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Old 03-09-2011, 04:47 PM   #16
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1. Do I need to put wire mesh on the concrete floor..before I deck mud?
Some say yes others say no. I wouldn't. Never have.

I wouldn't want any sharp wire screwin' around the pan liner in the top cast either for something to go wrong.

The truth is...that concrete is trapped between all the walls. It isn't likely to go anywhere and it isn't likely to crack. Wire doesn't necessarily stop concrete from cracking anyway, it only stops it from separating after it does crack. In all my years I have never had one shower floor crack.

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2. I have seen people level the first layer and then slope the top layer. This doesn't make sense to me. Wouldn't the lack of slope allow water to pool on the membrane?
Exactly correct. This is why a pre-slope is called a pre-slope.

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3. I know the answer, but just to make sure. Do I really need a membrane since it is a concrete floor? I need it for flood protection on the studs...right?
If you build by-the-book you do.

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4. Is two treated 2x4's good for the curb?
NO! NEVER use treated lumber anywhere in the construction of a tile shower. Treated lumber (unless it is KD) comes to you with a very high moisture content. Over time that moisture dries out and the wood shrinks and curls and bends and succumbs to all kinds of forces. Not good for rigid tile shower application.

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Old 03-11-2011, 11:18 AM   #17
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I think I am going to attempt this tomorrow.

Here are my steps....with questions following.

1. Cut 2x6 to put between my studs

2. put down my preslope...longest distance from drain is 5 feet. So my highest point will be 1 1/4".

3. Let this sit 24hrs.

4. put down membrane, and run at 6 inches high on studs. Put some pea gravel around drain. then another layer of deck mud.

5. put up the backerboard and don't screw through my membrane.


QUESTIONS...

1. Will quikrete work for deck mud? IF so how should I mix it (would 5 gallon bucket and drill\paddle work or will it be too thick, also how thick?

2. Should I wire mesh the curb, I am not doing the floor? Also, do people backerboard the curb or just leave it and cover it with the membrane only?

3. Should I felt paper behind the backer board? I am using purple board for the rest of the bathroom.

4. How thick do people make the 2nd layer of deck mud?

5. My hardibacker doesn't have a grid\rough side, will this be ok for wall tiling?



Again thank you for your help everyone. Have a great weekend.
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Old 03-11-2011, 12:30 PM   #18
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A couple of things wrong with your plan--The Durrock goes on after the liner is installed--before you pack the floor---

Do not use quickcreet--you want brick mortar---the pebbles in the cement mix will cause problems while you shave and shape the bed.

Thickness of the mortar bed? about 1 1/2 inches.

Yes you want the wire lath on the curb.

Here is a simple description of deck mud and fat mud(for the curb)"Mud" What Is It? - Kitchen & Bath
Remodeling - DIY Chatroom - DIY Home Improvement Forum

Mix the mud in a wheel barrow or right on the garage floor--You are making the mix so dry that this will not make a mess of the floor. (use a scrap of plywood if your floor is nice)

Pour the powder into a mound--punch a depression into the top (like a volcano) add some water--
scoop dry powder from the outside of the pile and drop it into the center--Repeat and mix until the mix is just damp enough to stick together like a snow ball.

Even dampness--no dry pockets---I cheat and bring a concrete mixer to the job.


Felt is fine behind the rock--not needed if you are waterproofing the face of the board,

You thinset will hold just fine to either side of the Hardibacker---I don't use Hardi myself so we'll see if someone else has a different opinion.------Mike----
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Old 03-11-2011, 12:48 PM   #19
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Not sure what you mean by "before you pack your floor. So I put durrock up before I put the second layer deck mud down?

Do you put the durrock 1/2 inch above the 1st layer of deck mud and then the second layer will go up on the durrock? The second layer of durrock should be 1 1/2"?
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Old 03-11-2011, 01:04 PM   #20
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Durrock will end up behind the top layer of mud.

1. Preslope
2.liner
3.Durrock (almost touching the liner) no screws below the curb height.z9water line)
4.Pack deck mud--about 1 1/2 inches thick.
5. use mesh and 'fat mud to shape curb.

I don't understand what you meant by second layer of Durrock--one layer(1/2") on the studs --

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Old 03-11-2011, 01:15 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oh'mike View Post
Durrock will end up behind the top layer of mud.

1. Preslope
2.liner
3.Durrock (almost touching the liner) no screws below the curb height.z9water line)
4.Pack deck mud--about 1 1/2 inches thick.
5. use mesh and 'fat mud to shape curb.

I don't understand what you meant by second layer of Durrock--one layer(1/2") on the studs --

----Mike----

Typo.. I meant deck mud. Thanks for your help, I think I got it now.
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Old 03-11-2011, 01:37 PM   #22
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Typos I understand---If this site didn't have spell check you would think I was an illiterate hill billy.
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Old 03-11-2011, 04:47 PM   #23
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This site has Spell Check ?????
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Old 03-23-2011, 01:14 PM   #24
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Ok. I haven't gotten around to this yet. I have been busy drywalling and shelf building. I am going to put my 2x6s in between the studs tonight and build my curb. My question is do most people use two 2x4s for the curb? Do you just shoot down the first one and then screw or nail the second one on top of that? Also, do you guys insulate all walls of the shower? The control wall would be difficult because of the plumbing.

Attached is my project.
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Old 03-23-2011, 04:08 PM   #25
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...do most people use two 2x4s for the curb?
Three.

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Do you just shoot down the first one and then screw or nail the second one on top of that?
Basically yes. Be sure to also toe-nail into any thing available on both sides to prevent any tilt or twist.

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...do you guys insulate all walls of the shower?
Helps to keep the water noise down. If you insulate with batting I suggest you should also/first use pipe insulation on the water pipes.

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The control wall would be difficult because of the plumbing.
Nah!
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Old 03-24-2011, 02:22 PM   #26
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I've done a bit of reading and have found that for a concrete floor, bricks are suggested. Wood will expand and contract opening the possibility of cracking.

yes you need a membrane. Have you looked at the schluter website? I am 2/3rds of the way though a kerdi shower.

I believe you can use roofing paper on the floor under the deck mud.

my question to you: where is your drain located?
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Old 03-28-2011, 12:04 PM   #27
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I went out and bought some quickrete sand mix\portland cement. It says to add 3 quarts of water for the mix, but I am afraid this will be too wet. Has anyone made a dry pack using this mixture? Should I just start with 2 quarts and go from there?

Thanks
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Old 03-28-2011, 05:48 PM   #28
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I use sandmix all of the time to make deck mud and it works fine. It isn't quite the industry recommendation but there is nothing wrong with it.

Typically you would start with the water and add the powder mixing as you go but in this case I would reverse that order so that you can get the consistency you want.

You want the mix dry enough so that you can clump it in your hand, no oozing just a packed clump.

You then "place" the mix and pound it into submission. To finish it off you use a straightedge to "shave" the surface making the slope.
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Old 03-31-2011, 08:50 AM   #29
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I have my liner installed and I am ready to install my backer board. How big of gap do you guys leave between the sheets of backer to tape and mud...or do you butt the boards together like drywall? Thanks!
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Old 03-31-2011, 11:34 AM   #30
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If the seams are vertical for sure butt-'em-up, you don't have that much room to gap 'em. Otherwise probably the same thing but a small gap won't matter.
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