Rewiring And Extending A Circuit, But Leaving An Old Branch - Electrical - DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum
Advertisement


Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > Electrical

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes
Old 08-12-2014, 12:50 AM   #1
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 410
Rewards Points: 637
Default

Rewiring and extending a circuit, but leaving an old branch


Hello,

I have a 1955 house with some old and some newer circuits. I'd like to rewire one of them, because the particular one doesn't have ground, and I need an extra receptacle with grounding.

Now here is the problem: the furnace room lights are on this circuit: they're branched off at box. I want to leave that part of the circuit alone, mostly because it would be very difficult to rewire it without disturbing some asbestos tape. But the branch is not grounded, and has some (currently) illegal exposed wiring in the furnace room (stapled to the bottom of joist while running perpendicular to them), so it's certainly not up to code. But it may have been when it was built - for all I know that circuit may be 60 years old.

Is this allowed? All the new work would be up to code, but I would leave that branch as it is. It's just two lights. We are on NEC 2014 and AFAIK there are no local rules. I tried to talk to the city inspector, but I just got his voice mail and he didn't return my call.

Thanks in advance,
csab_ is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 08-12-2014, 02:07 AM   #2
UAW SKILLED TRADES
 
Stubbie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Kansas
Posts: 5,341
Rewards Points: 2,652
Default


You can extend ungrounded circuits if the extension and receptacle meet these requirements

(C) Nongrounding Receptacle Replacement or Branch
Circuit Extensions.
The equipment grounding conductor

of a grounding-type receptacle or a branch-circuit extension
shall be permitted to be connected to any of the following:
(1) Any accessible point on the grounding electrode system
as described in 250.50
(2) Any accessible point on the grounding electrode conductor
(3) The equipment grounding terminal bar within the enclosure
where the branch circuit for the receptacle or
branch circuit originates
(4) For grounded systems, the grounded service conductor
within the service equipment enclosure
(5) For ungrounded systems, the grounding terminal bar
within the service equipment enclosure
Informational Note: See 406.4(D) for the use of a groundfault
circuit-interrupting type of receptacle.
__________________
" One nice thing about the NEC articles ... you have lots of choices"

Stubbie
Stubbie is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 08-12-2014, 07:02 AM   #3
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Nashua, NH, USA
Posts: 8,707
Rewards Points: 3,020
Default


deleted all;gsfgsfdh,mvcm
__________________
Stop some of your bank autopayments so you can set priorities for manual monthly payments out of your coronavirus stimulus check.

Last edited by AllanJ; 08-12-2014 at 07:10 AM.
AllanJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 08-12-2014, 07:08 AM   #4
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Nashua, NH, USA
Posts: 8,707
Rewards Points: 3,020
Default


The remains of an old (ungrounded) branch circuit may be tied into a new branch circuit after its portion continuing upstream to the panel had been decommissioned.

An old branch circuit may be upgraded piecemeal in any sequence, but 3 prong receptacles may not be substituted beyond where new up to date upstream wiring from the panel reaches except according to the paragraphs of code above.

No extensions may be made to the remains of an old ungrounded portion even if ground fault circuit interrupter protection or retrofitted separately run equipment grounding conductors were installed.

The presence of a wired-in old subcircuit on an otherwise new or upgraded branch circuit does not impose additional restrictions on construction of or additions to the new wiring except as pertaining to overall expected load on the entire circuit.
__________________
Stop some of your bank autopayments so you can set priorities for manual monthly payments out of your coronavirus stimulus check.

Last edited by AllanJ; 08-12-2014 at 07:31 AM.
AllanJ is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to AllanJ For This Useful Post:
csab_ (08-12-2014)
Old 08-12-2014, 09:04 AM   #5
UAW SKILLED TRADES
 
Stubbie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Kansas
Posts: 5,341
Rewards Points: 2,652
Default




Allowed installation by the NEC, gfci is not allowed last I read the code to extend the circuit. It is allowed for existing circuits but not extensions to the best of my knowledge.
__________________
" One nice thing about the NEC articles ... you have lots of choices"

Stubbie
Stubbie is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Stubbie For This Useful Post:
csab_ (08-12-2014)
Old 08-12-2014, 09:52 AM   #6
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 410
Rewards Points: 637
Default


Thanks! You guys don't disagree. Stubbie explained how it is possible to replace a receptacle on an ungrounded circuit with a grounded one. You agree that the ungrounded piece may not be extended. And AllanJ gave me the positive answer I was looking for!

To make it more clear: (1) the circuit goes from the panel to a box (2) from that box to the lights (3) from the same box to some receptacles.

I will replace (1) and (3) with grounded NM cable, bring it up to code, and install an additional grounded receptacle on piece (3). I will leave (2) alone, and I will not extend that part either.
csab_ is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to csab_ For This Useful Post:
Stubbie (08-12-2014)
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Replacing wiring in middle of run, ungrounded lighting circuit alexz Electrical 3 07-05-2007 08:53 PM




Top of Page | View New Posts