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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I am working on my house plans, see the floor plans here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B_X5nwOb38dmRUxkVEU5MVNZbkU/view?usp=sharing

I am 3D modeling the entire house including all the framing so I can understand how it is built, as well as hopefully to get an understanding of the materials list. I don't know yet if I will be building the house myself or hiring contractors. Probably a bit of both.

I started working on the second floor joists. My house plans are an open concept on the first floor, the span for the joists (between the rim boards) in one direction is 23'-9", and in the other 21'-6 1/2". You can see some pictures here:

http://imgur.com/QGIQrlZ
http://imgur.com/9G1IkNj
http://imgur.com/vRiLTnc
http://imgur.com/9VhiM9U

I'm not sure how to run the joists, which direction, how to fill in for ceiling drywall, etc. I watched a lot of youtube vids, read some articles, but it seems everywhere I look guys have different "correct" methods, and I'm basically stuck.

I do have a lot of the code books, bought them a few years ago, but they are pretty heady and hard to get quick answers from.

If there are any framers out there, how would you do this?
 

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Well, I'm not a professional framer, but looking at your plans, it looks like your house is 36'x24. Since there's no center bearing wall, it makes much more sense to run floor joists the short span (24'). That's still quite a span, so you won't be able to use conventional lumber. You'll have to go with a product like a wood I-joist or floor truss.

Edit: Sorry, I see that the second floor footprint doesn't cover the total 36'. I imagine you'd be better off using one of those types of joists anyway.
 

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If it were. Me, I would simply sketch out my floor plans for the thing and bring it to a real lumberyard for a materials take-off. The ones that I deal with will spec out your joists, trusses,I joists, whatever plug give you a full matriarch list all priced out. Ron
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
Ok, so I am looking into some I-joists.

One thing I guess I don't understand is, they come in 9-1/2", 11-7/8", 14" tall and larger.

Except for the 9-1/2" the rest of those don't match standard lumber sizes. How do you fill in around stair cases etc? What about rim boards?

It' seems "clunky" that they don't match lumber sizes.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Ok, 2x10's are 9-1/4"

So, it seems like when using I-Joists it's all fiber rim boards, joist hangers, filler boards etc. You don't mix in conventional lumber...
 

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It sounds like you have ideas but no practical experience. That is the beginning of a money pit. I would suggest you buy a ready made design or get a pro. For a average house, span that big is not practical. 14" i joist, metal beams or truss joists may span that much but there are other walls that go into a house and they all make a load.
Deeper joists mean more stair risers. More risers mean bigger stair well. Each step does not have to be 7.5".
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
It sounds like you have ideas but no practical experience. That is the beginning of a money pit.
gee, thanks...

I am a mechanical engineer by trade, but do not have carpentry experience no. So trying to learn. I will eventually submit my plans to a licensed architect, but I want to understand the framing systems before I do so. And no, I am not interested in ready-made cookie cutter plans.

I see many houses with open floor plans like mine, with larger spans.

And I guess the reason I am asking these questions in this forum is because I thought pro's would help out newbies.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Based on some load/span tables, it looks like 11-7/8" I-joists with 3-1/2" flanges are required for the 21-1/2 ft span.

There are of course other walls helping with the loading as can be seen here: http://imgur.com/mZsKWUw

My goal here is to complete my 3D model and make some 2D drawings of it to take to a builder. I'm trying to get to the point where I can select all my windows etc. Plus, I just want to learn as much about framing as I can while doing this exercise.
 

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24' span can be performed w/trusses. they have to be engineered. Architects typically are not engineers, and draftsmen typically are not Architects. Usually, an Architect will draw plans per what YOU want then send them to the various Engineers, (electrical, mechanical, plumbing, structural, civil etc). those guys add their calcs and send the plans back to the Arch. who updates the plans.
"Money-pit"? It can be. But it's YOUR home. Custom homes cost more. You can buy a set of online plans, then customize them, but will still have to go through engineering. Designing your own place can be fun.
You can also take, (I like to walk-in), your drawings to a local truss builder for an estimate, usually it is free. They make their money on their product.
There are also online calculators.
http://www.contractortalk.com (check it out).
s
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Architects typically are not engineers, and draftsmen typically are not Architects.
This I understand. I will have to have plans that are stamped to get a building permit. And the person doing the stamping will be an engineer who has approved the design. The question is if I can cut out the architect and draw up the plans myself. iirc the stamping is like $500 (depends on the design but my house design is very simple), while the architect fee is generally around $2000.

However, initially, I am just trying to learn the basics to get my plans as accurate as possible before I talk to a builder. I am well aware that some of the stuff I do will need to be changed to meet code, that's fine.
 

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Yes, some will be changed to meet code minimum. Eg. the shear panel (lateral resistance) on the front window wall and side wall to the deck. Ours require 27" minimum plywood/osb panel with approved nailing. depends on location for minimum wind speed requirements; eg-90mph; http://www.awc.org/pdf/codes-standards/publications/wfcm/AWC-WFCM2001-HWG90B-0610.pdf

Other tips, take um or ?: pocket doors are high maintenance compared to swing doors and they are loud (interior noises follow around the door gaps unlike solid swing door) with a toilet/washer/dryer next to them and bi-folds with louvers let moisture through easily... get a strong fan over the tub in bedroom where blankets/clothes are in same room... incorporate HVAC trunk runs in floor joist layout for builder, as well as toilet placement/drain boxing to reduce plumbing butcher job.... raise all solid headers up to bottom top plate for less gaps/settling later, frame down to window/door with 2x's.... basement/garage door operation may hit someone same time on landing... from a quick look.

Gary
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
Yes, some will be changed to meet code minimum. Eg. the shear panel (lateral resistance) on the front window wall and side wall to the deck. Ours require 27" minimum plywood/osb panel with approved nailing. depends on location for minimum wind speed requirements; eg-90mph; http://www.awc.org/pdf/codes-standards/publications/wfcm/AWC-WFCM2001-HWG90B-0610.pdf

Other tips, take um or ?: pocket doors are high maintenance compared to swing doors and they are loud (interior noises follow around the door gaps unlike solid swing door) with a toilet/washer/dryer next to them and bi-folds with louvers let moisture through easily... get a strong fan over the tub in bedroom where blankets/clothes are in same room... incorporate HVAC trunk runs in floor joist layout for builder, as well as toilet placement/drain boxing to reduce plumbing butcher job.... raise all solid headers up to bottom top plate for less gaps/settling later, frame down to window/door with 2x's.... basement/garage door operation may hit someone same time on landing... from a quick look.

Gary
Thanks for the tips.

As far as HVAC, I plan to have in-floor heat with pex tubing and AC unit in the attic. I hate forced air heat, have asthma.

Pocket doors, guy at work swears by them, they seemed like a good space saver idea...

Never heard of the headers going up to the plate, interesting.

Door from the garage, hmm, I have it opening inward to not knock someone off the landing in the garage, but I guess the way it is now you can knock someone down the basement stairs.
 
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