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Don't hire hacks.
Footing for Block ontop of existing Fieldstone foundation. Concerns w/ work done..
Hey guys. My house is all jacked up along the back side as we are doing major renovation to the foundation, sill, joists and stud ends.
Its an 1880's colonial. The foundation was originally brick on top of fieldstone. The fieldstone went up about 5ft and the brick about 18" above that to the sill. Anyway We removed the brick as it was in pretty bad shape and frost had heaved it in so it bulged in over the years. So I had some guys come out and poor a footing ontop of the fieldstone.
This is what I expected. I expected them to clean the surface of the fieldstone frame out the area and fill it about 6" high with concrete.
I had to run when they were starting and I came back as they were pouring the first bit of concrete...
They had boxed out a form from 2x8 which was fine. But they had thrown a lot of the removed brick directly onto the fieldstone. Just kind of tossed it on there. Which I was initially concerned about, but they said its filler material and normal for this type of operation. Hey I dont do concrete, what do I know.
But I was thinking about it. Since the rubble (which esentially randomly filled the entire bottom of the form) was not uniform, it woudl not allow concrete to flow through it and connect to the fieldstone, creating an area without a seal and could let moisture invade and cause problems. Shouldnt they have poured a bit of concrete directly on the fieldstone, THEN added the filler material then another course of concrete?
Am I correct in thinking this? or is this not as big a deal as I made it out to be?
Also the form was two seperate forms. two 2' x 10' boxes next to each other. So it had two 2x8s going across the middle where there would be no concrete. They told me that I should jsut leave them there and they would build the block right over the top of that. That seemed a bit stupid to me, since the wood would eventually rot out leaving a gap in the foundation. I plan to cut out the form and fill the gaps myself before they come back and lay the block. I would just do it all myself but I dont have a saw for cutting the block.
What are your thoughts?
Also should the block be filled with crete?
thanks!
Its an 1880's colonial. The foundation was originally brick on top of fieldstone. The fieldstone went up about 5ft and the brick about 18" above that to the sill. Anyway We removed the brick as it was in pretty bad shape and frost had heaved it in so it bulged in over the years. So I had some guys come out and poor a footing ontop of the fieldstone.
This is what I expected. I expected them to clean the surface of the fieldstone frame out the area and fill it about 6" high with concrete.
I had to run when they were starting and I came back as they were pouring the first bit of concrete...
They had boxed out a form from 2x8 which was fine. But they had thrown a lot of the removed brick directly onto the fieldstone. Just kind of tossed it on there. Which I was initially concerned about, but they said its filler material and normal for this type of operation. Hey I dont do concrete, what do I know.
But I was thinking about it. Since the rubble (which esentially randomly filled the entire bottom of the form) was not uniform, it woudl not allow concrete to flow through it and connect to the fieldstone, creating an area without a seal and could let moisture invade and cause problems. Shouldnt they have poured a bit of concrete directly on the fieldstone, THEN added the filler material then another course of concrete?
Am I correct in thinking this? or is this not as big a deal as I made it out to be?
Also the form was two seperate forms. two 2' x 10' boxes next to each other. So it had two 2x8s going across the middle where there would be no concrete. They told me that I should jsut leave them there and they would build the block right over the top of that. That seemed a bit stupid to me, since the wood would eventually rot out leaving a gap in the foundation. I plan to cut out the form and fill the gaps myself before they come back and lay the block. I would just do it all myself but I dont have a saw for cutting the block.
What are your thoughts?
Also should the block be filled with crete?
thanks!
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That's really bad. Did you check these guys out at all before hiring them? Do you know if the are licensed (as contractors) and bonded (insured for proper completion of the work)? Did they have construction documents (drawings and specifications) or permits?
There should not be bricks in the concrete used for your foundation. Also if the footing is only 8" nominal depth (actually 7.5" if 2x8 was used), then that's not deep enough. Also did they place any reinforcement in the footing?
Picture would be really helpful.
There should not be bricks in the concrete used for your foundation. Also if the footing is only 8" nominal depth (actually 7.5" if 2x8 was used), then that's not deep enough. Also did they place any reinforcement in the footing?
Picture would be really helpful.
To clarify, this footing is on top of an existing fieldstone foundation wall. The purpose of the footing was simply to make a level surface to lay block on. One course of block will meet the height I need to meet the sill.
About the workers. Well this is sort of my own fault I guess. These guys work for a reputable mason, with a small but well established company. The owner is also a friend. This friend owes my family a few favors. Offered his services. His work had come recommended buy other folks ayway. So I thought why not. He hired a couple of his guys to come to my house on a weekend day. They showed up without him, but seemed to me to know what they were doing. I am however starting to think that their work experience is probably more like sidewalks, steps and things like that and brickwork. Not foundation work.
So while it might be a major pain in the ass, im only out (so far) a day and 10 bags of concrete. And possibly a a jackhammer rental.
I dont have any pictures right now. Can snap some tomorrow.
Could someone explain how they would have properly poured this footing atop an uneven fieldstone foundation to make a level place for block placement. How thick it should be and how they would have situated any reinforcement?
Could someone also take a guess at the repercussions if they had finished the footing and put the block up and I had finished the work and lowered the house onto it?
I need to get this straightend out and would appreciate any insight so I can get it done correctly.
Thanks so much!
About the workers. Well this is sort of my own fault I guess. These guys work for a reputable mason, with a small but well established company. The owner is also a friend. This friend owes my family a few favors. Offered his services. His work had come recommended buy other folks ayway. So I thought why not. He hired a couple of his guys to come to my house on a weekend day. They showed up without him, but seemed to me to know what they were doing. I am however starting to think that their work experience is probably more like sidewalks, steps and things like that and brickwork. Not foundation work.
So while it might be a major pain in the ass, im only out (so far) a day and 10 bags of concrete. And possibly a a jackhammer rental.
I dont have any pictures right now. Can snap some tomorrow.
Could someone explain how they would have properly poured this footing atop an uneven fieldstone foundation to make a level place for block placement. How thick it should be and how they would have situated any reinforcement?
Could someone also take a guess at the repercussions if they had finished the footing and put the block up and I had finished the work and lowered the house onto it?
I need to get this straightend out and would appreciate any insight so I can get it done correctly.
Thanks so much!
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648 Posts
you're not going to satisfactorily ' bond ' the new conc to the old stone fnd but that's ok as the weight will be compressive ( downward ).
prior to boxing the forms, the existing should've been, at least, free of standing dirt & debris - powerwashing may preclude good results,,, i would've like to see 2 or 3 runs of #4 bar in the proper position but that'd be shown on properly stamp'd & approv'd plans,,,
adding ANYTHING to conc for ' filler ' negates the strength of the conc UNLESS its a graded aggregate however many jackleg contractors still believe strong rocks can substitute for mixing proper strength conc,,, unfortunately, the strength of the bricks is negligible in this instance,,, IF anyone thinks the conc'll ' flow ' around the brick to form a solid block out of typically-mix'd bag mix, call me - i've got a GREAT deal on a bridge 'cross the chattahoochie :thumbup:
2x8's are fine but their cross-bracing's idiotic imn-s-hfo :laughing: wood forms're brac'd from the OUTSIDE & NO ONE leaves the form,,, its YOUR home/project/property - if YOU don't think it merits doing right, that's ok, too ! ! ! ain't mine pay attn to the engineers - sometimes they do get it right :huh: in spite of what contractors think !
ps - i wouildn't let these guys operate any power tools - might hurt themselves & sue
pps - forget the pictures,,, hate seeing this stuff in real life
prior to boxing the forms, the existing should've been, at least, free of standing dirt & debris - powerwashing may preclude good results,,, i would've like to see 2 or 3 runs of #4 bar in the proper position but that'd be shown on properly stamp'd & approv'd plans,,,
adding ANYTHING to conc for ' filler ' negates the strength of the conc UNLESS its a graded aggregate however many jackleg contractors still believe strong rocks can substitute for mixing proper strength conc,,, unfortunately, the strength of the bricks is negligible in this instance,,, IF anyone thinks the conc'll ' flow ' around the brick to form a solid block out of typically-mix'd bag mix, call me - i've got a GREAT deal on a bridge 'cross the chattahoochie :thumbup:
2x8's are fine but their cross-bracing's idiotic imn-s-hfo :laughing: wood forms're brac'd from the OUTSIDE & NO ONE leaves the form,,, its YOUR home/project/property - if YOU don't think it merits doing right, that's ok, too ! ! ! ain't mine
pay attn to the engineers - sometimes they do get it right :huh: in spite of what contractors think !ps - i wouildn't let these guys operate any power tools - might hurt themselves & sue
pps - forget the pictures,,, hate seeing this stuff in real life
Yessit,
thanks so much for the reply. I have plenty of rebar here that was left from the previous owner. Im prety close to jack hammering out the pad and pouring my own.
The quickrete 80lb yellow bag stuff should be a good pour for this situation if I have properly setup rebar?
Could you breifly explain an idealy placed rebar situation for this? As in should they be placed in a crosshahtch pattern every foot situated so they would be in the middle of the concrete?
Thanks,
Josh
thanks so much for the reply. I have plenty of rebar here that was left from the previous owner. Im prety close to jack hammering out the pad and pouring my own.
The quickrete 80lb yellow bag stuff should be a good pour for this situation if I have properly setup rebar?
Could you breifly explain an idealy placed rebar situation for this? As in should they be placed in a crosshahtch pattern every foot situated so they would be in the middle of the concrete?
Thanks,
Josh
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