[hayley3]

I'm a novice and I'm trying to install a strip vanity light.
I have to get on a ladder and reach over the vanity and there's only room for one person. The faceplate is attached to the back plate by the ground wire which makes it impossible (in my opinion) to hang the back plate unless I let the faceplate dangle and maybe damage the ground wire.

So what was a simple thing is now complicated...for me...at least.

Sorry the image is sideways for some reason.

Thanks,
Cheryl

 

[MTN REMODEL LLC]

Not uncommon....just support the face plate somehow...tape it to the wall...or a couple of nails to temp hold it.... or cut the ground and just wire nut it back together when you install the top plate.......:wink2:

 

[hayley3]

I thought the ground wires simply needed to be connected to the wire inside the wall...just didn't make since that it is connected to the faceplate also..
Good idea on nailing it up..too heavy for tape.

 

[MTN REMODEL LLC]

That ground wire just insures the metal face plate is grounded also in case of a ground fault......(probably is anyway by nature of the screws that attach the faceplate to the wall plate, but paint can interfere with that continuity so they insure it has a good ground.....I often let it just dangle carefully....never had it break.)

 

[J. V.]

I use the bare ground to hold it up while I make up the rest of the connections.
That bare wire is very strong. Try to pull it off.
On second thought, don't try to pull it off........lol
China does not care about strength, looks or usability. Fast buck only.

 

[Colbyt]

That face plate is attached to the back plate by a single green screw hiding under the white wire. Simply disconnect for a bit or better yet put it inside a paper bag and let it dangle.


The paper bag is to protect your mirror or wall. The wire can support the weight.


edit: because the painted metal surface might prevent the face from being grounded and it must be in a damp location.

 

[hayley3]

Thank you ALL so much! I got the light up. You really can't remove the ground wire...that I could see anyway.

I had bigger issues when I removed the other backplate.
There was no hole to shove the wires into the wall. So I had to use my mostly broken oscillating saw to cut through some of the drywall...I hit some kind of box in there but managed to make a bit of a hole.

I took a pic of the ground wire attached to the faceplate and the groundwire attached to the backplate just so you could see it. They look permanently attached to me.

Anyway light is up...whew!!

 

[surferdude2]

I had bigger issues when I removed the other backplate.
There was no hole to shove the wires into the wall. So I had to use my mostly broken oscillating saw to cut through some of the drywall...I hit some kind of box in there but managed to make a bit of a hole.

I'd say you have bigger issues! You are required to have an approved junction box to connect a fixture to, not just cut a hole and stuff the open wires and connectors into the wall. That's a fire hazard that you need to correct.

 

[hayley3]

I'd say you have bigger issues! You are required to have an approved junction box to connect a fixture to, not just cut a hole and stuff the open wires and connectors into the wall. That's a fire hazard that you need to correct.

What's the difference between the blue box and the wall? The light was like that when I took it down, in case that was not clear. It had a grey circle thing around the wires btw.
How do I add a junction box from the front side? *sighs*

 

[RAL238]

What's the difference between the blue box and the wall? The light was like that when I took it down, in case that was not clear. It had a grey circle thing around the wires btw.
How do I add a junction box from the front side? *sighs*

You say you hit some kind of box behind the hole, so maybe there is a box there and the drywall was never cut out to completely expose it. Post a picture if you can and maybe we can figure out if there is a box there.

The blue boxes are junction boxes and protect the wiring. If there is ever a problem that causes the wiring to heat up, it will protect a potential fire from spreading quickly to the surrounding wall. The electrical code requires all connections to be made inside a junction box or other approved enclosure. You can't just stuff the splice into the wall.

To install a new box, there are "old work" boxes that can be put in from the room side of the wall.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Carlon-...eiling-Electrical-Outlet-Box-BH614R/100580105

 

[hayley3]

You say you hit some kind of box behind the hole, so maybe there is a box there and the drywall was never cut out to completely expose it. Post a picture if you can and maybe we can figure out if there is a box there.

The blue boxes are junction boxes and protect the wiring. If there is ever a problem that causes the wiring to heat up, it will protect a potential fire from spreading quickly to the surrounding wall. The electrical code requires all connections to be made inside a junction box or other approved enclosure. You can't just stuff the splice into the wall.

To install a new partition, there are "old work" boxes that can be put in from the room side of the wall.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Carlon-...eiling-Electrical-Outlet-Box-BH614R/100580105

It was a wood type partition...I really don't know...since I just opened up the wall enough to shove those wires in. I'll have to do some research on how to put wires into that blue box. Is there an opening in the box somewhere?
Can the wires heat up if the light is not used?

 

[lenaitch]

All electrical connections have to be made inside a junction box. Some lamp fixtures are certified as junction boxes but I highly doubt yours is. Having wires going directly into these types of fixtures isn't approved by certainly not uncommon.
Depending on where the wood "partition" (stud) is located may complicate cutting in an old work junction box.

 

[hayley3]

I have to stop DIY'ing for today, when I get back to it, I will remove the light and take pictures.

 

[afjes2015]

check the directions that came with the light fixture. It will usually tell you if you can make your connections within the fixture itself. But the romex has to come thru the round hole have a strain relief (romex connector) and then the connections can be made within the box. If the instructions show this then the fixture was probably approved for connections to be made inside. Just be darn sure that no conductors are just sitting inside the wall without sheathing around them and of course no connections inside the wall without a box.

 

[hayley3]

So I received the junction box. I'm not sure I got the right one.
I figured out where the wires come in...but what is the metal thing supposed to do?
I saw a Youtube video that shows a different one with tabs but then I heard those were hard to insert into the hole because the tabs stick out.

 

[RAL238]

The metal bracket goes inside the wall and expands out a bit to grab the wall board from behind as you tighten down the screws from inside the box.

 

[afjes2015]

RAL238 explained to you how to use the one with the metal.


The other one looking at the picture could be deceiving a bit the way the photo is taken. The plastic tabs actually turn so they are under the rim of the box. You will see screws for the tabs. When you insert the box into the wall just tuck the tabs under the rim of the box. When you tighten down the screws the tabs come out from under the rim of the box and clamp themselves behind the wall surface and the rim thus tightening the box securely to the wall/ceiling. I prefer the boxes with the plastic tabs because if you have to take them out in the future just loosening the screws will turn the tabs so they go under the rim of the box and then you can pull the box out of the wall/ceiling.


Here is a youtube video of how to install the plastic box with the plastic tabs/wings. Not the greatest of videos but will clear up your confusion a bit. Just be sure you cut the hole in the wall/ceiling to the size of the box not he box plus the wings. Also it should be off set from any studs so that the wings can come out and hold against the sheet rock when you tighten the screws.

 

[hayley3]

I saw the video with the tabs but cannot find one for the metal thing...I don't think I have anything to screw into behind the opening. I have to get up the nerve to take the light down..but I think I should just get the other box first.

 

[surferdude2]

You may need to snip the hole in the fixture panel a little larger to have it open to the box location. You may want to pick up some snips if you have none, while you're out shopping for the box.

 

[hayley3]

Sorry, do you mean the holes that I already pried open?, to make them bigger? I'm a bit worried about pulling the wires in through those tiny holes.