Any DIY House Flippers Out There? - General DIY Discussions - Page 2 - DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum
Advertisement


Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > DIY Forum > General DIY Discussions

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Like Tree44Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes
Old 12-16-2018, 02:50 PM   #16
Remodel and New Build GC
 
MTN REMODEL LLC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Colorado @ 7651'
Posts: 7,871
Rewards Points: 2,046
Default

Re: Any DIY House Flippers out there?


Quote:
Originally Posted by schreibdave View Post
Thanks for all the thoughtful responses. In no particular order, here are some of my thoughts/responses:

- I would be doing this while living in my own residence. And the goal would probably be to sell it once completed but I would consider renting as well.

-it never occured to me that there would be a lot of other flippers out there chasing the same deals. I wonder if that is as true in my market (Syracuse burb) as in other places.

- I would try to find my target properties at auction/forclosure or by contacted owners directly. I assume that anything on MLS is not going to be a deal.

- If I get this off the ground it will be with an interest paying loan from a family member so I would think I could act quickly with a minimum of lender imposed limitations

- I have never watched one of this flipper shows.

- I assume that the die is cast once you buy the property. That's the last time you have absolute control (to walk away). The selling price and to a lesser degree the rehab costs are out of your control.

- One of my challenges would be to not overdo the details. When I work on my own home I am anal. It would be hard for me to say "that's good enough."
The good news is ....is that you realize that now.

Sounds like you are very sensible and not under any illusions....that's GOOD.

And there is a pretty clear demaracation between "lipsticking" and good quality built to the specif market demands.... not your personal demands.

I've use laminates to solid hardwoods....Fridgidaire or GE monogram, depends on the market...just build to the good/better end of your market.... be it 200K or 800K.

(Now, if it's going to be a rental.... that's an entirely different market. Build to the durability or replaceability end in general.)

Even in the higher range market, I almost always put in a builder's grade lightish tan carpet... and tell my customers that... many people want their own choice/color down the road... but will have something they can comfortably live with till they subsequently decide.

Good going .....
Oso954 and Nealtw like this.
__________________
Never stop learning (xcep fer speling en typeing)
MTN REMODEL LLC is online now   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 12-16-2018, 03:09 PM   #17
retired framer
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Fraser Valley BC Canada
Posts: 25,296
Rewards Points: 18,482
Default

Re: Any DIY House Flippers out there?


I went to a few auctions just to see what it was all about. There were people there I knew as pro flippers and developers. The developers wanted to buy for property values so they could just tare down. The pro flippers were more interesting they all seemed to have max price they would pay and all stopped bidding at very similar prices and the amateurs ended up biding against each other and paying too much, I would guess.


I bought lived in and fixed up a few houses never with flipping in mind but it did turn out that way. I bought houses that were run down and in need of some love that I thought I could fix with my skills or skills I could learn. I usually bought the next house when the market was down and rented until the market was good for selling.
MTN REMODEL LLC likes this.
Nealtw is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 12-16-2018, 03:24 PM   #18
Remodel and New Build GC
 
MTN REMODEL LLC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Colorado @ 7651'
Posts: 7,871
Rewards Points: 2,046
Default

Re: Any DIY House Flippers out there?


As Neal, besides outright flips, all my personal homes have needed some care or build-out, and I guess turned out to be flips sort of.

If you think about it, pretty silly to buy a turnkey, and have paid a third party for just what you do... (Home I am retiring in presently, I bought at the foreclosure auction.)

You won't get a cheaper carry than flipping the home you live in... and it is very convenient to work on your own home..... plenty of time to decide on projects, plenty of time to find best pricing...the wife gets what she wants... and the commute to work is very short.
__________________
Never stop learning (xcep fer speling en typeing)

Last edited by MTN REMODEL LLC; 12-16-2018 at 03:26 PM.
MTN REMODEL LLC is online now   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 12-17-2018, 06:46 AM   #19
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 4,984
Rewards Points: 2,452
Default

Re: Any DIY House Flippers out there?


I don't know who you are, and I'd be happy for you if I'm wrong, but (always that damn but):


1. family money: it's beginning to feel like you have money in pocket that wants to be spent. I don't know how to say this except like this: it is NOT your money.


2. auctions: MTN remodel is a good example. He bought his for retirement. Esp online auctions. I've been told by a banker that the banks have the first dibs here. Auctions also kind of reflect what you'd know already, that if there are many choices on the table, that means they aren't selling outside the auction, meaning the houses are not attractive for location, structure, financial problems, whatever reason. Auction does NOT mean cheap.


You can do big or small but as an one man band, it takes more sacrifice and work than you'd think. It is not necessarily a viable business except during a fantasy boom or in fantasies.

Last edited by carpdad; 12-17-2018 at 06:48 AM.
carpdad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2018, 08:31 PM   #20
" I Can Fix It "
 
Mrbuilder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 222
Rewards Points: 162
Default

Re: Any DIY House Flippers out there?


schreibdave, I read this thread. All the folks who responded gave you excellent advice. I too have experience flipping, and had to stop due to the market changing. Where I am here in Middle Tenn, the market has become a "Seller's Market " due to an influx of 750 people a day moving into our area !!


Think of that, every day 750 folks looking for housing. Most willing to pay huge prices for a house or Condo, to get some of our low taxes and great school system. A couple of my friends pushed it a little, bought a little high, and lost money !! Not that I'm smarter than anyone, I am retired, have a steady income, and don't have to flip to live. I'm lucky, some of my friends are not, and had to go back to work for others.



All any of us are saying, is to know your choice of properties, and pay heed to what it tells you before you buy. Until this latest market change, I prospered flipping.



just sayin'




Good Luck !!!!!
Gymschu likes this.
__________________
" It's ok if you're not sure, find someone who is"
Mrbuilder is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Mrbuilder For This Useful Post:
schreibdave (12-19-2018)
Old 12-18-2018, 08:37 PM   #21
" I Can Fix It "
 
Mrbuilder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 222
Rewards Points: 162
Default

Re: Any DIY House Flippers out there?


P. S.

carpdad is right, I did most of the work myself, worked all the time, and missed a lot of my grand kids early growth. It is my biggest regret. No more 7 day weeks for me !!!!!!



just sayin'
__________________
" It's ok if you're not sure, find someone who is"
Mrbuilder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2018, 09:13 PM   #22
DIY Your Own Air Bed
 
Mark2020's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 212
Rewards Points: 332
Default

Re: Any DIY House Flippers out there?


Quote:
Originally Posted by carpdad View Post
Still am, and it's not like the tv shows at all. Depends on the housing market and now the trend is a slow down. Interest rate is going up and the economy is not really going anywhere for the middle class, except the stock and amazon, so you want to be fairly sure which way the wind is blowing around where you are.


It's not easy to find a cheap house since nobody is a fool. A cheap house with good bones have been already taken during last housing boom. A cheap house WILL come with many problems that takes a lot of money to correct and update. Just the number of cars that people own these days is a problem since you may have to widen or add a driveway. Less modernizing, less attractive to the buyers.



Certain amount of capital gain is still not taxed, but that could blow up as well, since the congress is actively looking for ways to increase the tax.


BTW, there are some houses that were built by hacks and with unacceptable materials. You probably heard about chinese drywall and crumbling foundations (around connecticut?). You want to know if the main sewer is cast iron or terra cotta. Radon and lead would be tested.


BTW, if you're in a college town, consider flipping it into a rental.
Side comment... i'm a very firm believer in shorting amazon stock right now.
__________________
Engineered Beds
DIY Air Bed For A Fraction
Camping beds, Guest Beds, House Beds
https://www.soveiluften.com
Mark2020 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2018, 06:03 AM   #23
Collector of tools
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Syracuse NY
Posts: 63
Rewards Points: 120
Default

Re: Any DIY House Flippers out there?


Thanks for all the replies. I appreciate all the warnings and everyone urging caution. I am a very cautious and analytical person which means that I may never find the right deal for me. And if that's the case, so be it.

At this point I am just trying to put the pieces of the puzzle together: financiang, a source for building materials, understanding the income tax/insurance/legal implications, finding a good source for understanding the before and after value of properties (maybe a realtor, maybe Zillow's data on sold properties) etc.

Once I feel like I understand all those variables I will look for the right property. The right property for me will mean: a manageable size, 15-20 min from my home, bad enough shape that i can add value with my work, less than 50 years old because I don't have any experience working on older homes, and then of course one where the purchase price, rehab cost and anticipated sale price leave me enough profit to make it worth my time.

If i cant find that - fine.
MTN REMODEL LLC likes this.
schreibdave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2018, 08:03 AM   #24
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 4,984
Rewards Points: 2,452
Default

Re: Any DIY House Flippers out there?


Really sorry about this. If you count every cent, you may not start at all. Like many things, there is risk and you have to take it.

About the bit about sacrifice, I like this work. Strange, right? And honestly, young and foolish, what about them kids? They don't stay cute.

I asked about the college town. It gives and takes. There's better chance of somebody looking to invest for their own rental, but that also means the area will be high priced.


Half the battle is the material cost. You're in upper NY, plenty of sales sign for discounted/used/reclaimed building materials. Used foam boards, example, can be used again. You need to down grade the r value, but they can be reused. I see plenty of them on the craigslist but they are too far from me.
carpdad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2018, 10:05 AM   #25
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 4
Rewards Points: 8
Default

Re: Any DIY House Flippers out there?


Hi Dave,

The first step is education. My husband and I haven't flipped anything but since 2016 we have purchased and renovated seven rental units. I have sound a site, BiggerPockets invaluable. I would start listening to their podcasts on this topic, and go on their site for ideas. They have several eBooks available on various topics. Find and attend local Real Estate Meetups or REIAs, and meet other investors as well as wholesalers who sell properties off MLS, at large discounts, but without realtors, you can get on their lists and start looking at their properties to get a better sense of what is available, and watch to see what the purchaser does with the property, and what they sell it for. You might want to partner with someone experienced prior to embarking on your own, a piece of the profit, or even no profit but an education, is better than none at all. Speed is important for flipping, the market can dip, and unless you are using all of your own cash, money is expensive.

It is important to have major renovations permitted. In most places you can switch out fixtures or cabinets, flooring, etc without a permit, but if you are moving walls or finishing unfinished space you will want a permit so buyers trust your product.

Good Luck.
ManyPlaces is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2018, 12:23 PM   #26
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 32
Rewards Points: 64
Default

Re: Any DIY House Flippers out there?


Quote:
Originally Posted by schreibdave View Post
I am a chronic DIYer and am exploring doing a house flip. My plan would be to buy something small and in bad shape and do all the work myself - maybe with the help of my son or possibly a partner or 2.

I am in a burb of Syracuse, NY.

Wondering if anyone else has gone down this road.
I'm actually in this boat right now. I'm doing this with my parents and girlfriend. We already did a rental together, all DIY, and decided to try flipping. We are about 2 months from finishing and putting on the market.

DM me for a lot of advice on how to save money and some pointers. Contrary to what contractors will say, you can do 90% of the work yourself, but there's several factors to consider with that percentage.
mramj4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2018, 12:39 PM   #27
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 32
Rewards Points: 64
Default

Re: Any DIY House Flippers out there?


Quote:
Originally Posted by schreibdave View Post
Thanks for all the thoughtful responses. In no particular order, here are some of my thoughts/responses:

- I would be doing this while living in my own residence. And the goal would probably be to sell it once completed but I would consider renting as well.

-it never occured to me that there would be a lot of other flippers out there chasing the same deals. I wonder if that is as true in my market (Syracuse burb) as in other places.

- I would try to find my target properties at auction/forclosure or by contacted owners directly. I assume that anything on MLS is not going to be a deal.

- If I get this off the ground it will be with an interest paying loan from a family member so I would think I could act quickly with a minimum of lender imposed limitations

- I have never watched one of this flipper shows.

- I assume that the die is cast once you buy the property. That's the last time you have absolute control (to walk away). The selling price and to a lesser degree the rehab costs are out of your control.

- One of my challenges would be to not overdo the details. When I work on my own home I am anal. It would be hard for me to say "that's good enough."
I already posted to this, but as a first time DIY flipper currenty in the process myself, I said DM me because the thread could go on forever. But in specific reply to what you wrote in this particular post...

- If you're going to be living in your own residence, make sure the flip is near your house. Doesn't have to be 5 minutes away, but you also don't want it to be 1 hour away. The original plan might be to go there some nights after work, and it's going to get very tiring very fast if you have to travel to the flip after your normal work day. And you have to consider the amount of gas you'll be spending too.,

- It is not just your neighborhood. We got beat out on several houses, sometimes by as little as $500 more than our bid, by fellow investors. You will find that literally everywhere.

- Be forewarned about auctions and foreclosures. There are a lot out there, but many, not all, but many come with outstanding liens for taxes, utilities, etc, which ALL must be taken care of before closing on the property. Many title companies can give you that info, but for a price, sometimes as much as $150+. However, county records that actually record those liens can be searched for free, by law. If you're looking at 10 potential properties, paying for title searches to find those possible liens is not feasible for most or even desirable. But 15 minutes on online county records sites can expose those liens for you.

- Good for you if you can get a low interest loan from a family member. We took out an equity line of credit on our rental to pay for the flip purchase itself and paid for reno costs out of our cash savings. Keep in mind one thing. Don't know your family situation, but when we were looking for money to buy the flip, we talked with a family member who was interested. We simply wanted a silent partner. She wanted to participate in the reno, design, picking out the flip property, etc. We said no to working with her because of that. We wanted a SILENT partner who we would pay back.

- Having never watched a flip show, what I would suggest watching for more brutal reality of flipping is not Flip or Flop or Flip This House or <Insert Catchy Name> Flip but actually DIY Network's First Time Flippers. It's similar people who are doing DIY work on their very first flip. You can see mistakes they make and what the end results are as well as the actual REALITY of what you experience. There's plenty of seasons to go through. I would highly suggest this show to see the non-rose-colored glasses take on flipping.

- Regarding casting the die, yes. The selling price is out of your control. The reno costs are less out of your control. I found excellent ways to save money, and I'm not talking about buying clearance crap. DM me.

- With perfectionism, that can be a killer. Remember the point is to make it a nice place to live. Good enough is also a grey area and seriously depends on what you're working on. There are some things that are good enough, ie stuff that may be hidden or out of sight, and there is stuff that cannot just be good enough, ie tiling and finishing work or cutting corners with plumbing or electric.
mramj4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2018, 12:59 PM   #28
Property Mgt/Maint
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Upstate NY
Posts: 5,561
Rewards Points: 6,368
Default

Re: Any DIY House Flippers out there?


I can tell you one thing about "flipped" houses, I will never buy one.

Sitting in the dr office this morning, they had one of these DYI home flippen shows on the set. A girl and her mom was doing all the work. Pretty scary stuff. In a matter of just a few minutes, I heard one of the girls say, "its just a floor, we can eyeball it". They then chipped the side of the flooring hammering directly on it, then left it there because the sofa will cover it! Shortly after, one of them was cutting framing lumber with a chop saw, with no glasses. Made a comment about she knew she should have them on, but then cut another board without them. Then they were hanging doors without a level.


Thankfully, I was then called into the office which limited my exposure!
SPS-1 likes this.
__________________
[political signature removed]
Yodaman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2018, 02:07 PM   #29
Super Moderator
 
Gymschu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Eastern Ohio (heart of Appalachia)
Posts: 6,405
Rewards Points: 6,748
Default

Re: Any DIY House Flippers out there?


@Yodaman , that sounds like "Good Bones" on HGTV. They rehab and flip houses in Indianapolis. Guess I better pay more attention to what they are doing! YIKES!!!
Yodaman likes this.
__________________
"In the heat of battle, my father wove a tapestry of obscenity........."
Gymschu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2018, 02:42 PM   #30
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Northern Virginia, which I'm told is different from "real" Virginia
Posts: 44
Rewards Points: 88
Default

Re: Any DIY House Flippers out there?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Yodaman View Post
I can tell you one thing about "flipped" houses, I will never buy one.
THANK YOU.

My wife and I, first time buyers, bought from a "flipper" and, god damn, that was a mistake. As much as I've grown fond of my house, I'm going to be spending years fixing problems with things that, at the time of purchase, seemed perfectly fine (remember folks, home inspectors can't open up walls).

At this point I'm anticipating a chorus of "not all flippers" or some other nonsense, but the economics just don't add up. The incentive for the flipper is profit, that's it. Maybe what we need is site where purchasers can "review" flippers so that there's some accountability reputation-wise. So long as everything looks good on the surface, why would a flipper "waste" money doing anything but the bare minimum as required by code (or likely less, depending on what the code inspector has access to)?

Maybe there are some out there who really take pride in their work, treat every house as though they were going to live in it, blah blah etc. Fantastic, but they're just going to be routinely strategically outbid by corner-cutters (who can afford to bid more because ****ty work is less expensive) or stupidly outbid by newbies who don't know any better. I suspect this is all fueled by the deluge of "flipper" TV shows and subsequent bandwagon effect that leaves us with house flipping as the be-your-own-boss scheme du jour.
Yodaman likes this.
PatentPending is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Our buzzing house has stumped our electrician? niftyc Electrical 32 01-14-2017 09:36 AM
whole house low water pressure/flow juels98 Plumbing 16 01-03-2017 09:11 PM
Bleach Smell In House - Help! broderbund General DIY Discussions 6 08-04-2016 07:01 PM
Cape Cod Style House Attic/Crawl Space Insulation Help Danielg Insulation 24 05-21-2012 08:20 AM
Attaching wood fence to house TheCowGod Building & Construction 5 04-13-2012 03:57 PM




Top of Page | View New Posts