[PandJ]

where a 4x4 is spec'd to use for a hold down to attach to, is it ok to use two 2x4 instead? or 2 2x6 ? Can't find anything on line....:vs_worry:

My architect mentioned that it was fine when we were discussing plans a few months ago but I'm framing a balloon framed rake wall and don't want to have to redo anything.

 

[joecaption]

No one knows what your building, no pictures. no drawings.
A hold down for what?
2, 2 X 4's are far less likely to curl and twist.

 

[PandJ]

its really a general question of application. A simpson strongtie hold down attaches to a threaded bolt that goes into foundation wall. Then you use structural screws to attach to a 4x4 or 4x6 depending on wall size. BUT, I think it may be ok to use two sistered 2x's instead.....

 

[TheEplumber]

If a 4x4 is spec'd-I'd stay with it. The last thing you want is your inspector failing you for not installing what the drawing says...
Have you checked with the engineer?

 

[rander101]

Two sistered 2X4's aren't the same as a 4x4. Two 2x4s measure 3 1/2" x 3". A 4x4 measures 3 1/2"X 3 1/2". If you are attaching them to a fixture designed for a 4x4 the 2x4s are not going to fit correctly , possibly compromising the joint.

 

[Mingledtrash]

Two sistered 2X4's aren't the same as a 4x4. Two 2x4s measure 3 1/2" x 3". A 4x4 measures 3 1/2"X 3 1/2". If you are attaching them to a fixture designed for a 4x4 the 2x4s are not going to fit correctly , possibly compromising the joint.

this is the correct answer however if you are doing multiple house that are engineer by the same engineer you can talk to him and ask him if he can spec it for 2-2x4 instead of a 4x4 there is likely enough wiggly room that they can do this because usually they over engineer everything. usually they will require 2-2x4 to be nailed together every 6-12 in. to meet the hold down requirements.

edit: sometimes this is actually included in the wood frame details of the plan, you know that 1-2 pages of words that people forget to read.:wink2:

 

[PandJ]

this is the correct answer however if you are doing multiple house that are engineer by the same engineer you can talk to him and ask him if he can spec it for 2-2x4 instead of a 4x4 there is likely enough wiggly room that they can do this because usually they over engineer everything. usually they will require 2-2x4 to be nailed together every 6-12 in. to meet the hold down requirements.

edit: sometimes this is actually included in the wood frame details of the plan, you know that 1-2 pages of words that people forget to read.:wink2:

I went ahead and am using 4x6 for the 4 hold downs. It's a balloon framed rake wall so will be fairly heavy to put up. Qualcraft jacks are great so far. This one wall is a 2x6 wall with all other sides 2x4 walls

I just need to figure out how to tie in to the side wall top plate. I can't seem to find a good diagram for this. The rake will have a double top plat as well as the side wall. The rake is a thru wall.

:vs_worry:

 

[Gary in WA]

Fig. 6/7; https://books.google.com/books?id=0...wall top plate to rake wall top plate&f=false for a perpendicular rake (gable) wall.

Try these (PDF)'s as my computer is too slow; https://www.google.com/search?q=str...all+top+plate+to+rake+wall+top+plate&start=10

"Exception"; http://publicecodes.cyberregs.com/icod/irc/2009/icod_irc_2009_6_par015.htm?bu2=undefined

Ask your Engineer; http://www.strongtie.com/lateralcon...p/hrs.st.fha.ps.lsta.lsti.msta.mstc.msti--mst

Gary

 

[Mingledtrash]

I went ahead and am using 4x6 for the 4 hold downs. It's a balloon framed rake wall so will be fairly heavy to put up. Qualcraft jacks are great so far. This one wall is a 2x6 wall with all other sides 2x4 walls

I just need to figure out how to tie in to the side wall top plate. I can't seem to find a good diagram for this. The rake will have a double top plat as well as the side wall. The rake is a thru wall.

:vs_worry:

sometimes cs16 coil strap is the best option.

 

[PandJ]

Fig. 6/7; https://books.google.com/books?id=0...wall top plate to rake wall top plate&f=false for a perpendicular rake (gable) wall.

Try these (PDF)'s as my computer is too slow; https://www.google.com/search?q=str...all+top+plate+to+rake+wall+top+plate&start=10

"Exception"; http://publicecodes.cyberregs.com/icod/irc/2009/icod_irc_2009_6_par015.htm?bu2=undefined

Ask your Engineer; http://www.strongtie.com/lateralcon...p/hrs.st.fha.ps.lsta.lsti.msta.mstc.msti--mst

Gary

Great stuff Gary. I've got my rake balloon wall framed but have not notched the ends for a top plate tie in. I'm reading all the links to absorb and get it right....don't want to notch an error in the 4x6 end studs as expensive error lol

 

[PandJ]

sometimes cs16 coil strap is the best option.

let me look at what that is :vs_worry:. :glasses:

 

[Mingledtrash]

let me look at what that is :vs_worry:. :glasses:

its not really a prescriptive thing but many time if you have a situation where you cannot lap the top plates with the required lengths the inspectors and/or engineers require you to lap coil strap 6-16 inches each side depending on shear schedule.

 

[PandJ]

Great stuff Gary. I've got my rake balloon wall framed but have not notched the ends for a top plate tie in. I'm reading all the links to absorb and get it right....don't want to notch an error in the 4x6 end studs as expensive error lol

Gary, Does this pic show how I should frame the ends to match adjacent wall and tie in? My rake has a double top plate so not sure but I think will work.

I know I have seen at sometime where the top plate from adjacent wall was beveled to meet the slop of the rake wall but I just can't find an example.....My Rake/gable wall is full width of house so it is the thru wall.

 

[ddawg16]

First....considering the minimal cost difference between a 4x4 vs 2 2x4's, it's a no brainer.

If I'm understanding the question correctly....you are trying to frame the corner and have a question of the top plate tie in.

To me....your main issue is you did the rafter before you had your top plate for the adjacent wall done.

What is normally done....the first top plate goes in....then the second...but overlapping the joint.

In your case, unless you cut the double 2x4's on top of what looks like a 4x6, you will need to use a strap to tie the walls together.

 

[PandJ]

First....considering the minimal cost difference between a 4x4 vs 2 2x4's, it's a no brainer.

If I'm understanding the question correctly....you are trying to frame the corner and have a question of the top plate tie in.

To me....your main issue is you did the rafter before you had your top plate for the adjacent wall done.

What is normally done....the first top plate goes in....then the second...but overlapping the joint.

In your case, unless you cut the double 2x4's on top of what looks like a 4x6, you will need to use a strap to tie the walls together.

Thanks for response. To clarify...this is NOT my build, just a pic i found.
My end stud each end of my wall is cut to rake but is at start is as high as adjacent wall(to be built) with its double plate. I'm just trying to figure how to tie in the double plate from the adjacent wall into the rake wall....

 

[ddawg16]

Oh, I see.

I had the same issue....this is how I did it.

I used the rafter as the tie in. The top plate just butts up against the other top plate....no overlap. On the outside, I have OSB that goes up to the top of the rafter so it provides the 'shear' strength needed to hold the corner together. I've also got a bunch of Simpson A21's in there.

 

[PandJ]

Oh, I see.

I had the same issue....this is how I did it.

I used the rafter as the tie in. The top plate just butts up against the other top plate....no overlap. On the outside, I have OSB that goes up to the top of the rafter so it provides the 'shear' strength needed to hold the corner together. I've also got a bunch of Simpson A21's in there.

Thanks for pic. Yes that's exactly what I have. My top plate on rake though is actually above the top plate on the adjacent wall.

I think I can notch in for the top plate to slip in over the end studs but below the rake top plates if that makes since. I'll post a pic of my wall with a sketch of area I plan on notching and get all your thoughts on it. I'll use strapping also as suggested.

What I'm learning in framing is that there are different approaches that work as long as the structure ends up solid and safe.