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Old 02-11-2015, 09:18 PM   #16
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Typically you will find hvac ductwork running down the center of the home, and I like to have this maybe 8" out from the center wall/beam. Use this 8" space to run your plumbing. Then the whole thing can be bulkheaded.

You should have no problem running your drain lines between the floor joists to get to the center wall, then go underground from there.

I wouldn't worry about any noise from drain lines in the floor.

Somewhere near the center of the basement, you will need a drain for the furnace,A/C, water softener, humidifier, etc. This may be pretty close to where your main stack goes underground.

You'll want to locate your basement bath somewhere where you can hit the line going out nicely and get a vent to it.
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Old 02-11-2015, 09:46 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by CTSNicholas View Post
Thanks for the drawing. Clear as mud indeed But it helps visualize it better. Lol, My iso drawing skillz are kind of rusty....
--The septic system is planned to be lower than the basement walkout level thanks to the sloped lot. If not, then I guess that means capping the buried pipe in concrete and running the main drain in the ceiling afterall.Ceiling is a possibility, but I prefer verical stacks

I'm trying to visualize this all. It seems that all of my fixtures in the main bath will be tricky to tie into the 3" stack. Not really. A tee to pick up thr toilet will be right below the joist and a 3x2 wye below it. The 2" branch can rise vertically to the bottom of the joist, then turn horz. to the tub and laundry

Floor joists run the depth of the house, so that means the main bath drains say on the tub & washing machine will have to either a.) run through the joists or b.) run below them. Since they will be about 8' away from the 3" stack, I guess that's only 2" + pipe diameter = space taken below joists. Correct. As I mentioned above, a 2" line will serve the washer and tub combined.

I will have the main bath drains go towards the main stack, which will run in the wall in the future bathroom, and lead into the concrete.
1.) Should I plan on the main buried line being 4" diameter?3" can serve 3 toilets, 4 or more toilets needs a 4" line. My state requires 4" as I leave the house. So check with your local jurisdiction.
In my opinion, bigger is not always better, but plan for any future drain load for sure

All the drains will have to tie into that 3" stack in the ceiling/floor joist area, aside from the lavatory which I will tie into the 3" stack/vent inside the main bath wall. I will have the vent for the tub + washing machine run in the opposite side wall, and also a future 2" vent pipe running through the same wall near the corner for future basement bath.
I plan on having the tub drain/trap towards the inside of the bathroom (appears you drew it with the drain being against the exterior wall of house). My intent was to show it on the interior, just didn't work out so well....must practice ISO more
The toilet vent is actually 2" with the lav tying into it (wet vent UPC 908.0)

2.) Can I tie the washing machine drain into the tub's drain line right after the tub's trap, or would that suck out the trap's water? From the stack run 2" toward the tub. Run a 2" branch prior to the tub to pick up the laundry. Both fixtures will need vents.
You could opt to run a 2" stack up for those two fixtures...
.
3.) Your drawing with the tub vent would actually be closer to the washer. Can I have a vent tie into the tub drain right after the tub trap, and run it up the wall as the washer vent will....or will the washer vent serve as a wet vent for the tub since they are 2 or 3' apart?You want to keep the washer separate. You run the risk of getting soap suds in your tub - the code term is suds relief.
Wet venting under UPC is allowed only on 1 or 2 drainage fixture unit (DFU) fixtures. And then only in certain arrangements. A residentual clothes washer does not meet the standards.
Google the above code reference


That's a start to clearing the mud for me, I think. Hoping once I perfect one bathroom drain/vent design it answers other questions.
States are updating to 2012 UPC now so it might pay to verify which code cycle you will use
I understand that the 2012 includes some venting updates.
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Old 02-16-2015, 02:14 PM   #18
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I will shoot for vertical stacks.

There will be two toilets, with the possibility of 1 extra. So no more than 3 toilets. The IIRC used is 2006 here, the inspector is older and has not adopted the newer IIRC so I presume the same goes for UPC. It'll definitely not be the latest version out here.

Here is what I am brainstorming
The main bath will:
-Have two vents. One against the lavatory wall, the other against the tub wall.
-Have 3" Main vertical drain inside the 2x6 wall that also goes up into attic for venting ability
-Lavatory will connect into main drain with 2" line connected to main drain with 3x2 wye about 24" above main floor level
-Lavatory will achieve venting from the 3" vertical main serving as the vent, assuming 3x2wye permits proper venting
-Toilet will drop down with a long ell and then feed into the main drain with 3" tee --The vent will be a 'wet vent' from the main vertical drain, yes?
-Tub will have the trap feed into a 2" wye/tee branch that runs a 2" horizontal line with 1/4" pitch that feeds in the 3" main drain with a 3x2 wye
The branch will go towards an interior wall that will have a 2" vent and also will serve as the drain for the washing machine (suggestions? better idea?)
-This will mean 1 line connects to the 3" drain serving the tub & washing machine

That covers all four fixtures. How does the design sound so far?
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Old 02-16-2015, 06:18 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CTSNicholas View Post
I will shoot for vertical stacks.

There will be two toilets, with the possibility of 1 extra. So no more than 3 toilets. The IIRC used is 2006 here, the inspector is older and has not adopted the newer IIRC so I presume the same goes for UPC. It'll definitely not be the latest version out here.

Here is what I am brainstorming
The main bath will:
-Have two vents. One against the lavatory wall, the other against the tub wall.
-Have 3" Main vertical drain inside the 2x6 wall that also goes up into attic for venting ability
-Lavatory will connect into main drain with 2" line connected to main drain with 3x2 wye about 24" above main floor levelNeeds to be a san. tee when connecting to the wet vent. The vent can also be 2" but 3" is fine too
-Lavatory will achieve venting from the 3" vertical main serving as the vent, assuming 3x2wye permits proper ventingSee above comment- must be a tee
-Toilet will drop down with a long ell and then feed into the main drain with 3" tee --The vent will be a 'wet vent' from the main vertical drain, yes?Yes, although a medium 90 is fine
-Tub will have the trap feed into a 2" wye/tee branch that runs a 2" horizontal line with 1/4" pitch that feeds in the 3" main drain with a 3x2 wye
The branch will go towards an interior wall that will have a 2" vent and also will serve as the drain for the washing machine (suggestions? better idea?)
-This will mean 1 line connects to the 3" drain serving the tub & washing machineA 2" line can serve both, the laundry and tub. But you cannot use the tub vent as a wet vent for a washer. each trap arm will need separate vents

That covers all four fixtures. How does the design sound so far?
Tip- horizontal to vertical pipe can make the direction change with a standard 90 or a tee in the case of a stack.

Vertical to horizontal piping must use a long turn 90 or a wye

Horizontal 90* change of direction must use a LT 90 or 2- 45's

When tying a trap arm to a vertical riser, you must use a tee (venting at the top of the tee) to achieve proper trap venting. Not a wye
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Old 02-17-2015, 03:04 PM   #20
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My mistake in saying wye, I was just referring to your previous post about using the 3x2 wye. So I will plan on a san. tee to connect the sink to my main stack, and I will also be using two more.

One for the toilet connection.
And one for the tub/washing machine connection.

It will be okay for the toilet will get vented from the main stack, I assume.

The 2" line going to the tub and washer will split: one portion to serve as the tub drain and the other portion to serve as the washer drain. To make this split/y/branch would you suggest a wye, or a combination wye with 1/8 bend since it is going to be horizontal?

I am thinking the vent for the tub will be too far away if I tried to use one vent for washer and tub. The washer vent will be a simple vent line that moves up the wall right after the trap drain. However, I can not just go 'straight up' from the tub trap because that would be impossible. :P Is there a simple way to vent both of these drains assuming they are at least 3' apart?

I don't think it's much more hassle to have a separate vent inside the tub wall if needed.
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Old 02-17-2015, 09:12 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CTSNicholas View Post
My mistake in saying wye, I was just referring to your previous post about using the 3x2 wye. So I will plan on a san. tee to connect the sink to my main stack, and I will also be using two more.

One for the toilet connection.
And one for the tub/washing machine connection.

It will be okay for the toilet will get vented from the main stack, I assume.

The 2" line going to the tub and washer will split: one portion to serve as the tub drain and the other portion to serve as the washer drain. To make this split/y/branch would you suggest a wye, or a combination wye with 1/8 bend since it is going to be horizontal?

I am thinking the vent for the tub will be too far away if I tried to use one vent for washer and tub. The washer vent will be a simple vent line that moves up the wall right after the trap drain. However, I can not just go 'straight up' from the tub trap because that would be impossible. :P Is there a simple way to vent both of these drains assuming they are at least 3' apart?

I don't think it's much more hassle to have a separate vent inside the tub wall if needed.
The top of the 3" tee is the start of the wet vent section. Below the toilet branch (tee) is the drain stack

You can use a wye or combo on the 2" branch. Whichever works for your layout.

To vent the tub, I like to turn up a 90 from the horz. drain, stack a tee on the 90- point it towards the trap. Vent of the top of the tee.
Same for the washer except the tee and trap needs to be a minimum 6"above the floor
These 2 vents can tie together in the attic or wall and run over to the toilet vent to make 1 roof penetration
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Old 02-18-2015, 01:05 PM   #22
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The top of the 3" tee is the start of the wet vent section. Below the toilet branch (tee) is the drain stack

You can use a wye or combo on the 2" branch. Whichever works for your layout.

To vent the tub, I like to turn up a 90 from the horz. drain, stack a tee on the 90- point it towards the trap. Vent of the top of the tee.
Same for the washer except the tee and trap needs to be a minimum 6"above the floor
These 2 vents can tie together in the attic or wall and run over to the toilet vent to make 1 roof penetration
So you would stack a san. tee ontop a 90, and have the tub trap drain into the sideway part of the tee while the top of the tee goes upward to serve as the vent?

I figured with the washer I would have the option of just running a T pointing up after the trap on the horizontal line going through the wall, and running a vent from the tee going up to the attic.
----

Now, this is all feeding into the 3" drain stack through the future basement bathroom wall. Down, down, and into the floor. I am thinking a medium or long el will protrude from the concrete floor, which the 3" drain stack will tie into. After that el, the 3" line will be at 1/8" or 1/4" slope through the gravel and dirt base and out through the basement footing ready to head towards the septic system.

One exception will be that this line also has to collect the waste from 1.) kitchen 2.) master bath 3.) future basement bath. I am considering running 4" through the ground since I will have those other 3 systems draining into this line. With only 3 toilets total, do you think 3" is just fine until leaving the footing? It would make the other lines tie in easier (working with the smaller pipe)
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Old 02-18-2015, 10:22 PM   #23
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Quote:
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So you would stack a san. tee ontop a 90, and have the tub trap drain into the sideway part of the tee while the top of the tee goes upward to serve as the vent?yes. Or a combo on the horizontal line. The combo is pointed up to serve as a vent through the floor The trap and trap arm comes off the end of the combo.
Either method are correct, it just depends on the room available.


I figured with the washer I would have the option of just running a T pointing up after the trap on the horizontal line going through the wall, and running a vent from the tee going up to the attic.ok
----

Now, this is all feeding into the 3" drain stack through the future basement bathroom wall. Down, down, and into the floor. I am thinking a medium or long el will protrude from the concrete floor, which the 3" drain stack will tie into. After that el, the 3" line will be at 1/8" or 1/4" slope through the gravel and dirt base and out through the basement footing ready to head towards the septic system. Use a long turn 90, stack a clean out tee on top of it- code requires clean outs at the base of stacks.
3" must be graded at 1/4" per ft per UPC


One exception will be that this line also has to collect the waste from 1.) kitchen 2.) master bath 3.) future basement bath. I am considering running 4" through the ground since I will have those other 3 systems draining into this line. With only 3 toilets total, do you think 3" is just fine until leaving the footing? It would make the other lines tie in easier (working with the smaller pipe)
3 toilets on 3" is code but I'd pick up the kitchen and master on 4". Now you can add a 4th toilet if you ever want to.
Don't ask me why but my state asks for 4" under the footing regardless of what it seves. I also cannot put anything smaller than 2" under the slab.
These rules are specific to my state- it pays to have a conference with your inspector prior to starting so you don't get any surprises.
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Old 02-19-2015, 08:14 AM   #24
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Hey E, are you saying to adapt from 3" to 4" down the line, or run 4" from the long 90 all the way outside the footing? I would think the latter, and I will plan for that. I figure a 3" to 4" conversion underground is a no-no just from a logical point of things getting snagged

Thanks
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Old 02-19-2015, 08:32 AM   #25
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Under the footing is 4" At the first stack (master bth and kitchen) install a 4x3x3 wye.
The 3" branch will serve the stack (which could also have 3 toilets on it). Continue with 3" from the wye to the other bathroom stack.
Both stacks will need clean outs at their base
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Old 02-19-2015, 09:00 AM   #26
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So running 3" line from the main bath stack, down to long 90, then continue 3" until I get to the point of the mstr bath and kitchen in which I use a 4x3x3 wye, which will mean 3" converts to 4" right at that point underground.
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Old 02-19-2015, 09:35 AM   #27
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So running 3" line from the main bath stack, down to long 90, then continue 3" until I get to the point of the mstr bath and kitchen in which I use a 4x3x3 wye, which will mean 3" converts to 4" right at that point underground.
Correct
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