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Old 11-19-2014, 07:42 PM   #1
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Cement Board installed. Questions on leveling.


I'm sure a lot of you have seen my previous posts on subflooring before installing 12x24 porcelain tile. I have finally finished installing the hardie backer and just checked my floor flatness before I start tiling. I used a 2 ft grid and laser level to find my high spot/spots and have figured out the flatness of the floor relative to said high spots. Unfortunately the floor is a little less flat than I had hoped. I have included a diagram showing the high spots on my floor (marked with an H) and then the measurement for how much lower the floor is every 2 ft. All the measurements are in inches. All measurements next to the wall are 1 ft from the wall. I have also inclued a diagram showing the overall dimensions of the kitchen.





So my lowest spot on the floor is 1 1/8" inches below my high spots (right at the threshold of course). Now i know that the floor doesn't need to be "level" it just needs to be relatively flat for the large tiles. My question is do I need to use enough slc to get everything even with my high spots and make the floor completely level/flat or is there something else I can do to make the floor suitable for installation of large porcelain tile?

If i do need to get the floor up to the highspot's level do I just need to buy 15 bags of SLC (about $30 a bag) or is there a more cost efficient way? I was thinking maybe using thinset for like 3/4-1 inch then finishing off with slc not sure if that is a valid option.

Also should i be worried about the weight that this much filler will add to my floor since it is over 2x6 joists covered by plank flooring covered by 3/4 inch osb t&g which is then coverred with thinset and 1/4 hardie backer? Just worried about the added weight. I'll include a diagram of my joists as well (Sorry it is flipped. I dont have time to redo anything.)



Lastly, (sorry i know this is a wordy post) if i have to add 1 1/8 inch to the floor then install the tile over that this will add a good 1.5 inches to 2 inches to my floor at the threshold. How do i deal with this to not make it look out of place?

Thank you guys in advance for any input.
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Old 11-19-2014, 08:06 PM   #2
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What is the span of these 2x6 floor joist, I hate to tell you this but I dont think they will support this floor without flexing to much
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Old 11-19-2014, 09:15 PM   #3
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Thanks for your input. I have already looked into the flexing. Just wondering about the issues I brought up on this post.
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Old 11-19-2014, 09:24 PM   #4
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2x6" joists are very unusual for homes. Was this area a deck or porch at one time? Let us know how it's framed. Size, spacing and span of the joists. Not the size of the room. If you know the species and grade include that info.

That floor is way out of plane, yicks. The easiest way to make the floor flat is to continue as you planned with the SLC. Yes you're going to step up into the room. Or......you could use a floor patch instead of SLC and keep the slope. But that will be very tricky to do and get the floor flat.

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Old 11-19-2014, 09:31 PM   #5
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Sorry, the joists are 2x8 not 2x6.
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Old 11-19-2014, 09:36 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whyjune1st View Post
Sorry, the joists are 2x8 not 2x6.
So you're saying the deflection spec is good for ceramic tiles? Care to share the span/species/grade of the joists and/or the "L" rating?

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Old 11-19-2014, 09:38 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whyjune1st View Post
Thanks for your input. I have already looked into the flexing. Just wondering about the issues I brought up on this post.
Ridiculous!
You haven't looked into the flexing very well because if you had you wouldn't be barging ahead with ceramic tile on a structure that won't support the project.
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Old 11-19-2014, 09:47 PM   #8
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ok thanks a lot bud.
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Old 11-20-2014, 09:07 AM   #9
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In terms of not supporting the project does that just mean there is a danger of cracked tile or would I have to worry about the structural integrity of the floor for adding so much weight? I can take a chance on a cracked tile but I don't want to break my house. Thanks.
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Old 11-20-2014, 12:36 PM   #10
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You did put thinset under the Hardie, right? You don't mention that.
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Old 11-20-2014, 12:48 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bud Cline View Post
Ridiculous!
You haven't looked into the flexing very well because if you had you wouldn't be barging ahead with ceramic tile on a structure that won't support the project.
+1 the time to level the floor and check for deflection is before you lay the backer.You just wasted a lot of time and money in my book.
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Old 11-20-2014, 01:14 PM   #12
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1. Yes I installed the Hardie with thinset.
2. I was told on a previous post that it is fine to lay the backer board then use the SLC.
3. Everyone that I talk to in real life says not to worry too much about the deflection. (They could obviously be wrong. If I knew I wouldn't be here)

I'm starting to just think I should scrap the tile and put down pergo. any *constructive* input on this? If I went with pergo laminate I could just lay right on top of the Hardie right?
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Old 11-20-2014, 03:16 PM   #13
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Whyjune1st,

BTW, do you have a name we can use?

Bud posted 6-7 minutes after you corrected yourself by saying the joists are 8" and not 6". I'll bet he started the post before he saw your correction.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whyjune
2. I was told on a previous post that it is fine to lay the backer board then use the SLC.
That's the right way to tweak the floor, yes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whyjune
3. Everyone that I talk to in real life says not to worry too much about the deflection. (They could obviously be wrong. If I knew I wouldn't be here
2x8" @ 11' should be kinda marginal for ceramic if they're in good condition. But you never mentioned the species and grade.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whyjune
I'm starting to just think I should scrap the tile and put down pergo.
I don't get that. That's a pretty extreme change.

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Last edited by JazMan; 11-20-2014 at 03:29 PM.
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Old 11-20-2014, 08:20 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whyjune1st View Post
In terms of not supporting the project does that just mean there is a danger of cracked tile or would I have to worry about the structural integrity of the floor for adding so much weight? I can take a chance on a cracked tile but I don't want to break my house. Thanks.

It's not that you need to worry about falling through the floor after job is done. what I think these guys are trying to say is you don't want too much or any up and down movement for tile or it will cause grout to crack tile to pop ect.

You can cross brace between joists and or add more plywood although you need to state the spacing between joists what ever too minimize movement. SLC will be the 1st to crack if your subfloor is not sound and sturdy.

In the real world it takes engineers too determine true deflection so don't be scared about L rating these guys ask for lol
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Old 11-20-2014, 09:13 PM   #15
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The true dimension of the joists are 7 3/8" x 1 5/8". The house was built in 1940 and I have no clue as to what wood the joists are. There is cross bridging between most of the joists over the long span and they are marked by the red x's on the diagram. Also two of the joists are sistered as marked in the diagram as "double".



I know I'm not much help w/the wood type but the joists seem to be in good condition and I will include photos so you can see what i'm working with. Thanks for all the helpful input I appreciate it and really just want to get this floor in so i can finish my kitchen.









I'm just getting fed up with this floor and was thinking that going Pergo I could just snap it in and be done with it so I can start putting in cabinets. I dont want to put a floor in thats just going to crack and create more a problem after its done.

Thanks for all your input. I do appreciate it.
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