[Alsomee]

Hi,

I'm renovating a house. It's not a huge lift but there are some aspects that require some thought to plan correctly. There is not however, anything that would require an architect. (And an architect or general contractor is outside of my budget at this point, to be honest.)

It's a cape that was built to allow second floor refinishing. The attic has front dormers for bedrooms and a rear dormer for a bathroom. Right now there's rough framing in place for all three rooms (done by previous owner). The pins are all basically set up. I just have to knock 'em down...

There are a few obvious issues with the existing framing though. It's a bit cobbled together in a couple of places and one rough door opening doesn't align properly. It's not a terrible job (walls are plumb and square), but a few things definitely need to be fixed or finished. I have a contractor for the heating and plumbing but would like to do the framing, drywall and finishing myself to save $$$. I have a lot of drywall and finish carpentry experience. The framing is another matter. But like I said, most of the framing is actually in place. I just need to finish a few of the half-done segments.

I spoke with the building inspector and got permit paperwork. He said to bring it back with the plans and my plumbing contractor's insurance info.

Can anyone recommend reliable and affordable software that can generate framing plans off a floorplan layout that would be suitable for his needs? Would a building inspector typically be looking for blueprints or just floorplan layouts? I don't have any experience with the permitting process and would like some insight into what he might need before I go in there and talk to him.

Thanks,

Peter

 

[chandler48]

Peter, I have used Smart Draw to do floor layouts. It's not a blueprint, but you are able to scale it and use icons for electrical, plumbing, etc. Not cheap ($300), but you can buy a yearly subscription, I believe for less.

 

[Bud9051]

If I'm reading your post correctly you want the software to generate the building plans and I don't think they do that. Between the floor plan and the final drawings is the work of a designer who can detail the work needed down to the last inch. It is that designer or architect that you need to be talking to and with his final plans the town will approve your work.

Maybe I'm reading it wrong, do you know how to design a house and just need the software to make it look neat?

Bud

 

[Calson]

I use Home Designer Pro but I would go to the building department and ask to see plans from others so you can see the level of detail that is needed as it varies from one county or city to another.

I saw a plan for a 8 unit apartment that was drawn by the builder's 8-year old son and it was approved by the county.

 

[Mystriss]

Most of these softwares are add-on extensions for really expensive "commercial" grade programs like uhm Revit.

The only one I even know of that's "stand alone" is SoftPlan which has a "small project" version for a grand - https://softplan.com/?page_id=3240

 

[Chris Egg]

Below are some top rated designing softwares.
SketchUp
AutoCAD Architecture
Civil 3D

 

[Mystriss]

FYI Autocad Arch is 1600/year.
The Revit add-on is 2300/year.
The Civil 3D add-on is 2300/year.
They've got packages of all three for 2800/year.


Now SketchUp is free (or it was) and you can do it in that, but it's not a framing software at all, it's just a drawing program with some 3D rendering capability. You'd have to draw every board in - it doesn't have a "hey make a wall with 16OC studs or anything like that as far as I know. (I'm not a fan of SketchUp personally so I bias-forget about it heh)

 

[carmusic]

i saw an ad for this architecte3d, didn't tried it but seems great at low price

 

[Chris616]

One of the nice things about doing a DIY house reno project, at least for me, is that I have no problem buying the tools that I need to make the job go better. It’s usually easy to justify the cost against contractor labour. One of the best tools that we bought at the beginning of our ongoing project was the software that Calson mentioned, Home Designer Pro. It’s $US495, but it can also be rented by the month.

When we remodeled our kitchen we were able to try dozens of different permutations of moving walls, windows, cabinets, appliances, peninsula layout, etc., all without any physical effort. The 3-D visualization tools allow you to see exactly what it would look like in reality. Fair warning - there is a fairly steep learning curve to become proficient with the software.

When you’ve moved walls around as you like them, you can just ask the software to build the framing for you (see below and after below). The layout might not be just as Neal and some of the other framers would do it, but it would be better than most framing plans that the building inspection people see.

https://www.homedesignersoftware.com/products/home-designer-pro/

Chris

 

[3onthetree]

With your description of scope, it doesn't sound like you need any software. Plans can be hand drawn for such a small job, especially when you are just "fixing" things that were not done correctly. The sophistication of how the picture is made is not important, it's the information given on the picture. I've seen some chicken scratch submitted by contractors.

The AHJ is probably looking for what is existing vs. what is new. Anything that is altering the structure. Sizes/dimensions so calc's can be done on CFM and light/ventilation. Checking you're meeting energy requirements. Electrical layout. Bathroom layout so they can assign $$ per fixture and have a record for the tax assessor. Something the inspectors can view to understand the scope and what to look at. Even the crudest drawings can help to communicate with your contractors, prevent disputes, and maybe even hold bad work accountable.

You'll get feedback from your permit review and a lot of it will come in the field from the inspectors.

 

[Mystriss]

I kinda agree with 3 here. Buy some graph paper and a metal ruler. I have one that has 12 different plan scales on it for my designing.

That said, Home Designer Pro isn't bad, but unless they put in a major upgrade they don't do construction framing detailing - just a generic "every 16OC put a picture of this stud" - You can't edit it, move it around, make it look like what's actually in your walls unfortunately. A problem I've run into with my favorite of that type programs, Punch! Architectural Series.

 

[3onthetree]

you can just ask the software to build the framing for you (see below and after below). The layout might not be just as Neal and some of the other framers would do it, but it would be better than most framing plans that the building inspection people see.

Just to clarify, permitting does NOT need to see where your wall studs are located. And certainly do not let software do it, as the example provided is crap. It's really just for ****z and giggles, or a homeowner needs to count how many to buy instead of doing math. Besides in an existing space, there really is no "framing."

Actually for most any review, an actual "framing" plan is not needed (trusses notwithstanding); what is needed is beams/headers/posts, and a general notation of joists/rafters. Besides, if you were to sit at a desk and draw out stud placement, and the framer placed his studs differently (guaranteed!), the inspector could actually flag it. For the field though, a framing plan can make it easier on complicated jobs, especially for the roof.

One wall section might need provided to show the clear ceiling height and height of knee walls, or simply put general notes on the plan like "typical [email protected]" o.c. unless noted otherwise", "4'-0" high kneewall", "ceiling 8'-0" A.F.F.", etc.

 

[Chris616]

I agree on some points. I’ve never had the building inspection people ask for details of framing, and I’ve never had the occasion to use software to generate that before yesterday. But, one of the OP’s questions what software was available if their talk with the building inspector indicated that a framing layout plan was required.

I’m not qualified to judge the quality of the framing job that the software did in the example but whatever it is that you’ve found objectionable in the layout may have been due to the criteria that I chose before it was produced (see below). In any case if the user were to get serious about it he/she would start with the “automatic framing” that the software did based on the criteria specified by the user, then edit the layout as required. The editing tools get easier and more fully featured with more expensive versions of this software.

For DIYers, I see the value of this type of software as allowing people to do their own “big picture” reno layout planning. It’s a lot easier (for computer literate folks) and more flexible than doing it on paper and it’s cheaper (even with the cost of the software) than getting a design professional involved. Not everyone wants to do that kind of design themselves, but the people who are interested are the type who frequent a board like this.

Chris

 

[P C D]

If you want to write a novel, you can write it by hand, using a typewriter, or using some software like MS Word, but there is no software that will write the actual novel for you. Framing plans are the same: you can draw them by hand or with software that draws lines, but you still have to be the mind behind those lines to create a document that building officials will accept as "framing plans."

Most building departments have samples of what they require to see in plans, and typically it will take you longer to learn how to use any software than to draw them by hand following the samples.

 

[P C D]

For your project you would typically need a roof framing plan and a second-floor framing plan. The roof framing plan would show the rafters and what is holding them below, along with notes on the type of roof sheathing, connectors, etc; and the floor framing plan would show your floor joists and what is supporting them below.

If you need to add new beams or headers to support the new loads in your finished attic, there is no software that will provide you with their size and location based on any architectural lines you input into the software.

 

[chandler48]

I agree that software for small projects (unless you already own it) is not going to be required by the AHJ. I built a gambrel barn for a Doctor of Physics a long time ago, and he kicked what he wanted each day in the sand. I understood what he wanted but never understood why he was reluctant to put the whole thing on paper. It turned out great, just odd with his experience that he chose a primitive way of doing it.