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Old 09-08-2009, 07:44 PM   #16
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Commenting about "advice"? , shorting 2 live wires!


Quote:
Originally Posted by 220/221 View Post
Best case you get a little of both.

If it's an FPE breaker you may just get the explosion




What a freaking idiot.


Creating an intentional short is one of the most stupid things I've ever heard of (except when tracing circuits)
Some time ago I was working with a Senior Electrician in a factory and he did exactly what you said (in parentheses). Miracle is that it was an FPE breaker. That guy had this thing about working LIVE on Feeders, too. One day we were installing a Commercial Microwave in the kitchen of a fancy restaurant in Manhattan. For some reason the NEW line (#8/3. Old NEC) was live. I begged him to shut the breaker. NO I can do it LIVE. OK. Next thing we heard a big bang. Worse than July 4 Rockets. Maybe the taping job wasn't so great! The Locknut melted to the wire... Kevin, if you read this, try to have a good laugh...(No matter what)Don't Drink and Drive, Ever!!!
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Old 09-08-2009, 07:53 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spark plug View Post
Some time ago I was working with a Senior Electrician in a factory and he did exactly what you said (in parentheses). Miracle is that it was an FPE breaker. That guy had this thing about working LIVE on Feeders, too. One day we were installing a Commercial Microwave in the kitchen of a fancy restaurant in Manhattan. For some reason the NEW line (#8/3. Old NEC) was live. I begged him to shut the breaker. NO I can do it LIVE. OK. Next thing we heard a big bang. Worse than July 4 Rockets. Maybe the taping job wasn't so great! The Locknut melted to the wire... Kevin, if you read this, try to have a good laugh...(No matter what)Don't Drink and Drive, Ever!!!
hahah reminds me the time I was working on a live circuit because (as I posted here) our panel is very hard to get to so I did not want to go through the trouble of turning it off, and turning it on is even harder (weird angle and hard to turn a breaker on without your hand)

So I'm working on this light socket and had to pass the wire through a loop, while being very careful I tried to avoid it from contacting, well, it did. POOF! in my face. My mom was paranoid (electricity scares her, and seeing me on a ladder fiddling up there while it was live scared her even more). She totally freaked out, was funny. At least the breaker was off now. It also answered my question as to whether they used the neutral or the hot as the traveler wire in the light switch. They used the neutral. (is that even right? I would have figured you always use the hot).

One thing I refuse to do is work on a live 240v circuit though including a split plug on a double breaker. I can handle 120, but 240 scares the crap out of me.
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Old 09-08-2009, 09:47 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by micromind View Post
It's rarely ever a good idea to intentionally trip a breaker at line voltage. Technically speaking, if a breaker has tripped on a short circuit (not a long-term overload) its life is over; every manufacturer recommends that it be replaced.

If you're not going to use the line, insulate each wire (except the ground) individually. That way, it doesn't matter if it's energized or not.

It's always better to disconnect it in the panel, you can leave the breaker in if you want. It's even better if the other end of the wire is in a box.

Rob

P.S. If you short out a Zinsco or FPE breaker, there's a fair chance that it won't trip at all, and a very good chance of a fire.
From my own (unfortunate & unintentional) experience. An FPE WILL trip on a SHORT. Of course, after heating the circuit to dangerous levels. It WON'T trip, however, on a GROUND FAULT. Meaning. Where the HOT wire is touching a GROUNDED object. Like a pipe. It'll act like a torch. Arcing away till the house burns down!!!(No matter what)Don't Drink and Drive, Ever!!!
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Old 09-08-2009, 09:51 PM   #19
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Addendum to previous post!


...You do that twice (Intentionally or otherwise Shorting the circuit) on an FPE breaker. And you can throw it away. It'll burn out!!! (eliminate dangerous products from the market) Now more than ever!!!
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Old 09-08-2009, 10:17 PM   #20
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Relocating a taped off 12/3 resi kitchen home run. Pulled it in thru a plastic box and, boom.

Nothing but smoke damage.

It wasn't me but I must share the blame because he is my knuckleheaded son. I get more careful every day as he gets more dangerous. Freaking kids


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Old 09-08-2009, 11:01 PM   #21
 
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Originally Posted by darren View Post
There is a home improvement guy on TV(if your from Canada or maybe even the US you know who I mean, he is by far the most popular reno guy on tv right now) and he always says to cap the lines for if someone energizes it will trip the breaker. This is a guy who some people take his words as the only way to do it.

I beleive that you should never do this, what happens if you got a bad breaker and it does not trip. It will probably cause a nice big flame and lots of damage.

Which one, cuz now I wanna watch him so I can critique his show........could be entertaining......
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Old 03-07-2015, 03:19 PM   #22
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Hi all,

I just saw this post and wanted to confirm that I understand this correctly. If I disconnect a 220 line inside the breaker box, cap and tape the tape the ends, the unused wires (capped) can be left in the breaker box loose and this meets NEC?

Please confirm. - Thank you.

Last edited by JeepRadioGuy; 03-07-2015 at 03:23 PM. Reason: Better wording
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Old 03-07-2015, 04:29 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JeepRadioGuy View Post
Hi all,

I just saw this post and wanted to confirm that I understand this correctly. If I disconnect a 220 line inside the breaker box, cap and tape the tape the ends, the unused wires (capped) can be left in the breaker box loose and this meets NEC?

Please confirm. - Thank you.
Yup, should be fine. it might even be a good idea to tag where the other end of the wire is going. However if the wire has been cut and buried in the wall with no intention if ever being used then you should pull it from the panel and cut it back as far as you can until it is out of sight. In some cases you may want to not use a wire any longer but it may run in an attic or crawl space. it could be of some value at a later date so, cap it off, and box it up and cover it where it can be seen, label it. In the panel remove wires from breaker and neutral bar. Cap them and mark them to match the other end.
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Old 03-07-2015, 04:41 PM   #24
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Thank you for the clarification and the suggestions.

I'll pull it out of the box and label it in case we would ever want to use it again.

Best wishes.

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Old 03-09-2015, 02:25 PM   #25
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Which one, cuz now I wanna watch him so I can critique his show........could be entertaining.....

The show is one in the Mike Holmes series. He has had several different shows over the past few years such as "Holmes Makes it Right" and "Holmes Inspection". I remember the episode from a while back and he did in fact say to wire nut the two hots together and not to cap each one individually so that if anyone ever connected them to a breaker then the breaker would trip.
I actually like the show because they use a lot of good products and the finished results are pretty good but it is easy to critique the show and pick up on some of the bad advise, especially the electrical stuff.
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Old 03-09-2015, 02:53 PM   #26
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Quote:
I remember the episode from a while back and he did in fact say to wire nut the two hots together and not to cap each one individually so that if anyone ever connected them to a breaker then the breaker would trip.
Are you positive it was 2 hots (240V) ? Or was it a hot and a neutral (120V) ?

I'm not defending the practice in either case, but there is a big difference in energy between the two.


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Old 03-09-2015, 03:49 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oso954 View Post


Are you positive it was 2 hots (240V) ? Or was it a hot and a neutral (120V) ?

I'm not defending the practice in either case, but there is a big difference in energy between the two.


I saw that show also, and I think him and the electrician in later shows said the same thing. and it was a stove circuit.
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