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Old 11-07-2016, 10:41 PM   #1
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Gas pipe set up wtih restriction and no shutoff valve


So I'm working on a new kitchen at a different location... My permits are pulled and I'm ready for rough inspection, but most of the plumbing and the gas piping on the mechanical permit are not part of that - it's all basement work that comes through the floor and won't be covered up, therefore it gets inspected on final.

Still, I'm looking ahead. I'm seeing a problem with my existing pipe. First off, my first step would ordinarily be to shut off the gas, but I have no master shutoff valve. I can shut off the gas at each of the 3 appliances (water heater, furnace, stove) but not where it comes in unless I go out and use the utility company's shutoff before the meter.

The gas comes in through 1" CSST, then through a reducing street elbow down to 3/4" which connects to a 3/4" tee, then it goes through a reducing Tee with two sides at 3/4" and one side as 1". The 3/4" side is reduced to 1/2" for the water heater, the 1" side goes to the furnace.

See the labeled photo for an illustration of what the current setup is.



Should I reconfigure the piping so the 1" pipe to the furnace connects before the restriction down to 1"? Should I add in a shutoff on the house side?

I currently have an estimate we are considering that says the current furnace is a 117,000 btu 70% efficient unit which is proposed to be replaced with a 95% efficient 60,000 BTU unit.
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Gas pipe set up wtih restriction and no shutoff valve-gas-pipe-pipe-entrance-basement.jpg  
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Old 11-08-2016, 06:09 AM   #2
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Re: Gas pipe set up wtih restriction and no shutoff valve


If the furnace never actually needed the 1" then technically it's fine. Off the wall weird, yes, but fine. Do you have any sizing charts?

From a non-code stand point, The restriction of those few inches is nothing compared to the flex tube.

Since you're in the US., Street Els are allowed in most areas I think. They aren't here. (ontario) instant red taggable. It also appears that it is galvanized.

Without threading out one of those lines, or just cutting it and adding a union, you're not going to be able to get any of those tees out. Is this new furnace showing up before the final inspection? Unless you're sure that the new furnace will require the 1", (and you'd have to have a foot ball field worth of pipe at 60k) I wouldn't bother

PS.
1,400 ft actually at 7-14"WC at 1" drop for 1" pipe, sch40, 62kbtu.
450 ft at 7-14"WC at 1" drop for 3/4" pipe, sch40, 61kbtu.


Cheers!

Last edited by supers05; 11-08-2016 at 06:19 AM.
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Old 11-08-2016, 07:36 AM   #3
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Re: Gas pipe set up wtih restriction and no shutoff valve


Well rough on my kitchen project is today, I expected to get to final by the end of the month but I'm about a week or 2 behind. We won't even be turning on the furnace contractor until after we get through Christmas unless the current furnace fails.

I do recognize I will need to cut something to get into the tees, and the pipe to the existing range comes out anyway once I can put the new kitchen into service. Other than that, I do also have the union on the incoming csst. I need to tie in for the new gas range location so I intend on making it right regardless.
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Old 11-08-2016, 08:11 PM   #4
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Re: Gas pipe set up wtih restriction and no shutoff valve


Quote:
Originally Posted by WillK View Post
Well rough on my kitchen project is today, I expected to get to final by the end of the month but I'm about a week or 2 behind. We won't even be turning on the furnace contractor until after we get through Christmas unless the current furnace fails.

I do recognize I will need to cut something to get into the tees, and the pipe to the existing range comes out anyway once I can put the new kitchen into service. Other than that, I do also have the union on the incoming csst. I need to tie in for the new gas range location so I intend on making it right regardless.
I've seen crud like that before. Technically it was fine, because the appliance only needed 3/4 to begin with. It's like they ran out of pipe so they used 1". People are also lazy, and you get that. The 60k will be good regardless.

Double check that the csst is code where you are. I know it still is in many places, but in your picture, I'd have to replace it with a coated version with a stamp on it.

(technically here it's called "flexible pipe", and csst connectors are only for end appliances. Code definitions... Blah blah.. Lol)

Cheers!
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Old 11-09-2016, 08:21 AM   #5
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Re: Gas pipe set up wtih restriction and no shutoff valve


I passed my rough inspections, although mechanical wasn't among them because I don't really have anything going into walls except an exhaust hood going straight out which I can't really place until cabinets are up anyway.

This is an older house, and it's most likely gone through changes to the heating system fuel over its life. It was built in 1928. And there has clearly been a lot of unpermitted work. The service entrance is 2' from the master bedroom window, and I had intended to move it and upgrade to 200 Amps on a later permit when I build a new garage - the electrical inspector required me to move that plan up and do that on my final inspection for my current project.

I'm sure the house is very loose construction and probably at one time had a heater that had even greater demand, this is probably the result of a meter upgrade. I've had another house in the same municipality, as has my wife, and I'm pretty sure the flexible pipe is common in the area.

I mean... it comes in at 1", I don't see any reason why it makes sense to go down to 3/4 before the furnace is fed.
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Old 11-09-2016, 06:38 PM   #6
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Re: Gas pipe set up wtih restriction and no shutoff valve


Anyone note there's no drop leg, galvinized fittings?
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Old 11-09-2016, 06:49 PM   #7
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Re: Gas pipe set up wtih restriction and no shutoff valve


Quote:
Originally Posted by joecaption View Post
Anyone note there's no drop leg, galvinized fittings?
That's an inlet. Drit pocket is only required if "condensation may occur" outside of regular appliance reasons. Like larger outdoor risers. The csst that you see is a supply not an appliance.

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