[cyrax037]

Hey, I’m new here. I have an issue Im trying to resolve. I had a double gang outlet that one side wasn't working so opened it up and It was kinda a bit of an odd mess. This is an ungrounded circuit cuz the building is old. This So I replaced the first outlet with a gfci. (This outlet is ran from a conduit down from the ceiling so its the only outlet on this cable) so I put in the gfci, white to silver and black to gold, on the line side. My next outlet I ran a section of black wire from the gold load side of the gfci to the gold on the regular, and same with the neutral, silver to silver with white. So as for as I know this is the correct setup? Both work, but when I plug my outlet tester in, all 3 lights light up? Did I wire something incorrectly? Or is it possible that the wires are reversed at the breaker? This is an older commercial building and there are some other electrical issues so anything is possible. I just bought the outlet tester and it works fine on other outlets. Its just this one that is showing all 3 lights, and doing so on both the gfci, and the regular one that is fed off it.

 

[cyrax037]

I tested with a multimeter, and when I only got a reading from the outlet is I reversed the leads, red into the large slot and black into the smaller, so I took it all out again (shut power off first of course) and tested the open wires directly, but got around 122 on the meter both ways.

 

[RAL238]

Post a picture or two so we can see exactly what you see.

 

[cyrax037]

Here are the bare wires coming from the breaker

Here are the outlets I had wired up. The two outlets are still tied together as I had them, only thing different is the gfci is no longer connected to the line.

 

[cyrax037]

And the following is the mess that I discovered when I opened it up.

 

[joed]

If I am seeing that correct, in the second picture the black beside the white needs to go over beside the other black. It should be two blacks on the gold screws and two whites on the silver screws.
Also stripping back a bit more outer jacket will make it easier to work with.

 

[cyrax037]

If I am seeing that correct, in the second picture the black beside the white needs to go over beside the other black. It should be two blacks on the gold screws and two whites on the silver screws.
Also stripping back a bit more outer jacket will make it easier to work with.

You mean in the second set of pictures? Yeah, all that mess is gone. You’d may also notice the ground wire connected from green screw to green screw??!?!! Lmao, I may not be an expert but even I know how dumb that is, lol.
I took out all of that. Tbh Im surprised even one of those was working right. And Im surprised it didnt blow up when a power surge killed my router that was plugged into that one.

 

[chetwisner]

If I am seeing that correct, in the second picture the black beside the white needs to go over beside the other black. It should be two blacks on the gold screws and two whites on the silver screws.
Also stripping back a bit more outer jacket will make it easier to work with.

Why isn't he allowed to feed the downstream receptacle from the Load side?

 

[joed]

There is no LOAD side of a normal receptacle. There are two screws each for hot and neutral that can used for connection.

 

[chetwisner]

There is no LOAD side of a normal receptacle. There are two screws each for hot and neutral that can used for connection.

No no, he said he was feeding a regular receptacle from the GFCI he installed.

so I put in the gfci, white to silver and black to gold, on the line side. My next outlet I ran a section of black wire from the gold load side of the gfci to the gold on the regular, and same with the neutral, silver to silver with white

 

[cyrax037]

There is no LOAD side of a normal receptacle. There are two screws each for hot and neutral that can used for connection.

I’m a little confused as to what you may be referring to exactly. There is a LOAD side on the gfci outlet, which I have going downstream to the regular outlet. Black-Brass, White-Silver. You dont see the LINE connection on the outlets cuz they are currently not hooked up (I took it out to test the lines). The gfci outlet has clear labeling on which wire goes where. (White-Black Load, White-Black Line) So I know thats right, assuming of course that the actual line is wired correctly, which Im beginning to doubt. I’m wondering if the black and white are reversed somewhere up the line.

 

[chetwisner]

Hang in there, cyrax037, I'm often wrong But, if I'm understanding correctly, you were feeding a downstream regular receptacle from the LOAD side of a GFCI, which, as far as I know, is correct.

The only thing that may prevent that is Code that says one can't extend an ungrounded circuit, even if it's extended from a GFCI.

Again, though, please wait for Joed and/or the other pros before you change anything.

 

[cyrax037]

Hang in there, cyrax037, I'm often wrong But, if I'm understanding correctly, you were feeding a downstream regular receptacle from the LOAD side of a GFCI, which, as far as I know, is correct.

The only thing that may prevent that is Code that says one can't extend an ungrounded circuit, even if it's extended from a GFCI.

Again, though, please wait for Joed and/or the other pros before you change anything.

Thanks, yes you are correct. Yeah, honestly this building is so far away from code its a bit scary. Small backwoods town, old building, building owner only cares about getting his check on time. You should see the old power strip thats been hard wired into a line coming from the wall. And by hardwired I mean a poorly twisted wires and a bit of electrical tape... ��

Edit: Picture

 

[joed]

here is a LOAD side on the gfci outlet,

True but that does not look like a GFCI to me from the back. I do not see any LINE or LOAD indications.

If that is a GFCI then the problem appears to be that the wires appear to be a crossed. All the whites should be on the same side of the receptacle. The blacks should be on the other side.

I Have labelled the terminals. A + B should both be black wires. C + D should both be white wires.
The black at B should be moved to A to be paired properly with the white at C.
The pushin white at C should be moved to D to pair properly with the black at B.

 

[cyrax037]

True but that does not look like a GFCI to me from the back. I do not see any LINE or LOAD indications.

If that is a GFCI then the problem appears to be that the wires appear to be a crossed. All the whites should be on the same side of the receptacle. The blacks should be on the other side.

I Have labelled the terminals. A + B should both be black wires. C + D should both be white wires.
The black at B should be moved to A to be paired properly with the white at C.
The pushin white at C should be moved to D to pair properly with the black at B.

View attachment 594979

Umm, yeah, ok. Maybe I was unclear. The picture you are talking about was what was ORIGINALLY set up, when I opened it. That is junk that some bozo the clown wired up years and years ago probably before I came along. Yes, that is JUNK. But please kindly ignore that and go back to the FIRST set of pictures. The second set of pictures that I posted is stuff that I have removed entirely. Its gone, Nothing remains of that setup. I bought two completely new terminals, one being a GFCI. Nothing about the SECOND set of pictures should even be discussed beyond being an example of what I had to start out with. My FIRST set of pictures and the original post is what is currently going on.

Sorry for my tone, I’m just highly frustrated with all this.

 

[joed]

The wiring as described in the first post is correct. I can't explain why the lights are as they are.
If you plug in a load, like a lamp, does it work?

 

[surferdude2]

I tested with a multimeter, and when I only got a reading from the outlet is I reversed the leads, red into the large slot and black into the smaller, so I took it all out again (shut power off first of course) and tested the open wires directly, but got around 122 on the meter both ways.

You can't rely on that test since you obviously didn't get a proper probe connection when sticking the receptacle slots. It's impossible to have the condition where reversing the lead polarity will affect an AC voltage reading.

I don't trust your outlet tester device and also suspect your probe reversal test may also be misleading you.

 

[cyrax037]

You can't rely on that test since you obviously didn't get a proper probe connection when sticking the receptacle slots. It's impossible to have the condition where reversing the lead polarity will affect an AC voltage reading.

I don't trust your outlet tester device and also suspect your probe reversal test may also be misleading you.

What would you suggest then? My outlet tester gave accurate readings on other outlets, but why would it light all three lights on these?

I plugged a power strip into it (it was close by) and its switch lit up, but I didn’t actually plug anything else into it. Got nervous about the reading and didnt want to chance it.

 

[cyrax037]

Ok so I hooked everything back up, and tested again. I did get normal readings from the multimeter so you where probably right on not getting the probes in properly.
A lamp does work in both of them.


Here are pictures of the outlet tester.

And this is the tester on a different outlet

 

[Oldmaster]

If I'm reading the information correctly on the tester it looks like there are numerous situations that light 3 lights?? One of them is open ground which you do have. Use a meter to verify what you have is correct and move on. It appears the installation is correct.