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Old 07-08-2018, 09:13 PM   #1
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Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?


Team DIY,

Looking for some validation on a plan to extend my Stove-Top feed about 15 feet. I am near to quietly call an electrician, but would rather not watch him do what I was going to do anyway, or something less. Here goes...

Stove-Top fed by 6 gauge aluminum, two conductor wire plus a bare ground. The 6 gauge alum was wire-nut to stove-top copper wire inside a junction box under stove (connection didn't look very good and no goop for a Al/Cu
-20years!).

Plan-A was to run a new 6/3 copper line, but the route is extremely problematic.

Plan B became: splice aluminum to aluminum 6 gauge in the crawl-space then run to a receptacle under stove-top inside cabinet - add a plug to Stove-top thereby avoiding the direct Alum to Copper problem.

My questions/concern center around the Au wire splice and junction box. First, I plan to use a barrel-splice for both conductors and ground using the antioxidant goop, and being careful with the Au wire. Will heat-shrink the barrel splice then wrap in elect tape. How does this splice sound?

Next, I just realized that a 4 11/16", and deep steel junction box is nowhere big enough. So I am about to go look for a really big junction box, maybe 8"x8" or bigger. It will be in the crawl space. If I use a steel box, do I need to ground it? Would a plastic or PVC box be better?

OR should I just suck-it-up and call an electrician?

Any (credible) advice appreciated -

Thanks DIYers,
Scott
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Old 07-08-2018, 09:31 PM   #2
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Re: Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?


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Originally Posted by flynscott View Post
Team DIY,



OR should I just suck-it-up and call an electrician?

Any (credible) advice appreciated -

Thanks DIYers,
Scott

I would just call an electrician for this project. I would NOT use aluminum wiring inside the house for anything, much less splice it. I would remove all of it, and run a new length of 6-3 Romex to your new range outlet, and power it with a 50A breaker.
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Old 07-09-2018, 05:50 AM   #3
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Re: Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?


Your existing 3 wire connection no longer meets code and can not be extended or modified. Run a new copper 6/3 or 8/3 cable.

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Old 07-09-2018, 06:10 AM   #4
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Re: Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?


What they say.

You are risking a catastrophe, and insurance don't cover a disaster possibly caused by a code violation.

A licensed electrician is cheap compared to a house fire.


ED
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Old 07-09-2018, 07:37 AM   #5
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Re: Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?


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Your existing 3 wire connection no longer meets code and can not be extended or modified. Run a new copper 6/3 or 8/3 cable.

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Not necessarily. He is installing a 'stove top' not a range. The stove top might only need 240 volts. It might not need a neutral.

If the stove top requires a neutral then extending the three wire is a code issue.
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Old 07-09-2018, 07:42 AM   #6
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Re: Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?


Is the stove top 120/240 or just 240 volts? What was the old breaker size and what do you need for the new unit?
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Old 07-09-2018, 08:31 AM   #7
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Re: Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?


It is likely not aluminum wire. Probably tinned copper.
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Old 07-09-2018, 11:05 AM   #8
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Re: Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?


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It is likely not aluminum wire. Probably tinned copper.
It sounds to me he is describing SE cable (or 2 wire NM). They would not have tinned wire. If it is NM it only would be compliant for a 240 only device.


"Stove-Top fed by 6 gauge aluminum, two conductor wire plus a bare ground."
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Old 07-09-2018, 02:26 PM   #9
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Re: Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?


Thanks for the replies, Team DIY.

From the install guide (attached)(KitchenAid Model KECD866R)(pic) "A four-wire or three-wire, single-phase, 240-volt, 60-Hz, AC-only electrical
supply is required on a separate
30-ampere circuit, fused on both sides
of the line." One of the stickers says "copper-only" but the wires off the stove themselves don't appear to be copper. (pic)

It is on a dual-pole 40 amp breaker. The feed wire is AWG-6 stranded aluminum. (pic)

The house was built in 1994 in Camas WA. Only the stove-top, oven, and dryer have this type of wire - all else is copper.

I have called a couple of electricians who just said "splice it", and didn't seem too concerned.

I know that running a new wire would solve all of these questions, but the route is problematic. The routing of all feeds in this house are from the box in garage with concrete floor (no crawl-space). It is as far as possible away from the crawl-space in the house. All feeds go up through the wall (tightly and stapled every few feet), through the upper floor wall and into the attic near the eaves with about 6 inches of head-space. There is zero access to get above the wall that drops to the box without tearing up the roof.

What do you think about this type of wire run as an alternative - along ceiling of garage (ceiling is sheet-rock)and mostly behind a beam. Then once across the three car garage, dive down the wall then side step through the wall to finally get to the crawl space?

Any cautions, code you are aware of that prevent 6/3 from being exposed like that? PVC conduit perhaps?

Thanks again for your replies - this relatively new form of learning (forums) has really been a game-changer for me in a variety of projects - cars mostly.

Cheers
Attached Thumbnails
Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?-awg-6-al.jpg   Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?-stovetop-placard.jpg   Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?-stovetop-sticker.jpg   Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?-stovetop-wires-out.jpg   Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?-stranded-alum-wire-feed.jpg  

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Old 07-09-2018, 05:15 PM   #10
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Re: Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?


I believe the wires from the cooktop are tinned copper. The #6 cable is definitely aluminum.



Whether or not you can splice the cable in this case depends on your local AHJ. Some may allow it, some won't.



If you do splice the cable, a Polaris connector is a nice one to use. It's small and fully insulated and makes joining the wires a snap. They also fit easily in a 4" or 4-11/16" junction box. The one negative about the Polaris is that's it's expensive.
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Old 07-09-2018, 05:36 PM   #11
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Re: Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?


Your feed is AL 6/2 SE Type cable. Since your cook top is straight 240 you can extend and reuse that cabling. I would extend with a section of 8/2 NM (Romex) cable. Splice the SE to the NM in a 4" box using Polaris connectors. The cook top wires are tinned copper and can be spliced to the NM using standard wire nuts.

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Old 07-09-2018, 05:58 PM   #12
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Re: Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?


The breaker will need to be changed from a 40 to a 30 amp per the instruction.
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Old 07-09-2018, 07:19 PM   #13
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Re: Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?


Thanks again, DIYers-

Here goes:

For the extension: I have both 6/3 AL wire and 8/2 copper for the extension. think I will use the 6/3 AL in order to match metal types and cap the white/neutral.

For the splice: I have three robust barrel splices, heat shrink and tape. I will either find a large jbox to house it in, or find Polaris connectors and see if I can use my existing 4 11/16" jbox. Plenty of antioxidant goop.

For the connection to stove: If I use the 6/3 AL extension, will terminate at a receptacle, add plug to stove with the tinned copper. That way I avoid direct contact with the dissimilar metals (?). If I use the copper extension, will connect it with wire nuts in existing box.

For the breaker, decrease to a 30 AMP dual pole.

Finally, within two years the kitchen gets remodeled anyway with a gas stove top - won't need the feed anymore. If I get bored before then, will re-run a 6/3 copper through the garage. Even if don't use it ery long, it will be there for the next guy.


There. What do you think?

Thanks
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Old 07-09-2018, 08:40 PM   #14
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Re: Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?


You will not find aluminum rated wire nuts for the #6 or 8.
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Old 07-09-2018, 08:53 PM   #15
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Re: Extend Stove-Top, AWG-6 Aluminum splice? JBox?


Only need #10 Cu for 30A.
Polaris connectors are fine. The barrel lugs in the pic below also do the
job. Available at HD for a few bucks for a 2 pack. Use with shrink tube.
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