Cast Iron Drain Pipe - Metal Sheath - What Am I Looking At?

1279 Views 20 Replies 6 Participants Last post by Nealtw, Feb 12, 2020

CFranz

Discussion Starter · Feb 10, 2020

Looking to install a bathroom in a home built in 62. As far as we can tell the plumbing was roughed in but I have no idea if there was ever a functioning toilet in here before. The cast iron drain pipe was capped, and upon inspection there is some sort of metal sheath around it. It was crushed in, but very malleable so I pried it back into shape to get an idea of what we were working with. It looks like the drain pipe will need to be cut down about 1/2 in to get it before the floor so we can install the flange (will likely install one with the expanding rubber gasket inside the pipe). What is this metal sheath? Can I just cut it out? Or do I need to pull up the floor and get under there? This is the basement so there is no under the floor access.

Thanks!

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CFranz

Discussion Starter · #2 · Feb 10, 2020

It looks terribly rusty in these pictures, but the flash really exaggerates it.

Nealtw

· #3 · Feb 10, 2020

The metal is lead. I have never seen both lead and cast iron together like that. Usually it would be one or the other.

CFranz

Discussion Starter · #4 · Feb 10, 2020

Nealtw said:
The metal is lead. I have never seen both lead and cast iron together like that. Usually it would be one or the other.

Weird! And thank you for the response! What is the purpose of the lead sheath? Is it safe to cut with a grinder, or should I get something like sheet-metal cutters to avoid too much dust?

ront02769

· #5 · Feb 10, 2020

Lead wrapped around cast iron? We’re I doing the work I’d be tearing things apart to see exactly what is going on beneath those boards.

Nealtw

· #6 · Feb 10, 2020

CFranz said:
Weird! And thank you for the response! What is the purpose of the lead sheath? Is it safe to cut with a grinder, or should I get something like sheet-metal cutters to avoid too much dust?

Is this on concrete or do you have access below?

CFranz

Discussion Starter · #7 · Feb 10, 2020

Nealtw said:
Is this on concrete or do you have access below?

Concrete, so unfortunately no access underneath.

Nealtw

· #8 · Feb 10, 2020

CFranz said:
Concrete, so unfortunately no access underneath.

Is the cast Iron just a short piece left in there to hold the shape while the did the concrete?

CFranz

Discussion Starter · #9 · Feb 10, 2020 (Edited)

Nealtw said:
Is the cast Iron just a short piece left in there to hold the shape while the did the concrete?

I don't believe so - you can hear gurgling way down in the pipe when other water is running throughout the house, so I believe it is hooked up, and you can definitely get a smell of some sewer gasses if you leave the cap off. Is there a better way I should verify that?

Nealtw

· #10 · Feb 10, 2020

CFranz said:
I don't believe so - you can hear gurgling way down in the pipe when other water is running throughout the house, so I believe it is hooked up, and you can definitely get a smell of some sewer gasses if you leave the cap off. Is there a better way I should verify that?

I was thinking maybe the cast iron was just 6 or 8 inches long but best you wait for some one that is more knowledgeable about what you have.

CFranz

Discussion Starter · #11 · Feb 10, 2020

Nealtw said:
I was thinking maybe the cast iron was just 6 or 8 inches long but best you wait for some one that is more knowledgeable about what you have.

I appreciate the help!

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CFranz

Discussion Starter · #12 · Feb 11, 2020

My dad had a plumber friend look at pictures and he said there had been a toilet installed in the past that was ripped out and the lead sheath and flange was left in place. He said the lead can be cut out and a new flange installed and it should be good to go. Lead was probably used to control moisture since the pipe goes underground.

Nealtw

· #13 · Feb 11, 2020

CFranz said:
My dad had a plumber friend look at pictures and he said there had been a toilet installed in the past that was ripped out and the lead sheath and flange was left in place. He said the lead can be cut out and a new flange installed and it should be good to go. Lead was probably used to control moisture since the pipe goes underground.

I don't know, usually you get lead instead of cast. just for the last foot or so. pipe protector sounds as good as anything. How high is the cast iron to what will be the finished floor?

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CFranz

Discussion Starter · #14 · Feb 11, 2020

Nealtw said:
I don't know, usually you get lead instead of cast. just for the last foot or so. pipe protector sounds as good as anything. How high is the cast iron to what will be the finished floor?

Cast iron is about 3/4 inch over the finished floor.

Ghostmaker

· #15 · Feb 11, 2020

Your cast is higher than your finished floor. You really should break out the floor and adapt to plastic with a pro flex band cast iron to PL. Install 4 inch plastic. Then cut that to your finished floor and Glue your toilet flange into the 4 inch PVC pipe. Fasten your new flange ring and your done.....

HandyAndyInNC

· #16 · Feb 11, 2020

I hate plastic anything that has to do with the mechanical in a house. I would set a nice sturdy cast iron flange in. You can remove the lead and use either a wax ring or a rubber one. Lead was once used to seal the connection to the ceramic. Not everyone used a wax ring. Lead lasted longer. You may look under to see if you can lower the vertical pipe about an inch. I would pour a lot of water down the drain to ensure there are no leaks before placing a toilet.

Nealtw

· #17 · Feb 12, 2020

CFranz said:
Cast iron is about 3/4 inch over the finished floor.

You will need to cut it lower

https://www.amazon.com/Oatey-43539-Flange-Replacement-4-Inch/dp/B000DZHDQG

CFranz

Discussion Starter · #18 · Feb 12, 2020

Thanks for the help everyone. I will pour water down to make sure there's no obvious issues, cut the lead out, cut the pipe down and give it a shot!

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ct18

· #19 · Feb 12, 2020

It was used so the concrete was not poured tight to the riser making the install of the flange tough. We still do it today but with buckets or wooden boxes or larger pipes. We take it off on the finish though.

CFranz

Discussion Starter · #20 · Feb 12, 2020

ct18 said:
It was used so the concrete was not poured tight to the riser making the install of the flange tough. We still do it today but with buckets or wooden boxes or larger pipes. We take it off on the finish though.

ahh ok that makes sense - thank you for the clarification!

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