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Old 09-02-2018, 08:51 AM   #1
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Second floor over a masonry house


Hi, just move to a new house. It has a flat roof ( concrete) because it was supposed to have a second floor (masonry).
Question is, I am going to frame the second story, what size of floor joist should I use? 2x10, 2x8, 2x6? They go flat right over the roof, that is actually like a slab.

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Old 09-02-2018, 09:01 AM   #2
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Re: Second floor over a masonry house


Check with your local bldg dept - they're the ones that will need to approve the plans and inspect the framing.
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Old 09-02-2018, 09:07 AM   #3
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Re: Second floor over a masonry house


Being flat I don't see that they are providing any support.
Your location would help us to know what methods your are following.

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Old 09-02-2018, 09:08 AM   #4
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Re: Second floor over a masonry house


They are going to want at least 2x8s. No matter what, you will have to present plans.
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Old 09-02-2018, 09:26 AM   #5
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Re: Second floor over a masonry house


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bud9051 View Post
Being flat I don't see that they are providing any support.
Your location would help us to know what methods your are following.

Thanks
Bud
The joist doesnt go flat, what I was trying to say is that there is no span at all, because the joist is supported along its full lenght. I live in Argentina, theres no inspector or building dept.


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They are going to want at least 2x8s. No matter what, you will have to present plans.
Thanks



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Old 09-02-2018, 09:27 AM   #6
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Re: Second floor over a masonry house


How is this flat roof constructed? How much load is it capable of carrying?
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Old 09-02-2018, 09:30 AM   #7
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Re: Second floor over a masonry house


Do yourself a favor. Hire an architect.
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Old 09-02-2018, 09:46 AM   #8
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Re: Second floor over a masonry house


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How is this flat roof constructed? How much load is it capable of carrying?
Able to hold a brick second story, strong enough to hold a frame building.
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Do yourself a favor. Hire an architect.
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Old 09-02-2018, 12:47 PM   #9
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Re: Second floor over a masonry house


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Able to hold a brick second story, strong enough to hold a frame building.

That isn't really an answer. Brick would be supported by the exterior first floor walls not the flat roof. IF the roof has enough structure you wouldn't need more than a 2x4 joist but if it's not - then you need whatever size joist is required for the unsupported span [just like the roof wasn't there]
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Old 09-02-2018, 01:01 PM   #10
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Re: Second floor over a masonry house


Exterior wall are 30 cm (+/- 12 inches), interior half that size, all brick, with columns and beams of concrete with steel bars. Where there is not wall in the first floor, there is a concrete beam. It was meant to hold a second story of brick construction. Support is not an issue, but I want a solid subfloor and the bathroom tubes needs to go trough. Thanks for your help.

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Old 09-02-2018, 01:08 PM   #11
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Re: Second floor over a masonry house


If you have to core holes in the floor for plumbing anyway, just use the concrete floor for a floor.
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Old 09-02-2018, 08:32 PM   #12
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Re: Second floor over a masonry house


I want to put insulation, but now that you point that, I see that my original question is stupid. 🤦🏽*♂️ Thanks

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Old 09-03-2018, 07:42 AM   #13
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Re: Second floor over a masonry house


North american buildings are different from argentina. What are the differences? Concrete footings and wall or brick only walls on some kind of footing? If the roof was built originally as a PLANNED floor, why not use it as a floor? Why now rethinking the floor? What is the span of the planned floor joists?
All of these things would require you to see a local engineer or a builder. Don't assume anything just because they are there. Not to offend, but it is always possible to consider that your roof is a roof because the builder cheated on the reinforcement and the material for the planned floor and abandoned the idea of using it as a floor than taking the liability. If that roof is not built to be a floor, you don't want to put lumber on them as if the slab is load bearing all the way through.
How was the roof protected? If it is bare concrete, rebars and such could have rusted, even if argentina, I think, is fairly dry country.
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Old 09-04-2018, 07:01 PM   #14
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Re: Second floor over a masonry house


Quote:
Originally Posted by carpdad View Post
North american buildings are different from argentina. What are the differences? Concrete footings and wall or brick only walls on some kind of footing? If the roof was built originally as a PLANNED floor, why not use it as a floor? Why now rethinking the floor? What is the span of the planned floor joists?
All of these things would require you to see a local engineer or a builder. Don't assume anything just because they are there. Not to offend, but it is always possible to consider that your roof is a roof because the builder cheated on the reinforcement and the material for the planned floor and abandoned the idea of using it as a floor than taking the liability. If that roof is not built to be a floor, you don't want to put lumber on them as if the slab is load bearing all the way through.
How was the roof protected? If it is bare concrete, rebars and such could have rusted, even if argentina, I think, is fairly dry country.
Concrete footings, with concrete post and beams, then the gaps sre filled with bricks.



I want an elevated floor, because it is more comfortable and I want to put insulation between the floor joist.
There is no actual span, because each joist will rest on the concrete floor all the way.

The roof has a "false" gable over it. Its been use as an attic to store old furniture
There is an architec involved but they know nothing about framing. You can see his work in some of my others treads.

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Last edited by Rafacacho; 09-04-2018 at 07:05 PM.
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Old 09-04-2018, 08:26 PM   #15
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Re: Second floor over a masonry house


I would do this with foam and floating plywood with the T&G glued.
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