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Old 02-07-2015, 01:01 PM   #1
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Sill Plate Not Attached to Foundation


1910 bungalow with dug out cellar to make low ceiling basement with bench footings. Original foundation is early cmu, doesn't seem to be cinder block, hollow not filed. 3/4 of one wall is concrete, looks like it was repaired in the 50's or 60's when cellar was deepened.

The sill plate was never attached to foundation with fasteners but sat in a bed of mortar which has mostly crumbled.

I will soon have access to it, from the inside, from both the top and side.

How should I go about fastening it? (I will trowel non shrink hydraulic cement under it first to keep it from compressing it. There is a gap between 0 and 3/4")

Thanks!
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Old 02-07-2015, 05:29 PM   #2
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[QUOTE=wewantutopia;1704017]1910 bungalow with dug out cellar to make low ceiling basement with bench footings. Original foundation is early cmu, doesn't seem to be cinder block, hollow not filed. 3/4 of one wall is concrete, looks like it was repaired in the 50's or 60's when cellar was deepened.

The sill plate was never attached to foundation with fasteners but sat in a bed of mortar which has mostly crumbled. how do you know this ?

How should I go about fastening it? (I will trowel non shrink hydraulic cement under it first to keep it from compressing it. keep it from compressing what ? how are the doors & windows - easily operated ? There is a gap between 0 and 3/4"
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Old 02-07-2015, 07:55 PM   #3
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my guess is predrill and tap in bolts or pieces of rebar with epoxy in the holes. And like you said, fill in the voids with the strongest non shrink masonry you can get. Maybe fill a section at a time and then once it sets, chip out the surrounding area if it's compromised and redo everything with new masonry.
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Old 02-08-2015, 03:25 PM   #4
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Thanks for the replies.

I know this because I can see it. I'm am worrying in the basement insulating the rim joists.

Where the old mortar has crumbled and no longer between the sill plate and block or concrete. It is completely gone (vacuumed up) except for a few little pieces that are wedged in. I am going to fill the gap with hydraulic cement so when mechanical fasteners are cranked down the plate (and then attached rim joist) doesn’t reduce the gap to 0 possibly shifting, cracking, etc the boards.

The house is fine, doors, windows open fine. I hasn't settled, racked, sifted etc, etc. The plate is still sitting on a few, small, wedged in pieces of mortar.

So the recommendation so far is predrill, fill holes holes with epoxy, and insert bolts (threaded rods?). I'm assuming that, after the epoxy has dried, add large washers and crank down some bolts? Is this right? What kind of epoxy? I have a SDS hammer drill so I'm good there.
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Old 02-08-2015, 05:30 PM   #5
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my house doesn't even have a sill plate. just joists on the blocks.
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Old 02-08-2015, 06:32 PM   #6
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In areas where there is no room to effectively drill and epoxy I've used twist straps to attach the frame to the foundation.
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Old 02-08-2015, 07:21 PM   #7
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Do you have a picture.?
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Old 02-09-2015, 08:10 AM   #8
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Your old house hasn't moved. There are only a few things that will move the house off the foundation. I don't think you should do anything. In fact, filling the cracks with cement is not a good idea. It only looks good, but cement will crack anyway. Straps are cheap insurance against uplift but again, your house stayed. Check the condition of the plate lumber. Gouge, scrape and drill into it and make sure the wood is solid. Make sure you don't do anything to outside grading, siding, gutter, landscaping, windows, doors, etc, that may introduce moisture or water. Add foam panels into the bays and seal against draft with can foam.
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Old 02-09-2015, 11:44 AM   #9
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If you want something under the plates, you could use pl400 adhesive. Easy to squirt in there, won't expand, and dries like rock. Ron
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Old 02-09-2015, 05:14 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wewantutopia View Post
1910 bungalow with dug out cellar to make low ceiling basement with bench footings. Original foundation is early cmu, doesn't seem to be cinder block, hollow not filed. 3/4 of one wall is concrete, looks like it was repaired in the 50's or 60's when cellar was deepened.

The sill plate was never attached to foundation with fasteners but sat in a bed of mortar which has mostly crumbled.

I will soon have access to it, from the inside, from both the top and side.

How should I go about fastening it? (I will trowel non shrink hydraulic cement under it first to keep it from compressing it. There is a gap between 0 and 3/4")

Thanks!
Ayuh,... I've got a couple of ole houses of 'bout the same vintage,...

Neither were bolted down, 'n neither moved, laterally atleast,...

The sills rested on a stacked limestone, 'n mortar wall, mudded right to the wood, originally,...
Some cute little 3/4" cast iron screw jacks to level the beams were mudded into pockets in the stone,...
Pretty neat,... no pictures though,...

Anyways,... Ya, I like yer idea of the hyd, concrete,....
That's sorta where I've ended up,...
What original rock foundation wall that's left has a new vibrated concrete wall encasin' it, inside,...

as far as boltin' the place down,...
Ya, throw in a couple pieces of 1/2" reddi-rod,...
Glue 'em in with the hyd. cement,... no need for epoxy,..
Top 'em off with a nut, 'n washer, no reason to go crazy tightenin' 'em,...
As noted, it Ain't goin' nowhere,...
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Old 02-12-2015, 09:45 AM   #11
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Well, thanks for all the replies!

Fix'n it - no sill plate at all? Crazy!

The wood is in GREAT shape. The sill plate sits 2' above grade and is graded properly. The house sits on the top of a hill (no neighbor's rain water run off), plus I have excavated around the entire perimeter (by hand) 48" deep and parged, covered with 6 coats of elastomeric waterproofer, covered that with 1.5" XPS, and covered that with 6 coats of elastomeric waterproofer (and sand). Outside water isn't a problem lol!

You guys have swayed me. It probably wont move (unless there is a tornado etc) so I'm going to end up just doing the hydraulic cement and some straps in a few strategic spots.

Thanks again for the replies!
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