Generator To Mains - Electrical - DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum
Advertisement


Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > Electrical

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes
Old 02-13-2010, 03:43 AM   #1
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1
Rewards Points: 10
Default

generator to mains


hi there i have been searching for an answer to these question but cant really find a straight answer.

if i had a generator in my home and made a male to male plug and plug this into an outlet in my home, would this supply power to the rest of my home? even if i shut of the main switch at my breaker box

if i shut of the mains switch at my breaker box would this then prevent power from getting outside my home? so not to electocute anyone working on the line during a power outtage

also if i had a homemade alternator/generator, like completely homemade not just a modified car alternator, would an electrician hook this up to my mains the legal way? or would it need some kind of certification?

thanks
burphur is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 02-13-2010, 05:22 AM   #2
Inspector/Instructor
 
codeone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: NC
Posts: 369
Rewards Points: 250
Default


Quote:
Originally Posted by burphur View Post
hi there i have been searching for an answer to these question but cant really find a straight answer.

if i had a generator in my home and made a male to male plug and plug this into an outlet in my home, would this supply power to the rest of my home? even if i shut of the main switch at my breaker box


thanks
This is called a DEADMANS plug! It is very dangerous! DO NOT USE!
codeone is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 02-13-2010, 06:07 AM   #3
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 3,118
Rewards Points: 2,000
Default


Technically, that works, but is unreliable, since humans are quite falible. Having a hot plug with exposed terminals is not a good idea. And not having an auto switch panel is also not good practice, and in many areas, not even allowed.
Just Bill is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 02-13-2010, 06:18 AM   #4
Licensed Electrical Cont.
 
Speedy Petey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: NY State
Posts: 7,828
Rewards Points: 2,006
Default


Quote:
Originally Posted by burphur View Post
hi there i have been searching for an answer to these question but cant really find a straight answer


if i had a generator in my home and made a male to male plug and plug this into an outlet in my home, would this supply power to the rest of my home? even if i shut of the main switch at my breaker box

if i shut of the mains switch at my breaker box would this then prevent power from getting outside my home? so not to electocute anyone working on the line during a power outtage.
Seriously?
This is one of the most discussed topics with regard to generators. It is also highly illegal and dangerous, and any valid electrical forum you go to you will get this reply.




Quote:
Originally Posted by burphur View Post
also if i had a homemade alternator/generator, like completely homemade not just a modified car alternator, would an electrician hook this up to my mains the legal way?
Even here you admit that you are aware that it is illegal.



PLEASE do NOT even consider an illegal generator backfeed!
Speedy Petey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2010, 07:18 AM   #5
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: north carolina
Posts: 34
Rewards Points: 25
Default


bur--get a transfer panel installed

as far as building a generator--dollar for dollar I don't think you could build one for the price and quality of a commercially made product.
daddyrabbit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2010, 08:04 AM   #6
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Nashua, NH, USA
Posts: 8,597
Rewards Points: 2,800
Default


The transfer switching must be so constructed so that no sequence of maneuvers can possibly result in generator power going out the service wires and onto the utility lines.

One thing I would consider is moving some important circuits to a subpanel under the main panel and the transfer switch disconnects the subpanel from the main panel and connects the subpanel only to a cord and plug. The latter can be plugged into any kind of generator, even a home built one.
__________________
Stick to your lawn watering schedule until it really starts to pour. After the storm you have only the same number of rest days you always had and then you need to start watering again.

Last edited by AllanJ; 02-13-2010 at 08:15 AM.
AllanJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2010, 08:18 AM   #7
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 719
Rewards Points: 500
Default


No Way, Only a setup with a transfer switch shall be used for this.

Don't even try it.
SULTINI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2010, 08:33 AM   #8
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: South of Boston, MA
Posts: 17,248
Rewards Points: 2,000
Default


What you are considering doing is illegal & dangerous

You need a panel/breaker setup with a gen lockout
OR
A transfer setup

Most service feeds are setup so that the main breaker will kill all power
But not ALL are setup this way

You will be held responsible if your connection hurts or kills a lineman working on the wires
Your power back feeds the transformer on the pole & then steps up your voltage to lethal amounts

Your main breaker only disconnects the Hots, not the neutral



Scuba_Dave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2010, 10:49 AM   #9
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,109
Rewards Points: 308
Default


Look at this. www.interlockkit.com.
J. V. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2010, 11:30 AM   #10
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: SoCal
Posts: 1,802
Rewards Points: 1,016
Default


You MUST install a panel/breaker setup with a gen lockout OR a transfer setup - I installed a 30 amp inlet to connect my generator and a panal interlock from www.interlockkit.com. Relatively inexpensive, pretty simple to install, easy to use (even for my wife if I am traveling), and SAFE.
vsheetz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2010, 05:58 PM   #11
" Euro " electrician
 
frenchelectrican's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: WI & France { in France for now }
Posts: 5,369
Rewards Points: 2,000
Default


Quote:
Originally Posted by burphur View Post
hi there i have been searching for an answer to these question but cant really find a straight answer.

if i had a generator in my home and made a male to male plug and plug this into an outlet in my home, would this supply power to the rest of my home? even if i shut of the main switch at my breaker box

if i shut of the mains switch at my breaker box would this then prevent power from getting outside my home? so not to electocute anyone working on the line during a power outtage

also if i had a homemade alternator/generator, like completely homemade not just a modified car alternator, would an electrician hook this up to my mains the legal way? or would it need some kind of certification?

thanks
This part of question do show up many fourms and let me tell you simple answer is .,,


NE LE FAITES PAS!!!

Basically it the same as DO NOT DO THIS

It is there for very good darn reason I have see too many dangerous set up so please do it in safe legal way

Merci,Marc
frenchelectrican is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2010, 11:10 PM   #12
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Alabama
Posts: 608
Rewards Points: 500
Default


Just to pile on...

Quote:
Originally Posted by burphur View Post
if i had a generator in my home and made a male to male plug and plug...
That's all I had to read to be able to answer "DON'T DO IT".


As I understand it, the only legal and safe way to connect a generator to your home wiring is a transfer switch. Yes, these switches can cost as much as a cheap generator, but that's the simple fact.
HooKooDooKu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2010, 11:34 PM   #13
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Alabama
Posts: 608
Rewards Points: 500
Default


OK, for fun, I went back and read the rest of the post... and I'm afraid the rest of it is flawed just as well...

First of all, it's already been pointed out that humans are flawed. What you propose requires about three or fourkey things be done in a very specific order. If that order is not maintains, disaster could follow.

The next problem, and it still points to the flaws of humans, if you went ahead and tried to use a generator this way, you run the risk of basically killing the generator when someone in the house forgets the lights are out and trys turning on too many things. And given that we've all had a situation where the power is out, walking through the house with a flash light, we walk into a room and flip the light switch (come on, who hasn't done this at least once in your life). The potential is even greater of that occuring because your house has power.

When you have a transfer switch, this particular problem can be elliminated. The reason is because what you do is pick just a few key circuits to be powered through the transfer switch. So to avoid over powering the generator, you limit the circuits on the transfer switch to only those the generator can handle.

The other problem would be that you would now be attempting to power your whole house throught the single wire (likely only 14 guage wire) that leads from the outlet to the panel. If you're lucky, that means you would be limited to 15 amps to power your whole house. If you're unlucky, the circuit breaker doesn't trip or you rig a bypass, and suddenly you're dumping 2 to 10 times more current than the circuit was designed for.

Finally, on the issue of a homemade generator. The only way a certified electrician is going to connect a generator of ANY sort up to your house wiring is through a transfer switch. There are plenty of transfer switches that are designed to plug into a portable generator via a locking 4 prong extension cord. So you should have no problem getting an electrician to install a transfer switch since his liability ends at the extension cord. Where you plug the cord in becomes your business and your liability.
HooKooDooKu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2010, 10:45 AM   #14
Newbie
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 18
Rewards Points: 10
Default


I istalled the interlock kit in my home & highly recommend it, it`s safe easy to use & provides the most flexibility you can pic & choose which circuits to power on your main & even A subpanel.
journeymanj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2010, 11:43 AM   #15
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,109
Rewards Points: 308
Default


Quote:
Originally Posted by HooKooDooKu View Post
OK, for fun, I went back and read the rest of the post... and I'm afraid the rest of it is flawed just as well...

Posting to any thread without reading the complete thread is not a good idea. I know, because I have done it before and paid dearly.

The next problem, and it still points to the flaws of humans, if you went ahead and tried to use a generator this way, you run the risk of basically killing the generator when someone in the house forgets the lights are out and trys turning on too many things. And given that we've all had a situation where the power is out, walking through the house with a flash light, we walk into a room and flip the light switch (come on, who hasn't done this at least once in your life). The potential is even greater of that occuring because your house has power.

All UL listed generators have breakers. Breakers are used to shut off power when a circuit is overloaded or short circuited. You are way off in your comments.
If you overload the generator, all that happens is the generator breaker trips and you reset it.

I do not install interlock kits for the elderly, disabled or people that cannot manage their household loads.

When you have a transfer switch, this particular problem can be elliminated. The reason is because what you do is pick just a few key circuits to be powered through the transfer switch. So to avoid over powering the generator, you limit the circuits on the transfer switch to only those the generator can handle.

Just because you have a ATS, does not mean someone cannot plug in to many items on the same circuit and trip the breaker in the ATS panel.


The other problem would be that you would now be attempting to power your whole house throught the single wire (likely only 14 guage wire) that leads from the outlet to the panel. If you're lucky, that means you would be limited to 15 amps to power your whole house. If you're unlucky, the circuit breaker doesn't trip or you rig a bypass, and suddenly you're dumping 2 to 10 times more current than the circuit was designed for.

Do you understand how a interlock kit is installed? The wire and breaker are sized to the generator output current. Mine is on a 30 amp breaker with #8 THHN conductors. I can run plenty things from my generator, including the water heater.

Finally, on the issue of a homemade generator. The only way a certified electrician is going to connect a generator of ANY sort up to your house wiring is through a transfer switch. There are plenty of transfer switches that are designed to plug into a portable generator via a locking 4 prong extension cord. So you should have no problem getting an electrician to install a transfer switch since his liability ends at the extension cord. Where you plug the cord in becomes your business and your liability.
Don't be silly. I am a licensed electrical contractor and master. I have installed several interlock kits for customers and have one in my own house. I would rather sell them an expensive ATS, but I try to be as honest as I can and give them this option.
The interlock is an inexpensive and safe alternative to an ATS. But it's not for everyone.



Last edited by J. V.; 02-14-2010 at 11:47 AM.
J. V. is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Summer House Electrics stu_bill Electrical 9 07-31-2008 10:17 AM
Air in mains water [email protected] Plumbing 1 01-26-2008 02:40 PM
80 leds for led light. can i run to 230v mains donnol1983 Electrical 8 12-27-2007 06:23 PM
3 way switch and burnt mains tke402 Electrical 7 10-24-2007 09:18 AM
replacing mains wire elementx440 Electrical 3 05-09-2007 08:29 PM




Top of Page | View New Posts