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Old 06-23-2009, 10:29 AM   #16
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also about my previous question if there is a 60a feeder breaker in the main panel to the subpanel what is the largest main there can be in the subpanel. i ask b/c of the convenience of those contractor kits for 125 amp subpanels and h.d. and lowes.
The panel and the feeders are protected by the breaker in the main panel. The "main" breaker in the subpanel becomes a disconnect and can be any size.
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Old 06-23-2009, 10:39 AM   #17
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gotcha, and no matter what size the shutoff in the sub, 60a is all that is available to use say if the shut off was 125a?, since that is the service from the main panel. correct?
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Old 06-23-2009, 10:47 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by choppermrt View Post
also about my previous question if there is a 60a feeder breaker in the main panel to the subpanel what is the largest main there can be in the subpanel. i ask b/c of the convenience of those contractor kits for 125 amp subpanels and h.d. and lowes.
Oh, yes it's OK to have a bigger disconnect, as long as the protection at the main panel is the right size for the wires.
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Old 06-23-2009, 10:49 AM   #19
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if 6awg will work for what i want than i am happy with the 60a. and no the window unit was previously run with its own line in the subpanel, sorry wasnt clear. what is the rule of thumb for number of receptacles on a 20a run. i am using #12 wire. as i said before in the bar area i am looking at maybe a tv, small fridge, some neons, and a stereo. is that too much for one 20 amp circut?
It's probably OK. Depending on how you set the bar up, it could be considered a kitchen under the code, and then you'd need at least 2 20amp small applicance circuits with GFCI protection.

Is there a sink or a stove or anything?
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Old 06-23-2009, 10:50 AM   #20
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Yes - only 60a available at the sub
This is based on breaker in the main panel 1st, sub 2nd
But that's 60a 240v
So if you are using mostly 120v that's quite a lot




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Old 06-23-2009, 10:59 AM   #21
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not really worried about codes just the right/safe way. i realize they maybe one and the same. there will prob. one day be a small sink out there.
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Old 06-23-2009, 11:44 AM   #22
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not really worried about codes just the right/safe way. i realize they maybe one and the same. there will prob. one day be a small sink out there.
Well, consider putting one outlet without GFCI for the fridge and then make the rest of them in the bar area GFCI. It's probably a concrete floor and maybe damp... so GFCi is a good idea.
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Old 06-23-2009, 12:26 PM   #23
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not really worried about codes just the right/safe way. i realize they maybe one and the same. there will prob. one day be a small sink out there.
Right and safe equals the NEC code. It is the bare minimum. You can enhance the requirements but you cannot disregard any of it. It's designed to keep you from burning down your house or structure.
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Old 06-23-2009, 12:28 PM   #24
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Right and safe equals the NEC code. It is the bare minimum. You can enhance the requirements but you cannot disregard any of it. It's designed to keep you from burning down your house or structure.
Heh how can you say that with a straight face after just telling someone that you'd take out an AFCI without blinking?

I mean I know where you are coming from, 99% of the code is there for a very good and well thought out reason. It's not the gospel though.
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Old 06-23-2009, 12:34 PM   #25
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Yeah, but AFCI's really suck in some cases
At least GFCI has been around for a while now



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Old 06-23-2009, 03:04 PM   #26
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sorry to get in the middle of your qualms boys. but this is just a little shop/bar probably 300 sq. ft. total. i realize that doesnt make a difference. i want to do things the right way. and i would like to do it all myself if possible. i have no problems when asking for help when i am in over my head. thats why i am thankful for you guys. just a young man trying to learn lessons for a lifetime. the reason i am reduing the main input line is b/c the guys who took down my pine tree and then grinded my stump hit the main line. there were also my friends so i cut them a break and told them i would take care of it esp. b/c i didnt know where the line was myself. dumb move i know. its over and done with now on with it. this was all done before i bought the house a year ago. everything was up to snuff and worked great just want to fix it, make it right and renovate a little to make it my own. so if the right way is by the code so be it. but if most of you, whom seem like professionals can point me in the right directions of trying to do this on my own i reall appreciate it. again i will continue to take all matters of advice. thank yall a whole bunch.
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Old 06-23-2009, 03:26 PM   #27
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how many circuts can i have off of 60a? for example just a shot in the dark here could i have 2 or 3 20a for outlets, 30a for a window unit, 20a for all the lights ? i am asking b/c i still dont grasp the concept of what a full 60a provides and means to me.
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Old 06-23-2009, 04:14 PM   #28
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You can have as many circuits as you can fit in the panel
You can only use a total of 60a of power 240v
If only using all 120v that would equal about 120a IF balanced across the 2 hots. If either hot surpasses 60a 120v then the breaker will kick off



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Old 06-23-2009, 04:43 PM   #29
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Remember that days of old, houses were wired with 60 amps total, so you have plenty of power for a 300 square foot shed.
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Old 06-23-2009, 04:59 PM   #30
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As an example you could have

30 240cv AC running
20a of lights (that's alot of light)
20a outlet using the full 20a
a 2nd 20a circuit outlet using the full 20a
(or 4 20a circuits using 10a of power each)

That would equal about 60a of 240v power
As long as it was balanced across the 2 hots
That's a lot of power

The limiting factor is the 60a 240v breaker and how many circuits you can fit in the panel



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