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Old 12-17-2009, 08:05 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba_Dave View Post
You can still buy & install 2 prong outlets on a 2 wire circuit
And to elaborate to the OP that these 2 prong outlets (that will be downstream of the GFCI receptacle) will be protected (in lieu of Ground) against leakage current. But Dave, this is my point that the beginning DIY'ers should, along with the planning of their work pick up a book about basic electrical wiring at a Home Center. That will facilitate the help that is so willingly offered by the veterans of this Website.
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Old 12-17-2009, 08:21 PM   #32
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I agree, anyone who wants to "mess" with electric does need to know the basics
Plus a meter would be a min requirement
You really need to make sure wires are dead before touching them

BTW - you can't extend a 2 wire circuit at all
If you need more outlets you need to run new wire/circuit



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Old 12-17-2009, 08:37 PM   #33
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"redblotoflife"--There are some very knowledgeable people on this forum giving you FREE great advice. There seems to be some type of communication problem here with you not understanding the when you have been told "you can't", this does not mean that YOU cannot actually, physically do this task. The wording I am reading, and being a small business Household HandyMan contractor, states that Electrical Codes will not allow you to do this task/procedure. Yes, you can wire in a three-wire duplex outlet, which will have two flat slots and one semi-round hole to just two wires coming out of your wall box. BUT-it is a code violation, and you WILL NOT have a ground for safety. Unless, as previously stated your wiring has been ran via BX metallic conduit, which may provide for ground IF installed correctly. Now, IF this circuit is "HOT" when the fuse/breaker is "ON", and you have no proven ground circuit-the GFCI outlet is the preferred way for you to wire this, and identify it as not having a ground. This will also be the safest method of doing this. Remove the electrical outlet you bought with the 3 or4 wires in the wiring diagram from this situation. It does sound as if this is a "pass through" outlet which you do not need and complicates this situation. Good Luck, David
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Old 12-17-2009, 09:11 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba_Dave View Post
I agree, anyone who wants to "mess" with electric does need to know the basics
Plus a meter would be a min requirement
You really need to make sure wires are dead before touching them

BTW - you can't extend a 2 wire circuit at all
If you need more outlets you need to run new wire/circuit
I was saying that any Existing, additional outlets on that circuit that were downstream would be protected. The truth is that this method of protection without a ground is only Second best. Ideally, the entire circuit should be rewired with a Ground wire included and connected in the proper manner as required by NEC.
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Old 12-18-2009, 05:38 AM   #35
 
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for your information


I did at least look at some diagrams that showed how to do an outlet (from an DIY handbook!) but they all showed 3 wires or 4 wires never 2 because hence this is an old house - so an old method applies.

And any brain could figure out that if some one else ripped something out of the wall without being electrocuted that the other person could do it as well doing the same method (shutting off all the main power so no electricity is flowing) maybe I could have been extra paranoid and used a meter..yes maybe I will in the future - thanks for the advice.

However could any one range an estimate for how much it costs to hook a new 3 line in so that the circuit is grounded? How much would it cost to upgrade to 20 amps? or a 6 wire outlet (you can plug in 6 plugs).

Is it possible to upgrade the old electric ? Can some one give me an estimate for upgrading one outlet?

I kind of do want an electrician in on this because it sounds unsafe.

I'd also like to point out if it was so unsafe how come there is a 3 prong circuit that you call unsafe that has not caught up in flames for over 12 years?

My bro has a lot of power lines up in his room and no fire yet..
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Old 12-18-2009, 06:02 AM   #36
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The people on this site giving information are the greatest, knowledgeable, helpful, safest and patient.

Sounds like they all tried to help but, YOU NEED TO CALL AN ELECTRICIAN.
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Old 12-18-2009, 06:35 AM   #37
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a gfci can be installed using a green ground wire.... or NOT using a green ground if none exists.
it's the only way you will pass an inspection if the guy plugs in his tester.
if you want two prongers, go to your local Habitat for Humanity ReStore. i see 2prongers there all the time.
but the gfci is safer.

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Old 12-18-2009, 10:51 AM   #38
 
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I would use gfci


I would use gfci except in all the descriptions you need 3 wires (I'm assuming the third is a ground wire but I don't know)


would this work with the 2 wired outlet that I have?

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/...7X-_-100656376
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Old 12-18-2009, 10:54 AM   #39
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I don't know how many times you need to be told this

You do NOT need the 3rd wire with a GFCI

Quote:
Since the GFCI does not use the equipment grounding conductor in the sensing circuit, GFCIs will protect non-grounding circuits and can replace two-wire (ungrounded) receptacles as permitted in Sec. 210-7(d) Ex. of the NEC.


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Old 12-18-2009, 10:55 AM   #40
 
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oh


oh I didn't hear any one say that until now O_o

I'm going to try buying the gfci if it doesn't work I'll simply save the device for when I upgrade the outlet.

Last edited by redblotoflife; 12-18-2009 at 11:08 AM.
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Old 12-18-2009, 11:08 AM   #41
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huh?

see post #37

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Old 12-18-2009, 11:13 AM   #42
 
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I'm buying a 3 pronged


I'm buying a 3 pronged gfci I am only running a printer that is off most of the time - a energy saving monitor and a tower.

So not much will be hooked into it for safety reasons.

Alas I will tell you all how this ends within a week I suppose..

my other option is to unscrew the 3 prong over here and try to figure out for the life of me how it works..it's probably an old outlet which is why it works..hard to find 3 prongs that work with 2 wirings that aren't gfci.
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Old 12-18-2009, 01:35 PM   #43
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I hate to be blunt but I don't think you have listened to anything that has been posted after post #2. Heck in post #3 you told someone that they were wrong without even knowing what a GFI was or that it would work without a ground wire.

A three wire receptacle will work without a ground wire. However, it needs to be GFI protected and labeled "No ground present".

Why do you keep putting corners on a round wheel and hoping it works better? Why does it seem like you keep looking for something that does not exist? You will not find a 2 wire GFI. They will work on a 2 wire system. A plug-in tester will not trip the GFI since it shunts to the ground wire. The proper test on a 2 wire system is to use the TEST buttons.
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Old 12-18-2009, 02:07 PM   #44
 
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I don't think your getting it


I am getting the gfci or whatever it is and even if it doesn't work I am not being fooled as I will upgrade to have 3 lines and it WILL then work

(3 lines meaning a grounding line obviously)

also your saying it wont work with 2 wiring but another is saying it will - I am simply posting this forum so every one will know what does work with the GFCI.

Thanks to some helpful posters I can now test this theory aheuck! :wh istling2:

either way if I have to get an electrician to come in we will all solve this issue one way or the other.
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Old 12-18-2009, 02:10 PM   #45
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It's not a theory



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