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Yep, one will always get a better price when quoted in the off seasons of mild weather like spring and fall. In fact the reason I've had to learn about hvac is because I refuse to pay the rip off pricing or wait 1 to 2 weeks for a hvac person to show up with normal prices. When companies want to charge you $50 for reconnecting a loose wire on top of their $90 service call you realize how unethical this industry is. or the biggest lie they all engage in is telling you how f***ing expensive refrigerant is because of epa regulations, etc. and then you look up the price and it's 1/20th what they quoted you.
For reconnecting a wire would be my minimum charge. 1½ hrs, truck charge, taxes. $150 is cheap. Even for a honest residential company here.
 

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For reconnecting a wire would be my minimum charge. 1½ hrs, truck charge, taxes. $150 is cheap. Even for a honest residential company here.
wrong. tell me its $90 for service call and then calling me up and trying to charge me $50 more and refusing to tell me what the issue is until I pay him the extra $50 is just being a little douche bag.
 

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Its $145.00 to get me to your door. It could be 45 bucks, or 90 bucks for the wire reconnection, and then checking that it was just a wire that came loose, and didn't come loose from some other problem though.

The guy didn't rip you off, if he told you the price to reconnect that wire before hand, and gave you the option of him connecting it or not.

Wish I could get 20 times what R22 cost me. 25 bucks a pound wholesale times 20=%500.00 Yeah I could take a couple days off just doing 10 pounds of top offs a week.

Sounds like you were using a lat rate company for the refrigerant example. So labor is included in that per pound charge.
 
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Its $145.00 to get me to your door. It could be 45 bucks, or 90 bucks for the wire reconnection, and then checking that it was just a wire that came loose, and didn't come loose from some other problem though.

The guy didn't rip you off, if he told you the price to reconnect that wire before hand, and gave you the option of him connecting it or not.

Wish I could get 20 times what R22 cost me. 25 bucks a pound wholesale times 20=%500.00 Yeah I could take a couple days off just doing 10 pounds of top offs a week.

Sounds like you were using a lat rate company for the refrigerant example. So labor is included in that per pound charge.
Commercial rates would be about $250-350 (cdn) here after taxes, for that. (Ontario)

Insurance, union labour rates, vehicles, and overhead are all very expensive.
 

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Played around a bit with the sizing calculator. Used 80% sensible and 20% latent cooling. Heat output based on new 80MBH 96% AFUE furnace. Output would be about 1MBH low. The 1.5 ton is marginal a 2 ton would be better. Biggest concern would be the additional static pressure a small coil would add to the existing system. Note below the CFM increase needed to maintain mass flow rate at 8700' for a 1.5 ton unit. Static pressure measurements of the existing system would be nice.

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many if not all 14-16 range seer units use a 1 ton larger coil just to hit ratings.
Use a larger coil and it should be fine imo.
 

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Not too worried about how the cooling will work. Wondering what temp. rise he could see when heating. ACF altitude correction factor about .73 at 8500'. That's point 73 for those with bad eyes. Existing furnace about 77MBH output. At 1600 CFM it's about 61F, ok enough. At 1200CFM it's about 81F, pretty hot. Don't know anything about the existing duct work.


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Not too worried about how the cooling will work. Wondering what temp. rise he could see when heating. ACF altitude correction factor about .73 at 8500'. That's point 73 for those with bad eyes. Existing furnace about 77MBH output. At 1600 CFM it's about 61F, ok enough. At 1200CFM it's about 81F, pretty hot. Don't know anything about the existing duct work.


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Not a concern imo.
The furnace has a strong blower in it and should be able to overcome the extra drop of a 3 ton nominal coil, no problem unless the static without the coil is already through the roof.
 

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Discussion Starter · #110 ·
I was looking around today and noticed one site had two listings of a 2 ton condenser paired with a 3/3.5 ton coil. It was Goodman brand which I know nothing about. I think it’s going to be difficult to find a coil under 3 ton that fits my 24.5 wide housing. I looked at the heat exchanger(well I looked best I could) and it looks good to my untrained eye.
 

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"That's the big unknown. The OP could measure temperature rise, we'd get some idea of where it's at. Clocking the meter would get a reasonable input value. "

Yes, temp rise should be checked.
With op's blower being able to push over 1900 cfm at 0.9", i really think it will be fine.


I was looking around today and noticed one site had two listings of a 2 ton condenser paired with a 3/3.5 ton coil. It was Goodman brand which I know nothing about. I think it’s going to be difficult to find a coil under 3 ton that fits my 24.5 wide housing.
Read previous replies in this thread, you don't need a coil under 3 ton.
 

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Discussion Starter · #112 · (Edited)
"That's the big unknown. The OP could measure temperature rise, we'd get some idea of where it's at. Clocking the meter would get a reasonable input value. "

Yes, temp rise should be checked.
With op's blower being able to push over 1900 cfm at 0.9", i really think it will be fine.




Read previous replies in this thread, you don't need a coil under 3 ton.
Gotcha. I have to go back and re-read periodically lol. I just thought it odd that the mismatched pairs were actually listed.
Admitedly, the just prior data/sizing conversation is WAY over my head.
 

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Discussion Starter · #113 ·
many if not all 14-16 range seer units use a 1 ton larger coil just to hit ratings.
Use a larger coil and it should be fine imo.
“The Goodman CAPF3642D6 evaporator coil is rated for a 3 to 3.5 ton output. In many system configurations, this coil may be larger in tonnage than its paired condenser. This is intentional, to maintain the overall efficiency of the entire system.”

Nailed it...
 

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Not too worried about how the cooling will work. Wondering what temp. rise he could see when heating. ACF altitude correction factor about .73 at 8500'. That's point 73 for those with bad eyes. Existing furnace about 77MBH output. At 1600 CFM it's about 61F, ok enough. At 1200CFM it's about 81F, pretty hot. Don't know anything about the existing duct work.


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You have to use the derated BTU amount, along with the lower density of air. A 60°f rise is fairly normal on the higher end. I've seen some rated at 80°f rise. 130°f supply isn't crazy either. The average used to be higher.
 

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I was looking around today and noticed one site had two listings of a 2 ton condenser paired with a 3/3.5 ton coil. It was Goodman brand which I know nothing about. I think it’s going to be difficult to find a coil under 3 ton that fits my 24.5 wide housing. I looked at the heat exchanger(well I looked best I could) and it looks good to my untrained eye.
Any 1½-2 ton ac will have ratings for up to 4-5 ton coils. The manufacturers matching software will pick something closer, but they will have ratings never the less. They are not mismatched. Unrated pairs are mismatched.

You can use a smaller uncased coil then furnace width without issue. Also rated properly. Just need to check that it's dry resistance will not be an issue for the furnace. (in your case, I'm not worried.)
 

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Temp rise calc was based on the derated output of the existing furnace. The correction factor for density was used too.

Just need to check that it's dry resistance will not be an issue for the furnace. (in your case, I'm not worried.)
In my case "I'm not 100% sure". :)
 

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I know everyone has their own preference, but are there unreliable/problematic brands?
I would just avoid the cheaply made "builder's special" line units like ameristar, run-tru, goodman and lennox merit series (and air-flo, docane, etc also by lennox).

You don't need anything fancy and or efficient in such a mild climate.
 
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