would be getting inspected, he said he did more commercial than residential and recommended someone else. The other guy came and wanted to talk down to me and wanted $2500 for what amounted to maybe 2 days work for two guys. I already had all the materials and the permit pulled.
Anyway, I'm sure there are great contractors out there, but I've had no luck finding them...to be honest, I wish I was one, but I'm stuck being an engineer for now. Sorry to have implied I think all contractors are bad. I know there are bad apples everywhere but the ones i've come across have motivated me to do things on my own. Like they say...if you want something done right, do it your self. I really enjoy learning and doing so that's my first choice these days.
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