[pmfleisch]

Hello,

I'm a DIY'er wanting to start a basement bathroom project. I'm going to hire a plumber for permitting and final ok's, but want to start trenching to get the project going.

The bathroom will have a shower, lav and toilet. I also want to put in a new floor drain on the other side of the bathroom wall to replace the current floor drain that will be removed by my project.

There is a floor drain that I'm going to drain everything into (under grade). There are dry vents above the bathroom that I'm going to vent everything into.

Here's my questions...

1) Does my layout make sense? I think I'm doing it right, but the floor drain tied into the shower is a bit of a guess.

2) If the layout does work, do my sizes look ok?

3) How deep do all these things have to be? Is it just enough to keep a 1/4" per foot angle for drainage or is there a 6" under flood requirement?

4) Any other bits of wisdom would be appreciated.

Again, I'm not planning on doing this start to finish by myself, but I want to get things going. I've got a baby on the way and want to do what I can before I run out of time.

Thanks for your help.

 

[joecaption]

If your going to be using a plumber why are you not asking them these questions and have them tell you where the floor needs to be busted out.
I'd hate to have them show up and not approve of your plan and have to redo it.

 

[pmfleisch]

fair question... a couple reasons...1) I'm confident enough with my research and what I've drawn to start trenching. 2) I think differences that a plumber would require wouldn't necessarily mean my trenches were in the wrong place. 3) I want to get started sooner than it would take to get a plumber here. 4) Of course if I can avoid bringing someone here with a $70 mobilization fee, I'd rather Do it Myself... hence the title DIY-er.

 

[TarheelTerp]

I'm going to hire a plumber for permitting

Find whoever this plumber might be... first.

I think differences that a plumber would require wouldn't necessarily mean my trenches were in the wrong place.

a) the plumber isn't the one who will require anything
2) the local licensed contractor will know what the local code calls for.

btw... where are you and which code is followed there?

good luck.

 

[hvac benny]

Find whoever this plumber might be... first.

I second this. Who knows if you'll even be able to find a licensed, insured and qualified plumber (ie. a real plumber able to pull permits, not just a handyman) willing to go along with this idea.

 

[TheEplumber]

Judging by your drawing, you need to hire a plumber. Have him layout the trenching and depth of each line. Pay him for his time then call him in to top it out.
You have too many errors on your drawing... no offence meant

 

[pmfleisch]

Ok, I get it. I'll wait to talk to the plumber. I guess I just thought there was a right way to do this and those with wisdom could share that wisdom. I'm thankful that you're not being mean about it, some responses I've seen to people are ridiculous. That said, I was hoping to learn something and all I've learned is that I'm not doing it right. I knew that before I first posted.

 

[hvac benny]

It doesn't matter what anyone here thinks you're doing wrong, it only matters how your plumber wants it done (and ultimately the inspector, if it gets inspected).

 

[jaydevries]

we are willing to help but if you are going to hire a plumber any way let them tell you how they want to run it due to plumbers have preference on how they want to run pipe and there can be more than one way and both will pass an inspection

 

[pmfleisch]

Really? I just can't believe that if I asked 50 plumbers that 45 of them wouldn't say - this is how to do it. Isn't that the point of the UPC?

 

[TheEplumber]

Really? I just can't believe that if I asked 50 plumbers that 45 of them wouldn't say - this is how to do it. Isn't that the point of the UPC?

No, plumbing codes are ultimately designed to protect your health. There are more then one way to vent a toilet, drain a lav or shower. Conditions dictate the methods chosen.

 

[TarheelTerp]

I just can't believe that if I asked 50 plumbers that 45 of them wouldn't say - this is (one of twenty ways for) how to do it.

But you didn't do that.

You said in effect: "hey look at my amateur scheme that I think will do X and save me $500 or $1000 'cause everyone knows all I'll need a pro for is to make it all official".

Isn't that the point of the UPC?

The code isn't a design guide.

 

[TheEplumber]

Here's my questions...

1) Does my layout make sense? I think I'm doing it right, but the floor drain tied into the shower is a bit of a guess.

2) If the layout does work, do my sizes look ok?

3) How deep do all these things have to be? Is it just enough to keep a 1/4" per foot angle for drainage or is there a 6" under flood requirement?

4) Any other bits of wisdom would be appreciated.
1. Makes sense but not correct. Yeah, FD/shower wrong.

2. Layouts wrong in several spots, but sizing OK

3. Needs to be as deep as the 3" or 4" you're connecting to- which is probably not the floor drain.

4. Get bids from plumbers as previously stated
Hope some of that helps. :thumbsup:

 

[pmfleisch]

Tarheel - you need to relax a bit bud. I was turning to a forum on a webiste titled "DIY" for some advice from people that know more about it than I do. Sounds like you've got some insecurity issues you've got to work on. As for saving money, yeah, I'd like to save money. If it comes down to me doing work and making the project financially do-able or having to turn completely to a pro and not being able to afford it, I'd rather do the first one.

EPlumber - Thanks for your response. I really appreciate your addressing my original questions. I am going to go the route of a pro. I'll probably also have a concrete cutter do the trench for me. I think the thing I learned most about plumbing is the part about code and design being two completely different things. I just assumed (and I don't think insultingly) that the right way to do it was the right way. I know it's too late for more advice, but the existing floor drain is 3 inches by the way.


I hope you appreciate that I know enough about what I don't know to take the time to ask and in this case turn it over to the pros. I'm guessing a few of the...less kind.. of you are bitter due to the average Joe's stupidity that you have to clean up.

 

[jaydevries]

you can save money by removing the concrete and digging the ditch which i know most plumbers whine and complain about the physical labor and charge for it to, look at it this way if lets say you are a computer programmer and a client hires you but tells you i already started coding it i just want you to finish it. it will frustrate you knowing the guy bought a book on c++ for dummies and then realized it was way over his head which means you would charge more knowing you are having to figure why he did what he did
so what i am saying is most codes will let the home owner pull a permit and do the work themselves know either they are knowledgeable or they are going to make more money on all the re inspection fees so if you want to learn that is great but i would start with a smaller plumbing project or educate my self a lot more before starting and i never mind a paying costumer asking me the why i did it that way as long as i know it is for them to gain knowledge and not questioning my work

 

[pmfleisch]

Yeah, I've done a lot of finish work and think I've always been up to snuff. I've also done a lot of renovating, but obviously, that means rough in is in place. I thought this could be the next step for me.

Your computer analogy makes a lot of sense. I don't want to insult here because you've been really helpful, so please take this as an honest, respectful comment. Where I think the computer analogy breaks down is that writing computer code is something that I could never do, but if you give me a plan, I can put together PVC. In other words, if you told me here's the lines of code to type out I could do it.

As an aside, I always ask workers that come into my house lots of questions because I want to learn from what they know. It's a good reminder for me to make sure they know I'm not questioning them, but rather hoping to learn something along the way.