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Old 07-31-2015, 02:51 PM   #1
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shower walls porcelain tile over redguard


Hello

I am tiling a new shower and I ran into some trouble with my tile adhesive not drying. Home depot guy sold me hard on the Omnigrip maximum strength premix adhesive. Basically, it went on fine, but it would not dry! Since then I've learned that using adhesive is a bad idea in a shower, even though the product label says it's ok for shower walls. Also it's not to be used over redguard...

After 4 days of it not drying I popped off the tiles and removed all the adhesive.

I have two problems that I need to sort out before starting round two:

1. the tiles are 24x12 porcelain and they are sitting on redguard. That means it's fairly air-tight so the thinset can only dry through the grout spaces. That's why the adhesive did not dry - in fact, redguard label says to not use premixed adhesive. If I use modified thinset like redguard says to, will it ever dry? I'm tempted to use unmodified thinset so that it can dry without air.


2. The redguard peeled off pretty easy in places, especially over the spots that had thinset over them (the seams were taped and set in thinset and the screws were smoothed over with thinset). The thinset I used for this was polymer modifed (Flexbond by Custom Building Products). Seems to me that redguard should stick good to this, but it really did not. It stuck good to the cement board though. I did not prime before redguard - is that where I went wrong? Or should I have wet the walls down first? Could it be that the exposure to tile adhesive somehow damaged the redguard's bond?

I guess if I could start all over again, I'd skip the redguard entirely. The studs are protected with vapor barrier, so redguard seems like overkill - and it's causing me some problems.

Details:
Shower has premade acrylic base - just tiling the walls.
Starting at the studs: stapled the one side of studs with poly vapor barrier. Poly vapor barrier is only over the studs - not the entire wall. Over that is 7/16" cement board. Cementboard joints are taped with fiber tape set in modified thinset (Flexbond by Custom Building Products). Over that I rolled on 3 layers of redguard. The tiles are 24x12 by 3/8" thick porcelain with glazed finish. They are pretty heavy.


Thanks
Greg

Last edited by gregw; 07-31-2015 at 03:04 PM.
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Old 07-31-2015, 03:27 PM   #2
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Never use premixed grout on anything.
I would definitely follow the instructions, Redguard gave you. To be an utter novice and freelance the project is an ill advised course of action.
And yet you persist.
Follow all the instructions, all the time.
Follow all the instructions, all the time.
Follow all the instructions, all the time.
Follow all the instructions, all the time.
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Old 07-31-2015, 03:34 PM   #3
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Hi Ron6519
Do you think that the modified thinset will dry properly if it's sandwiched between redguard and 12x24 porcelain tile?
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Old 07-31-2015, 05:03 PM   #4
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Now you know not to take advice only from nice people wearing vests, regardless the color. You should also read directions carefully and follow.

Redgard should stick good enough to the areas that were coated with thin set. Peeling the membrane by hand is not a test to determine how well it's bonded. Yes, diluting and priming with Redgard will make it stick better, but should not be necessary for this step.

What do you mean by;
Quote:
stapled the one side of studs with poly vapor barrier. Poly vapor barrier is only over the studs - not the entire wall.
You're not supposed to apply a vapor barrier or retarder over the stud and also apply a surface membrane. One or the other, but the surface membrane is much preferred.

Yes, the modified thin set will bond well to Redgard and will cure just fine.

Do not use unmodified over Redgard. You'll get a decent bond but your porcelain tiles will not bond as well. You've probably read some comments about Kerdi and Ditra and which thin set to use. Those recommendations to use unmodified do not apply for Redgard.

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Old 07-31-2015, 05:20 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregw View Post
Hi Ron6519
Do you think that the modified thinset will dry properly if it's sandwiched between redguard and 12x24 porcelain tile?
Are you under some misconception that the directions are there to trip you up?
That Redguard is actually an evil presence on the planet to add misery to the already miserable DIYer?
That some clown on the internet with a keyboard has better advice then the company that makes the product.
I myself have every confidence in the ability of Redguard to safely guide the DIYER through the maze of tiling correctly as long as.........
Wait for it............
Follow all the instructions, all the time.
What you think is not important.
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Old 07-31-2015, 08:05 PM   #6
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when all else fails - read the instructions!
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