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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I know that the stud inside the drywall is 16" apart from center to center. But I notice that around the window, door, the corner, it is hard to guess where the studs are.

I bought a new tech stud finder with the live wire and metal finder last December, but still it is difficult around the window and door frames, and corners. I also has the magnetic stud finder looking for nails in the stud.

Is there any better way to guess more correctly the studs around the windows, door, and the corners and any gaps between the studs, close to X-ray vision?

Also, is the horizontal stud between the 16"-apart vertical studs within one story(between two floor levels) always there once somewhere in the middle, or sometimes none, or more than once in some situation?

Thank you very much.
 

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retired framer
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If you have all the rules, there are as many or more exception to every one of them.

Windows and doors should always have 2 studs on each side a jack under the header and a king beside that if it has a header, it may not be as thick as the wall so you might find a void where the header and jacks are and if they are 5 ft wide it will have 2 or sometimes 3 jacks under each end.

In the corners there should always be what we call drywall backing for 1" from the corner the drywall uses 1/2" of a 2x4 face. This always true, except when the is a stud 2 or 3" away that will support the drywall, then the corner one may be left out.



16" OC is laid out for the outside of the building should be marked out first and then the windows and doors are marked in, so the layout should go from one side of the house to the other.
So if the walls are 2x4 walls the first stud from the outside corner 12" from the drywall and if you have 2x6 walls it might be 10" from the drywall.


The layout goes from one side to the other and does not change to fit a bedroom or bathroom.

In a perfect world all the studs and floor joists would line up and all walls in between would also line up but the world is not always perfect.
 

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Firstly if you expect _all_ (2x4) studs at 16 OC I've got a bridge I'll let go at a really good price! Secondly studs should be double around window and door rough openings but ...
Get a good stud finder and try piercing the drywall with a long brad in a location you can patch & fill successfully to be sure.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Thank you very much for the comments.

ChuckTin, what is a bridge? And thank you for the tip with a brad. I have to buy one.
Any good recommendation for that brad?

Bud9051
, for an amateur and occasional use, I think the infrared camera price is still out of my range, I hope the technology develops and becomes cheaper in the future.

ront02769
, there are illustrations on the internet, and I saw it before. But it is difficult to know which one is used in my house. As Newltw said, there are variations.

Nealtw,
as always, I am studying your comments and still learning esp the and middle and latter part of your comments. I will have some more questions later after learning more. But for now, may I ask some questions?

1. Is the king stud the same as the jamb stud? Likewise, is the trimmer the same as jack stud?

2. If my garage stud is 2x4, is the house stud expected to be the same 2x4? My garage is detached, and almost 2 sides wall have no drywall so that I can see the studs in there.

3. I see the corner studs in the garage. Can I expect the same corner inside the house or could it be not the same?

4. How about the question on the horizontal studs between the 16" OC studs? Always one, or sometimes none, or more than one?

5. How about window sill? Is that always one horizontal stud or 2 studs?

I put illustrations for reference.


wall_frame.jpg

window_frame.jpg

Thank you very much.
 

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To locate studs my go to is the wife's pin cushion. Allow the pin to protrude about the distance from pliers jaws the drywall thickness for starters then extend some. Often no hole repairs necessary and if any a Q-tip and paint will do it. That's how I dead center studs if necessary.
 

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As for cost of a simple IR camera last I looked was in the $300 range, but they can be rented for less. The win/win is you will also use it to improve the energy performance of your house and the savings will pay for the camera. Then you sell the camera and you are ahead in the end.

When testing with a few holes, never move less than 1" from previous spot. I've see some rests that look like a sewing machine was used with holes every quarter inch.

In general the placement of studs, front and back, will start at one end of the house and go to the other centered on 16" (or 24") except for the first and last. Being consistent helps the studs line up with rafters (sort of) and floor joists (again sort of) and makes sheathing and drywall fit better. Once that pattern is established then corners, doors, and windows get extra studs as needed.

Bud
 
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Re some of your pics, thr standard framing around a window a single stud goes all the way top to bottom and that is the king or likely several other names. Then there is one attached to that which is the jack or trimmer....which supports the header....which spreads load AROUND the opening being framed. In general, MOST of your duplex outlets in the walls are attached to a stud on one side....and you can just pull the plate to figure out which side. From there, theoretically, You will be 16 or 24 inches on center in both directions. And if the same crew framed house and garage safe bet that spacing is the same. Ive been doing framing, additions, renovations on a part time basis for 40+ years and found the need for thermal imaging....but if you’ve got bucks it would work....but way overkill.
 

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Thank you very much for the comments.

Nealtw,
as always, I am studying your comments and still learning esp the and middle and latter part of your comments. I will have some more questions later after learning more. But for now, may I ask some questions?

1. Is the king stud the same as the jamb stud? Likewise, is the trimmer the same as jack stud?

2. If my garage stud is 2x4, is the house stud expected to be the same 2x4? My garage is detached, and almost 2 sides wall have no drywall so that I can see the studs in there.

3. I see the corner studs in the garage. Can I expect the same corner inside the house or could it be not the same?

4. How about the question on the horizontal studs between the 16" OC studs? Always one, or sometimes none, or more than one?

5. How about window sill? Is that always one horizontal stud or 2 studs?

I put illustrations for reference.




Thank you very much.
1. Is the king stud the same as the jamb stud? Likewise, is the trimmer the same as jack stud?
Jam stud?? I don't know that one. Trimmer or jack, yes.



3. I see the corner studs in the garage. Can I expect the same corner inside the house or could it be not the same?
Maybe.

2. If my garage stud is 2x4, is the house stud expected to be the same 2x4? My garage is detached, and almost 2 sides wall have no drywall so that I can see the studs in there.

Maybe. :biggrin2:


4. How about the question on the horizontal blocks between the 16" OC studs? Always one, or sometimes none, or more than one?
Not usually. Maybe 24" about. and we don't do the blocks we put an upright 2x6 in the wall behind the intersecting wall



5. How about window sill? Is that always one horizontal stud or 2 studs?
Anything horizontal is a sill, plate or block, never a stud.

You might find 1 or 2 under a window .
you might find one between the header and the window or door.
In a higher wall, the header maybe at the top of the wall or just above the window. or anywhere between with or without sills above and below them.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Thank you very much for the comments.

SeniorSitizen, I like the idea of using the pin, and I will give it a try.

Bud9051, I will look further to see what the IR camera can do for me. How do you find which one end of the house is used as staring point of placing the studs? Is there any rule like north-west end or south-east end, etc?

ront02769, I thank you for the comment, but I do not understand
"MOST of your duplex outlets in the walls are attached to a stud on one side....and you can just pull the plate to figure out which side."
Could you elaborate on this?

Nealtw, I thank you very much for answering all my questions and correcting the terminology. I see the horizontal blocks between all the 16" OC studs in the garage. Is there any easier way to find out if there are horizontal blocks between the 16" OC inside the house without using the stud finder?

I have a door and a window close by with about 6 or 7" apart(photo below). Would you be able to guess how the studs are inside in this case? Are all 4 studs(king and jack for the door and the same for the window, if I am right) together without any gap or is there any gap between the 2 pair? This is area where the termite damage is.

20200220_093059.jpg


Thank you very much.
 

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If you have a standard 8' ceiling it is not likely you have blocks between the studs. 24" spacing with ½" drywall may add then at the 4' seal to provide extra support for that seam.

No rule that I know of for which end of the house they started at and due to variations in framing the first and last stud can be anywhere between zero and 16" spacing. But, once you find a few the pattern will become obvious and unless they were idiots you can rely on it repeating room to room for the full length.

Bud
 

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Thank you very much for the comments.

SeniorSitizen, I like the idea of using the pin, and I will give it a try.

Bud9051, I will look further to see what the IR camera can do for me. How do you find which one end of the house is used as staring point of placing the studs? Is there any rule like north-west end or south-east end, etc?

ront02769, I thank you for the comment, but I do not understand Could you elaborate on this?

Nealtw, I thank you very much for answering all my questions and correcting the terminology. I see the horizontal blocks between all the 16" OC studs in the garage. Is there any easier way to find out if there are horizontal blocks between the 16" OC inside the house without using the stud finder?

I have a door and a window close by with about 6 or 7" apart(photo below). Would you be able to guess how the studs are inside in this case? Are all 4 studs(king and jack for the door and the same for the window, if I am right) together without any gap or is there any gap between the 2 pair? This is area where the termite damage is.

View attachment 586543


Thank you very much.
:vs_laugh:It will be one of these.
 

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Go to your wall. Find one of the electrical outlets that are around 14” off of the floor and not against or under a window. That outlet is 90% Guaranteed to be attached to a stud, could be right side, could be left side, but highly likely to be against one. So that would be your start point.

As to the cross pieces shown in the pix, they are a relatively modern version of a place to attach an interior wall...as opposed to the old partition pocket which used more wood and was impossible to insulate behind.

As to other horizontal blocking in the wall, it partially depends on your wind/seismic zone. Where I am currently building we are required to add horizontal two bye blocking between studs at the location where plywood panels sit on each other for four feet in from each corner, said blocking to be placed flat against the inside of the exterior plywood which then gets nailed to it.

As to other horizontal blocking you might encounter, yuo will likely find some installed flush with the inside of the wall studs for attachments for grab bars, hand rails, cabinets, etc.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Thank you very much for the comments.

Bud9051, thank you for the additional comment. My house has 8' ceiling, but my garage has the horizontal blocks and I live in the earthquake zone. Thank is why I asked the question.

Nealtw, thank you for the diagram. Since the door is over 6' and the window is about 3.5', I think the left 2 diagram would be used.

ront02769, pardon my poor non-native English. First time I read that sentence, I thought of duplex house. Thank you for the additional comments.

---------------

Since I have been asking about the stud, may I ask one more question regarding the stud?

I have a bathroom towel bar as shown below. The left nails are into the wood stud so that they are firm. However, the right 2 nails, which are 16" from the left, were not firm, and the bar was wiggling at the right side. So, I unscrewed the right screw and put a longer, I think 1.5" screw into it, thinking that the wood was worn out or something. But after several weeks, the right nails are not firm, wiggling again, and I unscrewed to see if there is a termite damage there. But to my surprise, I think there is white drywall debris on the nails threads. There are nails on the drywall above and below the right side as photo's nail stud finder shows.

20200216_193018.jpg

20200216_141534.jpg

20200216_141526.jpg

Is it possible to have the stud not continuous from top to bottom? What could be happening here?

Thank you very much.
 

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Can you see what is on the other side of that wall?
The descriptions you have been getting here are standard ways of doing things, but not a guarantee those methods were followed. As for your question, yes it is normal for a stud to be continuous top to bottom. Now we need to find out why it doesn't seem to be so.

It could be a small variation where the left screws are just barely catching that stud and then the right is just missing. Use your stud locator to identify the 1.5" width of each stud and then evaluate the problem.

Bud
 
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This is one reason I prefer to locate center of the studs within 1/4", otherwise although remote, there is a chance a screw could penetrate a wire.
 

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That's the thing, all the info on standard framing given here is correct. But as most of us know, anything is possible. We've all seen some crazy ****. Use a different anchor thing at the right. This will be an easy one.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Thank you udraft, Nealtw, SeniorCitizen, Bud9051 very much for the comments.

Bud9051
, my house is townhouse, and the other side is the neighbor. As the previous photos show, I think the towel bar nail is on the same line as the drywall nails above and below. As Nealtw shows, I suspect there is some cutout in the stud.

Nealtw, I never imagined that. Maybe, in the bathroom, I have to very careful about what might be behind the drywall. After I saw your photo, I tried my new stud finder with metal and wire detector, but somehow near that towel bar right side, the stud finder does not seem to find anything. However, the areas above the towel bar and the electricity fuse control box on the 1st floor right side, the stud finder finds both metal and electricity. I do not know how accurate the finder is.

I found out that the 2nd and 1st floor bathrooms are both 5 ft wide and 2nd floor one is right above the 1st floor bathroom. I took photos of both stacked together and put some schematic diagram there.

Can I ask some questions?
1. The left side of the photo is the outside and sewer direction. So, can the sewer line(the yellow line) take a roundabout way because the bathtub and toilet drain are on the left side. If it is drain line, I might have created a nick or hole on the sewer line.

2. Could the cutout be the electricity conduit(the red line)? If so, don't they cover the cutout with the nail guard or make a hole in the stud and run the conduit thru the hole?


3. Since the stud finder did not seem to find anything near the towel bar right nail area, could the cutout be a mistake and left it as is?


together2.jpg


Thank you very much.
 
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