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Old 10-19-2017, 01:03 PM   #1
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Shower Pan Detail or Layers of a Shower Pan


What is the correct beginning of installing a mortar type shower pan.

#1. Membrane then mud mortar bed for tile

or

#2. Pre-sloped mud bed, membrane then mud mortar bed for tile

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Old 10-19-2017, 04:24 PM   #2
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Re: Shower Pan Detail or Layers of a Shower Pan


PappyO,

The correct method for a traditional shower pan/tile job is #2....of course.

But, depending on where you are and who you hire, they might just cut some corners and hack it in and go with #1.

There are better methods that completely waterproof the shower. The one I used most is made by Schluter, look for Kerdi. www.schluter.com

Look around, then come back with any Q's.

Jaz
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Old 10-19-2017, 05:30 PM   #3
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Re: Shower Pan Detail or Layers of a Shower Pan


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Originally Posted by JazMan View Post
PappyO,

The correct method for a traditional shower pan/tile job is #2....of course.

But, depending on where you are and who you hire, they might just cut some corners and hack it in and go with #1.

There are better methods that completely waterproof the shower. The one I used most is made by Schluter, look for Kerdi. www.schluter.com

Look around, then come back with any Q's.

Jaz
Thanks I've seen it (Google) both ways..........I really don't have the coin for Schluter, Kerdi as I have looked into it.
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Old 10-19-2017, 06:51 PM   #4
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Re: Shower Pan Detail or Layers of a Shower Pan


How much more do you think it is?

You could do the base as in #1 and also use the Kerdi Drain, then just Kerdi the floor, curb and up the walls a foot or so Then switch to a cheaper waterproofing for the rest of the walls or skip it altogether.

It's a lot cheaper if you do it right the first time. The floor and the first foot or so, is the critical part.

Jaz
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Old 10-20-2017, 02:44 PM   #5
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Re: Shower Pan Detail or Layers of a Shower Pan


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Originally Posted by JazMan View Post
How much more do you think it is?

You could do the base as in #1 and also use the Kerdi Drain, then just Kerdi the floor, curb and up the walls a foot or so Then switch to a cheaper waterproofing for the rest of the walls or skip it altogether.

It's a lot cheaper if you do it right the first time. The floor and the first foot or so, is the critical part.

Jaz
I've talk to a few installers of the Schluter®-KERDI system and they all say wonderful things about the system but it's out of my budget for the shower. I do plan on using the Schluter®-KERDI drain and membrane system with Durock wall board.
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Old 10-20-2017, 03:35 PM   #6
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Re: Shower Pan Detail or Layers of a Shower Pan


You say you don't wanna spend the $$$, then you say you're gonna use the drain and membrane just as I mentioned you could.

So good, the drain and membrane for the floor and up the wall a bit isn't going to cost very much. Probably less than $200. What is the alternative you were gonna use? The Kerdi way isn't very much more, but it'll work.

Jaz

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Old 10-22-2017, 07:09 AM   #7
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Re: Shower Pan Detail or Layers of a Shower Pan


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Originally Posted by JazMan View Post
You say you don't wanna spend the $$$, then you say you're gonna use the drain and membrane just as I mentioned you could.

So good, the drain and membrane for the floor and up the wall a bit isn't going to cost very much. Probably less than $200. What is the alternative you were gonna use? The Kerdi way isn't very much more, but it'll work.

Jaz

Jaz
My walk-in shower is 4' X 6'5". A Schluter Kerdi 48" x 72" Shower Kit With Stainless Steel Drain is $750.00
https://www.amazon.com/Schluter-Kerd...ower+kit&psc=1

I haven't done a materials take off for the Otay type PVC liner and mortar shower bed but a quick Google materials cost is?

5' X 6' Liner kit = $40
Drain = $30
Mud shower bed = $70
Misc materials = $50

Labor = free

Total = $190

Last edited by PappyO; 10-22-2017 at 07:22 AM.
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Old 10-22-2017, 07:34 AM   #8
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Re: Shower Pan Detail or Layers of a Shower Pan


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Originally Posted by PappyO View Post
My walk-in shower is 4' X 6'5". A Schluter Kerdi 48" x 72" Shower Kit With Stainless Steel Drain is $750.00
https://www.amazon.com/Schluter-Kerd...ower+kit&psc=1

I haven't done a materials take off for the Otay type PVC liner and mortar shower bed but a quick Google materials cost is?

5' X 6' Liner kit = $40
Drain = $30
Mud shower bed = $70
Misc materials = $50

Labor = free

Total = $190
Don't buy the kerdi kit. Get a few bags of deck mud ($15) make your sloped pan (1 layer) using the kerdi drain kit ($100) and kerdi membrane. Buy the bigger roll ($160) of membrane and you can use it over drywall on the walls too.

Staple some roof felt or house wrap on the subfloor. Then (with big galvanized staples) staple your lath ($12) on top of felt.


$287. Give or take.
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Old 10-22-2017, 07:45 AM   #9
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Re: Shower Pan Detail or Layers of a Shower Pan


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Originally Posted by BIG Johnson View Post
Don't buy the kerdi kit. Get a few bags of deck mud ($15) make your sloped pan (1 layer) using the kerdi drain kit ($100) and kerdi membrane. Buy the bigger roll ($160) of membrane and you can use it over drywall on the walls too.

Staple some roof felt or house wrap on the subfloor. Then (with big galvanized staples) staple your lath ($12) on top of felt.


$287. Give or take.
Yes that is the plan and the suggestion from the tile distributor who sells the Schluter Kerdi System
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Old 10-22-2017, 07:48 AM   #10
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Re: Shower Pan Detail or Layers of a Shower Pan


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Buy the bigger roll ($160) of membrane and you can use it over drywall on the walls too.
Do you recommend drywall over using a cement type wall board?

Last edited by PappyO; 10-22-2017 at 07:53 AM.
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Old 10-22-2017, 07:53 AM   #11
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Re: Shower Pan Detail or Layers of a Shower Pan


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Do you recommend drywall over a cement type wall board?
If you're going to membrane the whole thing, why bother with cement backer? Kerdi waterproofs it and Schluter recommends kerdi over drywall. Dont mud the drywall. If you need to fill in any tapers because the drywall is already done, use thinset.
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Old 10-22-2017, 07:55 AM   #12
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Re: Shower Pan Detail or Layers of a Shower Pan


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If you're going to membrane the whole thing, why bother with cement backer? Kerdi waterproofs it and Schluter recommends kerdi over drywall. Dont mud the drywall. If you need to fill in any tapers because the drywall is already done, use thinset.
Use thinset with mess tape for the drywall joints?
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Old 10-22-2017, 07:59 AM   #13
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Re: Shower Pan Detail or Layers of a Shower Pan


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Use thinset with mess tape for the drywall joints?
I don't think they even need to be taped. I was just talking about the tapers, if there are any. The kerdi membrane should act as a crack isolation between the drywall joints and tile surface. Jaz is the real tile pro so he might chime in and correct me here.
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Old 10-22-2017, 08:07 AM   #14
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Re: Shower Pan Detail or Layers of a Shower Pan


Quote:
Originally Posted by PappyO View Post
My walk-in shower is 4' X 6'5". A Schluter Kerdi 48" x 72" Shower Kit With Stainless Steel Drain is $750.00
https://www.amazon.com/Schluter-Kerd...ower+kit&psc=1

I haven't done a materials take off for the Otay type PVC liner and mortar shower bed but a quick Google materials cost is?

5' X 6' Liner kit = $40
Drain = $30
Mud shower bed = $70
Misc materials = $50

Labor = free

Total = $190

Remember here that if you go with the old school method that you still have to waterproof the cbu walls. That could be redguard for another $100 or so, plus a lot of time for multiple coats. Or the cheapest way is to do 2 layers of 6 mil plastic or roof felt behind the cbu, about $20. And of course that roll of grey mesh tape for $5.
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Old 10-22-2017, 08:12 AM   #15
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Re: Shower Pan Detail or Layers of a Shower Pan


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Originally Posted by BIG Johnson View Post
Remember here that if you go with the old school method that you still have to waterproof the cbu walls. That could be redguard for another $100 or so, plus a lot of time for multiple coats. Or the cheapest way is to do 2 layers of 6 mil plastic or roof felt behind the cbu, about $20. And of course that roll of grey mesh tape for $5.
I was going to use Schluter Kerdi membrane over the cement board to water proof it
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