[curiousburke]

Hello All,
I've long wanted more burners, but don't want to mess with the cabinetry around our range. So, I recently hatched a plan to put a 2 burner induction cooktop into one of the counters. The problem I have is how to power it. I prefer not to pull a new line because the panel is far away in a finished basement.

I have tried a single induction burner plugged into the wall and if too many appliances get used it pops the breaker, so the wall circuit is a no go. This isn't entirely true because the micro is run off the wall circuit, which really should be on it's own circuit, then maybe the wall circuit would be fine. I'm asking for opinions on the options I have considered or a better one. Here are the options I have thought of:

1) the range is dual fuel, so only the oven is electric (40 amp required). It is powered by a 6awg, 50amp line. I could run a conduit from the range behind the cabinets (about 12') to the induction range. This is much like a with a wall oven and counter cooktop, although this range was probably not designed with this in mind. Advantage is that I can get 240v induction range.

2) the location of the induction rang is above a closet in a room that has low electrical requirements. I could add an outlet from that circuit. Would using a circuit from another room be allowed by code?

3) I could use the kitchen wall circuit with a plug in 120v unit, and run a new line to the microwave. I would like to recess the two burners into the countertop, so does that mean it is an installed appliance and must have its own circuit?

Thanks in advance!

 

[curiousburke]

I'll add one small thing. I plan to make a cutting board to fit the countertop hole of the induction cooktop. This way I haven't completely disfigured the counters if the induction cooktop (I edited this from "range" as that was a mistake) doesn't work out.

 

[dcwired]

You seem to be bouncing off the wall with what you want and don't want to do.
Do you want a new range or cooktop?
You have to know the voltage needed for any suggestions.
So are or are you not able to run a new circuit?
See what I mean in post #2? You said cooktop, then change it to range.
Sorry to be so nasty, but I have to know where you are going to know how to get there.

 

[SW Dweller]

Fixed appliances require separate circuits by code. Once you make up your mind then you can decide how to power what you want. Splitting a circuit is not something I would consider due to the possibility both being used at the same time.

 

[curiousburke]

You seem to be bouncing off the wall with what you want and don't want to do.
Do you want a new range or cooktop?
You have to know the voltage needed for any suggestions.
So are or are you not able to run a new circuit?
See what I mean in post #2? You said cooktop, then change it to range.
Sorry to be so nasty, but I have to know where you are going to know how to get there.

I do often use range as the general term. Sorry about that, now it is edited.

 

[curiousburke]

Fixed appliances require separate circuits by code. Once you make up your mind then you can decide how to power what you want. Splitting a circuit is not something I would consider due to the possibility both being used at the same time.

Is using them at the same time a problem when a wall oven and cooktop are on the same circuit?

 

[curiousburke]

As for the voltage, that is decided by what course of action I take. Both 120v and 240v cooktops are available.

 

[C'est Moi]

This could be quite simple. Note 4 to T.220.55 allows one cooktop and one oven to be calculated by adding the nameplate of both units and then use T.220.55.

Now you don't technically have an oven and a cooktop but given that the range is dual fuel I would consider that one oven. An inspector may not agree but let's face it, it is electrically one oven barring the igniter.

SO you could run a piece of #6 over from the range to the cooktop and leave it on a 40 or 50 am breaker. It is like a tap rule for a branch cir.

The image below is a similar example. Since you are extending the branch circuit with the #6 then there should not be an issue.

 

[curiousburke]

This could be quite simple. Note 4 to T.220.55 allows one cooktop and one oven to be calculated by adding the nameplate of both units and then use T.220.55.

Now you don't technically have an oven and a cooktop but given that the range is dual fuel I would consider that one oven. An inspector may not agree but let's face it, it is electrically one oven barring the igniter.

SO you could run a piece of #6 over from the range to the cooktop and leave it on a 40 or 50 am breaker. It is like a tap rule for a branch cir.

Yes, that is exactly what I was thinking. I'm glad to hear someone else thinks this isn't a crazy idea. If that is an arguably compliant setup, then it is probably the best option.

 

[dcwired]

I agree that it is ok to have an electric cooktop with the existing circuit for the dual fuel range. I never really understood why a standard size dual fuel range needed the same size power supply as an electric range, burners included.

 

[curiousburke]

I agree that it is ok to have an electric cooktop with the existing circuit for the dual fuel range. I never really understood why a standard size dual fuel range needed the same size power supply as an electric range, burners included.

Yeah, I have wondered that too!

I see I didn't answer one of your questions. I am able to run a new 20A circuit to the microwave (over the current range) without too much trouble, but I was thinking new 20A circuit to the location of the new cooktop would be a PITA. However, after laying out the possibilities, I realize that I could combine the options and run the new 20A circuit in the floor to the location of the range then run it in conduit behind the cabinets to the new cooktop.

 

[curiousburke]

Another question: if I go with taping the 240v range circuit, can I put the range outlet in the same junction box as the new tap?

 

[dcwired]

If it is easiest enough to get a new circuit to the microwave, that is a requirement anyway as per NEC freeing up basically an entire circuit on the countertop. Perhaps that allows you to get by with using other countertop appliances for additional cooking surfaces. Of course an additional cooktop fed from the range circuit is still perhaps the most bang for the buck.
Now that does create another dilemma splicing into the range circuit. 2- #6 cables and the receptacle are not going to fit into 1 box.

 

[Biscuits]

I never really understood why a standard size dual fuel range needed the same size power supply as an electric range, burners included.

I don't understand either, but at least it gives someone flexibility in the future to easily convert to a 100% electric range without too much hassle and expense.

 

[C'est Moi]

I agree that it is ok to have an electric cooktop with the existing circuit for the dual fuel range. I never really understood why a standard size dual fuel range needed the same size power supply as an electric range, burners included.

What don't you understand? What is the difference between a range and a cooktop with an oven?

 

[MTVhike]

What don't you understand? What is the difference between a range and a cooktop with an oven?

The dual fuel range has an electric oven and a gas cooktop; a regular electric range, both the oven and the cooktop are electric and, assuming the same oven, should require more power.

 

[C'est Moi]

The dual fuel range has an electric oven and a gas cooktop; a regular electric range, both the oven and the cooktop are electric and, assuming the same oven, should require more power.

The op is talking about a dual fuel unit and a small induction cooktop, not another range. That was my understanding. The result is the same as one range.

Basically, the dual fuel range is treated as an electric oven and the induction cooktop is just that a cooktop. Put them together and you have an electric range- so to speak.

 

[MTVhike]

The op is talking about a dual fuel unit and a small induction cooktop, not another range. That was my understanding. The result is the same as one range.

Basically, the dual fuel range is treated as an electric oven and the induction cooktop is just that a cooktop. Put them together and you have an electric range- so to speak.

Yes, I agree. He was also comparing the electrical requirements for the two types of ranges (dual-fuel and electric only). Unrelated to his induction cooktop question.

 

[curiousburke]

Yes, that's right, I'm looking at adding a small cooktop to the existing dual fuel range. I did use the term "induction range" accidentally once, but I have since edited that.

 

[MTVhike]

All good!