Small Landing And Steps To Get To Patio. Do I Need Footers? - Building & Construction - Page 2 - DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum
Advertisement


Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > Building & Construction

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Like Tree7Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes
Old 08-10-2019, 06:18 AM   #16
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 39
Rewards Points: 60
Default

Re: Small landing and steps to get to patio. Do I need footers?


Thanks again de-nagorg.

Here's what it'll look like, just in case it matters at all..
Attached Thumbnails
Small landing and steps to get to patio.  Do I need footers?-steps.jpg  
de-nagorg likes this.
pezman726 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 08-10-2019, 08:48 AM   #17
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Washington, DC area
Posts: 2,770
Rewards Points: 2,202
Default

Re: Small landing and steps to get to patio. Do I need footers?


Presumably the green will be your patio, not grass?
huesmann is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 08-10-2019, 09:50 AM   #18
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 39
Rewards Points: 60
Default


Quote:
Originally Posted by huesmann View Post
Presumably the green will be your patio, not grass?
Yes! I tried to get my wife to agree to a green patio...but we went with gray instead!
de-nagorg likes this.
pezman726 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 08-12-2019, 12:12 PM   #19
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 39
Rewards Points: 60
Default

Re: Small landing and steps to get to patio. Do I need footers?


Back to the topic at hand...I talked with the guy that's going to be building it. He said he'd rather not do it freestanding for fear that it would shift over time. He'd rather have posts down to the frost line. So, I've got a few options here....

a.) Posts to the frost line, with steps resting on the patio, and anchored to the ledger. This seems to me like if there is any heaving, it would put force on the bottom step.

2.) Have the steps a completely separate entity, and have the concrete poured AROUND the steps, so if there IS any heaving of the concrete, it would not affect the steps at all (since they would be 2 completely different entities.

d.) Tell him to just go ahead and do it freestanding, and say i don't think it'll shift!

Not being trained in any sort of construction, i'm not sure what the best answer here is!

*sigh* if only this stuff was as easy as writing software!!! (Because with software, if it doesn't work, I can just change a few lines of code and give it another go....construction...not so easy to do that!!!)

Thoughts?
pezman726 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2019, 12:17 PM   #20
retired framer
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Fraser Valley BC Canada
Posts: 31,270
Rewards Points: 6,198
Default

Re: Small landing and steps to get to patio. Do I need footers?


@pezman726


What would it be sitting on, grass like your picture.
__________________
Do not use flat bottom gables with scissor trusses.
Nealtw is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2019, 12:56 PM   #21
JUSTA MEMBER
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Central Wyoming
Posts: 13,319
Rewards Points: 1,604
Default

Re: Small landing and steps to get to patio. Do I need footers?


I too would want posts down to the frost line.

What I do is to use Sono-Tube, forms to make the underground foundation for the deck posts, adding those stand-off risers at ground level to install the wood deck posts into.

These sono-tubes will leave a paper expansion joint between your piers, and the concrete patio pour.

Thus isolating them from each other in case of heave.

And you can use expansion joint material, between the patio, and the raised landing and steps, further isolating them from each other.

ED
de-nagorg is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2019, 01:28 PM   #22
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 39
Rewards Points: 60
Default

Re: Small landing and steps to get to patio. Do I need footers?


Quote:
Originally Posted by de-nagorg View Post
I too would want posts down to the frost line.

What I do is to use Sono-Tube, forms to make the underground foundation for the deck posts, adding those stand-off risers at ground level to install the wood deck posts into.

These sono-tubes will leave a paper expansion joint between your piers, and the concrete patio pour.

Thus isolating them from each other in case of heave.

And you can use expansion joint material, between the patio, and the raised landing and steps, further isolating them from each other.

ED

You say the Sono-Tubes would leave a paper expansion joint between the piers and the patio pour. So in this case, the tubes would come above grade, with those post bases attached to those?

Now, having the expansion joint material between the patio and the steps. If I am understanding this correctly, you're talking about having it on the outside of the steps, correct...not UNDER the steps. If this is the case, then there would most likely be NO concrete under the steps, and thus no need to separate the piers from the patio. Is the pic I uploaded (crappy drawing, sorry) like what you're talking about? Black is step (and grade at bottom) Red is the expansion joint matrial, and gray is concrete?
Attached Images
 
pezman726 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2019, 04:17 PM   #23
JUSTA MEMBER
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Central Wyoming
Posts: 13,319
Rewards Points: 1,604
Default

Re: Small landing and steps to get to patio. Do I need footers?


If your step is all wood, and composite you are correct, but if any of it is concrete, do use the expansion joint material.

But there is still a slight chance that a concrete patio, poured against a wood step framework will stick to the wood, so use a release oil sparingly at that abutment.


ED
de-nagorg is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2019, 04:34 PM   #24
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 39
Rewards Points: 60
Default

Re: Small landing and steps to get to patio. Do I need footers?


Quote:
Originally Posted by de-nagorg View Post
If your step is all wood, and composite you are correct, but if any of it is concrete, do use the expansion joint material.

But there is still a slight chance that a concrete patio, poured against a wood step framework will stick to the wood, so use a release oil sparingly at that abutment.


ED
Ok, so. After talking a LOT with my contractor, I think I have a mixture of my solution!

I'm going to dig post holes to the frost line and backfill with concrete, use the sono-tubes at the top to keep that separate from the patio, and fill to be level with the patio with concrete. Then, on top of that, I'll use a post bracket to attach the post to the concrete. The landing will be attached to house ledger, and the posts (because inside of sono-tube) will all be separate from the concrete.

The bottom step coming off of the platform WILL be on the concrete patio. the contractor does not think that it will be an issue because of how the steps are attached to the platform. Any heaving will cause minor stress to where the steps attach to the platform, but the platform will stay put, and not damage the connection to the house.

End product of tube and concrete should look like this!

I'm hopeful that this is a good solution!!
Attached Images
 
de-nagorg and Nealtw like this.
pezman726 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2019, 04:43 PM   #25
JUSTA MEMBER
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Central Wyoming
Posts: 13,319
Rewards Points: 1,604
Default

Re: Small landing and steps to get to patio. Do I need footers?


Sounds like you have a great plan.

Does it comply with your local building inspection office, or

( forbid), the H O A?


ED
de-nagorg is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2019, 04:52 PM   #26
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 39
Rewards Points: 60
Default

Re: Small landing and steps to get to patio. Do I need footers?


Quote:
Originally Posted by de-nagorg View Post
Sounds like you have a great plan.

Does it comply with your local building inspection office, or

( forbid), the H O A?


ED
oh lord, don't get me started on the HOA! stupid "architecture review committee" bunch of BS!!! next house will NOT be in an HOA community! As for complying with local building inspections....apparently the office doesn't care what you do about "stairs," so no inspections needed!
de-nagorg likes this.
pezman726 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2019, 05:09 PM   #27
JUSTA MEMBER
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Central Wyoming
Posts: 13,319
Rewards Points: 1,604
Default

Re: Small landing and steps to get to patio. Do I need footers?


You do know that your " rise and run" need to be uniform?

That is one of the important checks that a building inspector would be checking on.

Yes I dislike H O AS also, I'm lucky that in my area there is neither one to have to deal with, I'm in the county area, where as long as you don't have water, and lights, you can build whatever suits your needs.

Hook either up, then they consider even a chicken coop as habitable, then increase your taxes.

ED
de-nagorg is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2019, 05:13 PM   #28
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 39
Rewards Points: 60
Default


Quote:
Originally Posted by de-nagorg View Post
You do know that your " rise and run" need to be uniform?

That is one of the important checks that a building inspector would be checking on.

ED
Yep, ran a few of those rise/run calculators online and compared it to plans...everything seemed to check out!

Thanks for all the help!!! I'll be sure to post some pics when it's all finished!
de-nagorg likes this.
pezman726 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





Top of Page | View New Posts