Sequel To "Water Floor Seeping--Who At Fault? Contractor, Insurance, Or Me? - Flooring - DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum
Advertisement


Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > Flooring

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Like Tree3Likes
  • 1 Post By Nealtw
  • 2 Post By chandler48
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes
Old 08-04-2019, 02:51 PM   #1
TakeCareMyHouse
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: USA, Texas
Posts: 61
Rewards Points: 122
Default

Sequel to "Water Floor Seeping--Who at Fault? Contractor, Insurance, or Me?


Good day,

This post is to the earlier post I made (last comment on July 8, 2019 about a month ago) but I had some new questions. I have been working on this issue, but it has taken 3 weeks for answers and I don't know if three weeks is too long is to reply to an original post.

A few consensus in that post, the proactive steps: replace the sliding glass door, put in the proper pan and caulking, take the deck down an inch (the deck needs to be replaced anyway).

I agree with a post in the earlier post that laminate is not a good choice. What would be correct kind of flooring that should go behind a sliding glass door that leads to the outside in a climate that has heavy rains in the summer? I do go in and out of the back door very often.

By the way, the reason there is laminate is that it came with the house. So when the laminate had to be replaced, I thought it best to replace the old with the new. Yes, I would do things differently now.

From what Iíve told about laminate, is you canít replace just one section (like a living room near a sliding door), but the whole floor. How would I put in tile or some kind of flooring more robust mixed in with already installed laminate? Could I just take out a section of laminate but still leave the rest of the laminate in the house intact? I attached two images, one image of where I would replace the floor and is the view by the sliding door, the other image is of the kitchen as shows that I don't want to replace the laminate in the kitchen.

Also, what is the right deductible for a house? Mine was at $2,000. Is this right or wrong? That was an unexpected question that came in the post that got me asking as well.

The contractor who did that job was a general purpose contractor, flooring just one task they do. Also, in that post, most of the floor of the house is laminate, not just the sliding door. So they replaced a lot more floor than the living room. They also did some sheetrock and painting. I did expect--obviously naively--that if the contractor came in and replaced the floor, they would also fix whatever they would know what the real problem is, from thier experience--like the sliding door-- and just get add the work to the claim. Seems like a common-sense thing to me. I never followed up on the "true problem" because I thought it all was taken care of after the first floor replacement and the slow leak that arises did not show until months later. For professionals who work on this every day, I am sure the sliding door issues are obvious, but for me who just filed their first claim last year and does nothing remote about construction, there was no reason to worry.

As you can all see, I am learning all about insurance and contractors now.

I also won't take weeks to reply this time.
Attached Thumbnails
Sequel to "Water Floor Seeping--Who at Fault? Contractor, Insurance, or Me?-slidingdoorfloorneedsreplacing.jpg   Sequel to "Water Floor Seeping--Who at Fault? Contractor, Insurance, or Me?-kitchenview.jpg  
atticwalker is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 08-04-2019, 03:22 PM   #2
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Kremmling, CO about 7500'
Posts: 917
Rewards Points: 1,828
Default

Re: Sequel to "Water Floor Seeping--Who at Fault? Contractor, Insurance, or Me?


Is it a floating floor? How are the pieces connected to each other? (Glued, click/lock?)

Yes, it is possible to remove a portion of the floor and put down tile. And that is typically the way that I do it in my homes and flips. Living where there are actually seasons, people are always in something. Even dogs. In my current renovation where I am putting down engineered hardwood, I put a 3' x 6' section of wood grain tile that compliments the wood floor. Part of the tile is where the dogs food and water goes, the other is the back door and rug.

The front door entry is a step down from the hardwood so I am putting in waterproof laminate in there.

For your situation, you can go a bunch of different ways. I might go herringbone pattern with a plank look tile. But of course, the decision is up to you.
__________________
The only stupid question is the one you DON'T ask!
Forgive me if I Mansplain things, I don't know what you know and I like to be thorough.
And most of all, have fun. It pisses some people off and makes others laugh.
ktownskier is online now   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 08-04-2019, 03:35 PM   #3
retired framer
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Fraser Valley BC Canada
Posts: 26,225
Rewards Points: 20,340
Default

Re: Sequel to "Water Floor Seeping--Who at Fault? Contractor, Insurance, or Me?


Can you still buy the same product, that would require removing some good as well the bad to work in the new. I like something different at the door like a strip of tile or carpet 2 ft by the width of the door.
Dave Sal likes this.
__________________
Do not use flat bottom gables with scissor trusses.
Nealtw is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 08-04-2019, 05:26 PM   #4
Naildriver
 
chandler48's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Young Harris, Georgia
Posts: 6,941
Rewards Points: 4,244
Default

Re: Sequel to "Water Floor Seeping--Who at Fault? Contractor, Insurance, or Me?


For those who weren't privy to the original encounter, here it is: https://www.diychatroom.com/f5/water...nce-me-662139/

You have too much laminate damage to make a tile entry way. They are usually about 3' deep and the width of the door. Don't blame the flooring for the problem. The problem arose from water coming INTO the house from an either ill fitting or flashed door and low exterior versus interior grades.
Dave Sal and Nealtw like this.
__________________
Larry......
Half of Communications is Listening, and You can't Listen with your Mouth.
chandler48 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-04-2019, 06:06 PM   #5
TakeCareMyHouse
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: USA, Texas
Posts: 61
Rewards Points: 122
Default

Re: Sequel to "Water Floor Seeping--Who at Fault? Contractor, Insurance, or Me?


I donít know how the boards are connected. I will ask.

Engineered Hardwood. Wood Grain Tile. Herringbone pattern with a plank look tile. Okay, these are good things to read up on. Its more the type of floor I need to learn about. I know I will pick the design and color, but I want to be in right "flooring section" when I do.

The original contractor did come out, believed the sliding door was to blame, and was going to check if the same laminate was available. I think they are hoping I give them the job to repair the floor. They did make a comment that if the laminate is not available, the whole floor will have to be replaced. Doesnít sound right. The original contractor hasnít got back to me and I prefer to try someone else anyway, based on my experience with them and comments in the original post. I do feel like the laminate should be available since it was only a year ago they did the work.

When you say the there is too much laminate, about 3í do you mean horizontal, as in, from the sliding door towards the kitchen? Or left right 3í along the length of the sliding door? I would put in as much tile as it takes to get rid of the bad laminate. I need clarification on what this statement means.

I know what you mean about not blaming the flooring. I understand the water came in through a sliding door that needs to be fixed and the deck being lower. However, the laminate has other issues in that, since the kind I have is not waterproof, I canít mop it and have to be very careful not to spill anything on it. Such is a bigger problem than anticipated. Long-range goal, I will take out the laminate in sections until it is just left in the living areas. Since I am not getting any money from the insurance, I might as well do what I want.

Also what about the deductible question? Any comments there?
atticwalker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-04-2019, 06:17 PM   #6
Naildriver
 
chandler48's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Young Harris, Georgia
Posts: 6,941
Rewards Points: 4,244
Default

Re: Sequel to "Water Floor Seeping--Who at Fault? Contractor, Insurance, or Me?


As I stated make the landing 3' deep and the width of the door. 3' deep into the room and 6' wide across the opening. Making it in increments of 12" will keep the tiles whole without cuts.
__________________
Larry......
Half of Communications is Listening, and You can't Listen with your Mouth.
chandler48 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2019, 08:08 AM   #7
TakeCareMyHouse
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: USA, Texas
Posts: 61
Rewards Points: 122
Default

Re: Sequel to "Water Floor Seeping--Who at Fault? Contractor, Insurance, or Me?


I think I see what you mean about the tiles. I would use whole tiles. It would actually be a lot of that living room that I would replace with tiles.
atticwalker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2019, 04:06 PM   #8
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 5,057
Rewards Points: 2,598
Default

Re: Sequel to "Water Floor Seeping--Who at Fault? Contractor, Insurance, or Me?


The slide door looks like it could be the main problem, but now wondering some other things. Could also be how the siding was installed. How the deck is flashed. Is this a concrete floor? Concrete floor can hold enough moisture. Wood floor over a crawl space? I guess the engineered floor was damaged, but these floorings don't stay absolutely flat, all the time. Some, even when on a wood floor, and second floor, will warp somewhat.


I think it would be better for you if you don't use wood based flooring and wait until you at least fix the deck and the slide door. At the time, check your siding and ground outside for how water flows around your house as well as how it dries out. Maybe even remove a section of the floor and take long term moisture level.
Vinyls are much more stable in high moisture situations and some vinyls are made with all vinyl so it is water proof. Cheaper vinyl planks have backing layer that uses wood pulp, from what I've read. There are engineered floorings that are much more water resistant. Check engineered flooring websites, bruce for example. If not sure about the brands, search "large manufacturers" "popular brands", etc, get some names and search their sites.


From your photo, it looks like partial replacement would not look good or even cost effective. At least all of the kitchen and the damaged area.


Sorry, about the fault. It is manufacturer's fault for misleading you, contractor's fault for not informing you, your fault for not being informed. Insurance, like a fox, sits on the outside and laughs to the bank.

Last edited by carpdad; 08-05-2019 at 04:10 PM.
carpdad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-07-2019, 10:04 AM   #9
TakeCareMyHouse
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: USA, Texas
Posts: 61
Rewards Points: 122
Default

Re: Sequel to "Water Floor Seeping--Who at Fault? Contractor, Insurance, or Me?


A few answers to the questions above. In general this all seems like good advice.

The floor is concrete. That is correct. There is no crawl space under the floor or any other room. The house is single story and the floor you see in the pictures was installed on the foundation.

My goal is to take out the deck and just put some steps down from the sliding door. Not ideal, but my first priority is to keep water out of the house. If I can save the money in a year or two, I will rebuild a deck, flashed correctly and lower than the sliding door. But the easiest way to deal with the deck is to get rid of it. Its rotten anyway.

The vinyls look like a good idea. In my city, moisture and humidity are real concerns.

I see what you mean about not looking good. Kitchen plus Dining room would be better. Could I still leave laminate in the adjacent living room? My floor right now is all laminate, except where it meets the three bedrooms which have carpet and one bathroom that has tile.

Last question: To reinstall a sliding door correctly and keep moisture/possibly heavy rain in a usually humid environment out of the house, what are the essentials? Also, where I live, temperatures can get into low high teens of cold, but only a few weeks during the winter. This will be my main priority. Is there a canonical list of dos and don'ts that would satisfy a permit and be good quality? If you know of a website on how to reinstall a sliding door correctly, go ahead and put the link here. I would really appreciate it. I don't want to miss anything this time around when I hire someone to reinstall the sliding door.
atticwalker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-07-2019, 10:43 AM   #10
retired framer
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Fraser Valley BC Canada
Posts: 26,225
Rewards Points: 20,340
Default

Re: Sequel to "Water Floor Seeping--Who at Fault? Contractor, Insurance, or Me?


There are all kinds of systems but a pan is the important part and then use flexible flashing to to catch any water anywhere around the door and out the bottom.
If your door has a flange your pan is the width of the rough opening and the depth of the door, somewhere around 3 1/2"

__________________
Do not use flat bottom gables with scissor trusses.
Nealtw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-07-2019, 01:27 PM   #11
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 5,057
Rewards Points: 2,598
Default

Re: Sequel to "Water Floor Seeping--Who at Fault? Contractor, Insurance, or Me?


https://inspectapedia.com/BestPracti...k_Flashing.php


Good images here for complete idea of flashing and, in case of leak, making the water flow away from the house lumber. Deck itself does not count because treated wood can get wet or dry. How the deck to house attachment area (mainly the ledger) gets flashed is 2nd most important. Some people, therefore, prefer free standing deck to attaching a ledger to the house. This is zero tolerance idea. If names and install methods are confusing, ask again. Flashing is about overlaps, one material over the other and water follows gravity in most cases. Suppress the impulse to make it look tight, neat and pretty. Another part of flashing is to make the water drain to open air or to parts that won't rot. Siding is often installed tight to the deck surface, and this is another area where dry out slows. When you re=deck, you may want to check the bottoms of your siding as well.



The decking can be also cut as much as 3/4" or so away from the siding so draining is that much away from the house. Before you start the deck demo, you can remove the decking and check the framing beneath. Maybe the deck has more life than you think. It's good if the deck is lower than the slide door or any other openings, but it is not absolute.
carpdad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-07-2019, 07:38 PM   #12
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 5,057
Rewards Points: 2,598
Default

Re: Sequel to "Water Floor Seeping--Who at Fault? Contractor, Insurance, or Me?


https://www.homedepot.com/p/M-D-Buil...E&gclsrc=aw.ds


https://www.homedepot.com/p/M-D-Buil...3323/204768774




Also wood or synthe version of 2nd option. Make sure they are made for the thickness of your flooring. As such, replacement part shouldn't be too thicker or thinner and if too thin (vinyl example) you may have to use flat metal threshold but these don't look as good. Or add paneling to raise the floor level. Your engineered flooring can be cut with a circular saw against a straight edge, even double taped to the floor. Set the saw blade depth as not to cut more than the flooring.


Blue tape about 3" of the floor when cutting. In case you happen to end up with a thin piece of flooring. If this piece moves, after the cut, you can use wood glue or such to glue it back. It will also be held down by threshold piece you use.

Last edited by carpdad; 08-07-2019 at 07:41 PM.
carpdad is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





Top of Page | View New Posts